no sex? no food!

[Father Heathen]

The pic in your signature.... is that a baby getting shot in the throat with an arrow?

 

[.lava]

I understand what you mean. And as I said in my previous post, monsters are monsters, no matter what religion they follow. But I think that when you twist religious beliefs, the followers of that religion (the ones who are abusive themselves) tend to follow with a fanaticism that you wouldn't see with a government system that didn't include religion.
Just my opinion, though

imo social 'level' of Western nations are not same with the Eastern ones. those fanatics have control over society because society is poor, uneducated and helpless. these men have physical power, they have guns. ever since this bigotry took over, it continues. it was not like this before. Westrn nations and societies are different because they have power over their governments. they are educated and they are aware of their rights. they did not have them before. to me, there is no difference if Western government men wear nice clothes, speak good English, and he is educated...or they do not show what they truly are to their public and they do terrible things without letting public know about it...it is just a strategy that they developed. fanatic religious today do not need that kind of strategy because they alreay have power over people. i do understand what you are saying but i believe each nation has its own conditions and those men in power would find a prope way to gain power and they do. it is like same scenario all over on a different stage. same game, same result.





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[.lava]

I have no trust on what the media say about Afghanistan.
The media misinterpret everything there.

as long as their troops stay there they would need more and more stuff like this. so their public would back them up for being there "helping" Muslims aka bringing democracy as they did in Iraq. but that does not mean women are not suffering from injustice. everyone is. nobody talks about million of Afghans who left their home because of troops, they live in tents no water...etc...cos that does not really serve Western governments. noone talks about how come ophium business did reach its peak in entire history of Afhanistan after invasion of USA (and others) who is taking the money that comes from ophium?






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[.lava]

The pic in your signature.... is that a baby getting shot in the throat with an arrow?

if i am not mistaken that baby represents grandson of Muhammed (PBUH) who got killed by Muslims after departure of the last Prophet.





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[linwood]

I haven`t read through this thread but my wife read the article in the OP and mentioned that it seems to her that they`ve managed to turn the "sacred" relationship of marriage into a relationship of prostitution.

I thought prostitution was a sin in Islam?

 

[.lava]

I haven`t read through this thread but my wife read the article in the OP and mentioned that it seems to her that they`ve managed to turn the "sacred" relationship of marriage into a relationship of prostitution.

I thought prostitution was a sin in Islam?

yes, it is a sin. imo your wife is right. marriage is supposed to be sacred. there is no reasonable explaination for this.




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[Stellify]

imo social 'level' of Western nations are not same with the Eastern ones. those fanatics have control over society because society is poor, uneducated and helpless. these men have physical power, they have guns. ever since this bigotry took over, it continues. it was not like this before. Westrn nations and societies are different because they have power over their governments. they are educated and they are aware of their rights. they did not have them before. to me, there is no difference if Western government men wear nice clothes, speak good English, and he is educated...or they do not show what they truly are to their public and they do terrible things without letting public know about it...it is just a strategy that they developed. fanatic religious today do not need that kind of strategy because they alreay have power over people. i do understand what you are saying but i believe each nation has its own conditions and those men in power would find a prope way to gain power and they do. it is like same scenario all over on a different stage. same game, same result.





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Hmm...I guess I am perhaps just more saddened when I see something like religion, which has potential for such beauty and goodness, brought down to such a low level.
But you're right, it's just as bad otherwise.

as long as their troops stay there they would need more and more stuff like this. so their public would back them up for being there "helping" Muslims aka bringing democracy as they did in Iraq. but that does not mean women are not suffering from injustice. everyone is. nobody talks about million of Afghans who left their home because of troops, they live in tents no water...etc...cos that does not really serve Western governments. noone talks about how come ophium business did reach its peak in entire history of Afhanistan after invasion of USA (and others) who is taking the money that comes from ophium?






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Honestly, I don't trust the media here in the US....neither do many of my friends. Especially on things having to do with the various wars going on. It's just not a reliable or trustworthy source anymore

 

[Vile Atheist]

as long as their troops stay there they would need more and more stuff like this. so their public would back them up for being there "helping" Muslims aka bringing democracy as they did in Iraq. but that does not mean women are not suffering from injustice. everyone is. nobody talks about million of Afghans who left their home because of troops, they live in tents no water...etc...cos that does not really serve Western governments. noone talks about how come ophium business did reach its peak in entire history of Afhanistan after invasion of USA (and others) who is taking the money that comes from ophium?

Not entirely true. The opium business is talked about a LOT in Canada.

 

[.lava]

Not entirely true. The opium business is talked about a LOT in Canada.

wanna piece of me? fine...

i am not talking about Canada. also ophium business is known everywhere but it is not reminded to public. media pulls attention of their public to certain issues like the one in OP. certain stuff that would make public feel better or they would find some humane reason for their troops to be there. those men who's cruel to to Afghan people are the same people USA gave millions of dollars to make them have power. women were still oppressed that time. but media never mentioned it because their governments were supporting them. now they do not. i find it funny that citizens of Western nation would never question that. this news might be correct so i do respect people are giving reaction to crulty and oppression. but they do not see they are abused by their governments. it is very ironic that those people who they stand against do have power thanks to some Western government. where were their media while Western governments gave them guns? why would not they question that?







.

 

[Vile Atheist]

wanna piece of me? fine...

i am not talking about Canada. also ophium business is known everywhere but it is not reminded to public. media pulls attention of their public to certain issues like the one in OP. certain stuff that would make public feel better or they would find some humane reason for their troops to be there. those men who's cruel to to Afghan people are the same people USA gave millions of dollars to make them have power. women were still oppressed that time. but media never mentioned it because their governments were supporting them. now they do not. i find it funny that citizens of Western nation would never question that. this news might be correct so i do respect people are giving reaction to crulty and oppression. but they do not see they are abused by their governments. it is very ironic that those people who they stand against do have power thanks to some Western government. where were their media while Western governments gave them guns? why would not they question that?

No, I don't want a "piece" of you...

All political parties here talk very much about Afghanistan and the opium business frequently comes up. That's why they're trying to figure out how to offer poor opium farmers an alternative so they can still make money, without supporting the Taliban and fueling drug problems here.

 

[Stellify]

i find it funny that citizens of Western nation would never question that. this news might be correct so i do respect people are giving reaction to crulty and oppression. but they do not see they are abused by their governments. it is very ironic that those people who they stand against do have power thanks to some Western government. where were their media while Western governments gave them guns? why would not they question that?




.

Many of us do question it, and many of us have started going to other sources for our news because we recognize that our own press is getting more and more ridiculous.
So please don't think badly of all of us
:flower:

 

[Vile Atheist]

Many of us do question it, and many of us have started going to other sources for our news because we recognize that our own press is getting more and more ridiculous.
So please don't think badly of all of us
:flower:

Exactly. It's not uncommon for people to try and look at many different news sources to try and get a full picture.

I stopped watching CNN because it was just getting ridiculous.

 

[.lava]

Many of us do question it, and many of us have started going to other sources for our news because we recognize that our own press is getting more and more ridiculous.
So please don't think badly of all of us
:flower:

oh no, i do not think 'badly' about citizens, really. but my reaction would remain as long as people keep on trusting their leaders and media who fooled them once. as a result many Muslims died. therefor i find it ironic.





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[Vile Atheist]

oh no, i do not think 'badly' about citizens, really. but my reaction would remain as long as people keep on trusting their leaders and media who fooled them once. as a result many Muslims died. therefor i find it ironic.

Well that's good. There are many of us who oppose what our governments do.

 

[.lava]

Well that's good. There are many of us who oppose what our governments do.

so those who bring negative actions of Muslims to the attention of public aka who's actually doing the exact thing that their media does are unknowingly serving their governments?




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[Stellify]

Well that's good. There are many of us who oppose what our governments do.

*nod*

 

[Vile Atheist]

so those who bring negative actions of Muslims to the attention of public aka who's actually doing the exact thing that their media does are unknowingly serving their governments?

Yes and no.

There are some actions committed by some Muslims that we must condemn, such as the torturing and killing of gays in Iraq, for example.

But there are also some actions committed by - say - the US military like bombing the homes of innocent people which also must be condemned.

When we condemn either, we are not "serving" anyone. Trust me, our media broadcasts crimes committed by the military too. That's why there is such opposition to Guantanamo Bay and Abu Ghraib and other similar facilities. That's why the US bombing of the Al-Shifa pharmaceutical plant in Sudan was so heavily condemned. We are not blind sheep.

Edit: I guess I should finish that thought lol. So no, we do not directly "serve" our governments and media in that sense.

But it has the indirect effect - when some atrocity is committed by a group of Muslims - of legitimizing some atrocity committed by the military, which is obviously a horrible thing. But this only happens in the minds of a few people. Most North Americans and Europeans are anti-war.

 

[Yerda]

Yes. They even stone rape victims to death for "adultery". And the funny thing is, there are people here on RF who will actually accuse you of racism for denouncing such cultural practices.

Can you name them?

 

[Shia Islam]

Father Heathen &

if i am not mistaken that baby represents grandson of Muhammed (PBUH) who got killed by Muslims after departure of the last Prophet.





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Exactly. The picture showing Imam Hussain, the grandson of the prophet (p), with his baby during the karbala tragedian event. The baby was deliberately killed, as the aim was to end the prophet family who refused to recognise the system.

The bright history about the Caliphate era is a BIG lie!
Sorry for deviating from the thread topic.

 

[.lava]

Father Heathen &



Exactly. The picture showing Imam Hussain, the grandson of the prophet (p), with his baby during the karbala tragedian event. The baby was deliberately killed, as the aim was to end the prophet family who refused to recognise the system.

The bright history about the Caliphate era is a BIG lie!
Sorry for deviating from the thread topic.

but it was not Hilafahs who killed him.




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