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Noahs Ark

Dirty Penguin

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
darkendless said:
In mechanics the other day we were talking about this. Supplies would have to be flown inn, because theres no way in hell you could secure a bridge or anything of the sort to the *giant boat.* The torsional forces would be in the Giga Newtons at least on any ties/bridges attached to it. The boat itself would resonate at the frequency of the waves. At a certain frequency catastrophic stress would be applied to to the boat causing it to bend in the centre far beyond its yield stress which = fail.

Technology today isn't capable of doing such a thing, well not a whole city anyway. The cost efficiency would be about 0.00000000000000000000000001% which in terms of engineering economics is unthinkable.
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You're correct. They were demonstrating how it would break in the center. Now I know "Noah's" boat was nowhere as big as a city but as you pointed out....the same rules of physics would apply to his smaller (wooden) boat. His boat would have been huge in order to house the various animals (I'm assuming he couldn't get EVERY species of animal, plant, insect etc. on that boat which poses a set of other problems).....The boat, assuming it was large enough for a few different types of animals etc. would take a crew working around the clock to maintain it internally to try and prevent disease and death.

You're correct. Considereing the dietary habbits of certain animals he'd have to have compensated for this and had supplies, in abundance, for them. (example)...since he had no refrigeration how did he feed the meat eaters on the boat(?).....

additianally, with a wooden boat in the sea like this it would be subject to the conditions of the sea water eating or rotting away the wood. How was this handled(?)
 
sandy whitelinger

sandy whitelinger

Veteran Member
painted wolf said:
here's a question... that article says that Noah only had to take two of each 'kind'... so only two dogs had to go and we would get all the varieties of canids we have today. (from foxes to wolves)

But then it says that Noah wouldn't have to take any of the whales or dolphin species....
So how does that work?
How did the 40 odd species of 'dog kind' evolve from just two dogs... yet all the 'whale kind' didn't do any evolving at all...

Why would 'dog kind' have to churn out a new species every couple of litters but whales have stayed just as they are since day one?

wa:do
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That whole "kind" thingiee is a bit ambiguous, eh? Perhaps you are trying too hard to justify the natural world and the spiritual world.
 
Autodidact

Autodidact

Intentionally Blank
O.K. Now for the moment, we'll set aside the plants--that's a whole other discussion. We'll just talk animals. Right now there are about 12 million known species on earth, and we assume millions more not yet discovered (and around ten times that many extinct.) I don't know how many are land organisms, but say roughly half, that's 6 million, and again, I don't know, but if around half of those are animals, that would be--very roughly--3 million species. So what you're saying is that in the last 10,000 or less years, 20,000 species have evolved into around 3 million species? That is, over 2 million species have come into existence in 10,000 years, or over 200 per year, every year? Does that all sound right to you?
 
painted wolf

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
additianally, with a wooden boat in the sea like this it would be subject to the conditions of the sea water eating or rotting away the wood. How was this handled(?)
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Not to mention ship worms, barnacles, isopods, weevels.... and so on and so forth.
All of these would be attacking the ships wooden body and weakening it.

wa:do
 
Kilgore Trout

Kilgore Trout

Misanthropic Humanist
Autodidact said:
O.K. Now for the moment, we'll set aside the plants--that's a whole other discussion. We'll just talk animals. Right now there are about 12 million known species on earth, and we assume millions more not yet discovered (and around ten times that many extinct.) I don't know how many are land organisms, but say roughly half, that's 6 million, and again, I don't know, but if around half of those are animals, that would be--very roughly--3 million species. So what you're saying is that in the last 10,000 or less years, 20,000 species have evolved into around 3 million species? That is, over 2 million species have come into existence in 10,000 years, or over 200 per year, every year? Does that all sound right to you?
Click to expand...

Hey, I just saw a new species of bird evolve outside my window!
 
sandy whitelinger

sandy whitelinger

Veteran Member
Autodidact said:
O.K. Now for the moment, we'll set aside the plants--that's a whole other discussion. We'll just talk animals. Right now there are about 12 million known species on earth, and we assume millions more not yet discovered (and around ten times that many extinct.) I don't know how many are land organisms, but say roughly half, that's 6 million, and again, I don't know, but if around half of those are animals, that would be--very roughly--3 million species. So what you're saying is that in the last 10,000 or less years, 20,000 species have evolved into around 3 million species? That is, over 2 million species have come into existence in 10,000 years, or over 200 per year, every year? Does that all sound right to you?
Click to expand...
It looks like fuzzy math, but it does make one go, "Hmmmm," does it not?
 
painted wolf

painted wolf

Grey Muzzle
That whole "kind" thingiee is a bit ambiguous, eh? Perhaps you are trying too hard to justify the natural world and the spiritual world.
Click to expand...
Quite likely... that's why I don't tend to go for literalist takes on spiritual ideas.

wa:do
 
Autodidact

Autodidact

Intentionally Blank
sandy whitelinger said:
It looks like fuzzy math, but it does make one go, "Hmmmm," does it not?
Click to expand...

Because what you're saying is that no new species evolve, except that they evolve so constantly and frequently that it's a common occurrence. In other words, this position contradicts itself.
 
darkendless

darkendless

Guardian of Asgaard
Dirty Penguin said:
You're correct. They were demonstrating how it would break in the center. Now I know "Noah's" boat was nowhere as big as a city but as you pointed out....the same rules of physics would apply to his smaller (wooden) boat. His boat would have been huge in order to house the various animals (I'm assuming he couldn't get EVERY species of animal, plant, insect etc. on that boat which poses a set of other problems).....The boat, assuming it was large enough for a few different types of animals etc. would take a crew working around the clock to maintain it internally to try and prevent disease and death.

You're correct. Considereing the dietary habbits of certain animals he'd have to have compensated for this and had supplies, in abundance, for them. (example)...since he had no refrigeration how did he feed the meat eaters on the boat(?).....

additianally, with a wooden boat in the sea like this it would be subject to the conditions of the sea water eating or rotting away the wood. How was this handled(?)
Click to expand...
All materials usually break in the centre, or close to it. In the case of wood it maybe different because wood is full of imperfections causing weak spots. Perhaps we should work out a mock size for it and i will do the force calculations for this boat?

A wooden boat at least as big as a football field made of wood would last 10 seconds in turbulent water. Wood with an Elastic Modulus of about 14 GPa in water with a reynolds number of anything 5x10^6 would could great force. I doubt Noah knew he would have to weigh down the ends of his boat in order to offset the forces it would be subjected to.

Back in the day they used to cover boats with pitch. I doubt you could find enough pitch to cover the bottom of a boat the size of a football field.
 
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