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Nonbelievers to Hell!

U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Benoni said:
There is no such place as hell in the original language of the Bible; it was put there by Rome. Yes the wicked will be punished in the lake of fire but god's punishments are not forever and they are corrective in nature.
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Isn't the word hell translated from the Hebrew and Greek words haides and sheol? With the Biblical hell just being the common grave of mankind where Jesus was according to Acts 2vs27,31;Psalm 16v10?

Isn't the definition of the lake of fire: second death? See Rev 20vs13,14.

Death according to Jesus is being in a deep sleep-like state.-John 11vs11-14.
[Ecc9v5; Psalm 6v5;13v3;115v17;146v4; Daniel 12v2,13].
Second death is only different in that there is no resurrection from second death. Even if a person has never died, if Jesus judges that one as worthy of second death they will be destroyed or annihilated forever such as the goat-like ones of Matthew 25v32.
-Psalm 92v7

If punishment is Not forever than how do you explain 2nd Thess 1v9 talking about the punishment being 'everlasting destruction'?

How can the unforgivable sin be forgiven? Matt 12v32; Hebrews 6vs4-6
 
Klaufi_Wodensson

Klaufi_Wodensson

Vinlandic Warrior
I have heard Hell described as a second death. That your soul is thrust into the lake of fire and burned as if a body, and then you are no more. But that is more favourable to me than being in heaven with all the so-called christians of today.
 
U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Klaufi_Wodensson said:
I have heard Hell described as a second death. That your soul is thrust into the lake of fire and burned as if a body, and then you are no more. But that is more favourable to me than being in heaven with all the so-called christians of today.
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There is a different word that is translated as hell or hellfire: Gehenna.
Haides and sheol is not Gehenna.
Gehenna was a garbage dump outside of Jerusalem where things were destroyed and not kept burning forever. So Gehenna [hellfire] is a fitting symbol for destruction.
'Gehenna' is not a forever burning but annihilation.
Psalm [92v7] speaks of the wicked being destroyed or annihilated forever not burning. So second death matches destruction or annihilation because there is no returning or resurrection from Gehenna or second death.- Matt 12v32

Please keep in mind Jesus also held out an earthly hope for people in fulfillment to the promise to Abraham [Gen 12v3;22vs17,18;Rev22v2]
the promise that all families of earth and all nations of earth will be blessed.

Psalm 37vs11,29,38 is where Jesus was referring when he said that humble mind-tempered meek people would inherit the earth.
When we think of an inheritance we think of receiving it after someone is gone. What will be gone according to Scripture is all the wicked.
Proverbs 2 vs21,22; 10v30; Psalm 92v7.

This earthly hope starts for the living sheep-like people of Matthew 25vs31,32 when there will be divine intervention into mankind's affairs by Christ as God's Commander in Chief, so to speak, taking action against the goat-like people that would bring ruin to earth. [Rev 11v18 B; 19 vs11,14,15; Isaiah 11v4]
 
Klaufi_Wodensson

Klaufi_Wodensson

Vinlandic Warrior
URAVIP2ME said:
This earthly hope starts for the living sheep-like people of Matthew 25vs31,32 when there will be divine intervention into mankind's affairs by Christ as God's Commander in Chief, so to speak, taking action against the goat-like people that would bring ruin to earth. [Rev 11v18 B; 19 vs11,14,15; Isaiah 11v4]
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I'd prefer to be a wolf rather than a sheep.
 
Klaufi_Wodensson

Klaufi_Wodensson

Vinlandic Warrior
URAVIP2ME said:
It appears those wolf-like clergy are really not wolves or sheep but end up as the goats of Matthew 25v32.....
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What's wrong with goats? What's so bad about them? Is it bad to be different? I'd rather be anything other than a sheep, blindly following whoever leads me
 
Midnight Pete

Midnight Pete

Well-Known Member
Thief said:
Computers won't help much about matters of faith.
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No they won't, and that's the sticking point for many RF posters. Trying to have a religious or spiritual conversation with someone who will never accept anything but hard data is futile. Not to mention masochistic.
 
PolyHedral

PolyHedral

Superabacus Mystic
I am objecting to your idea that there must be a "first" of everything, since properties can exist as a continuous gradient. There is no first "large" number, only numbers which get steadily larger.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
PolyHedral said:
I am objecting to your idea that there must be a "first" of everything, since properties can exist as a continuous gradient. There is no first "large" number, only numbers which get steadily larger.
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No point of origin?.....genesis?

And of course unique items....one of something....how about 'you'?
 
PolyHedral

PolyHedral

Superabacus Mystic
Midnight Pete said:
Hard data can get us to a certain point. Science a great tool for acquiring knowledge but it does have limits...
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Of course; That limit is anything that interacts with the universe.

Thief said:
No point of origin?.....genesis?

And of course unique items....one of something....how about 'you'?
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Everything in the universe can be reduced to identical components. Any sense of uniqueness is an illusion, caused by our tendency to spot patterns.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
PolyHedral said:
Of course; That limit is anything that interacts with the universe.


Everything in the universe can be reduced to identical components. Any sense of uniqueness is an illusion, caused by our tendency to spot patterns.
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No points for reduction.

That physical things are made of a collection of atomic structures doesn't not take away unique persons, places or things.

There is only one Creator.
 
PolyHedral

PolyHedral

Superabacus Mystic
Reductionism has worked in all past cases. Why should it fail now?

And uniqueness must be an emergent phenomenon, since it did not exist during the first few thousand years of the universe. Also, what is "you", other than a collection?
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
PolyHedral said:
Reductionism has worked in all past cases. Why should it fail now?

And uniqueness must be an emergent phenomenon, since it did not exist during the first few thousand years of the universe. Also, what is "you", other than a collection?
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Your linear existence has resulted in a unique person...you.

God is unique...as Creator.

One of Him...one of you.
 
PolyHedral

PolyHedral

Superabacus Mystic
Last week's lottery numbers were probably unique. Doesn't mean they can't happen again, though. And doesn't mean that uniqueness is a "real" object.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
PolyHedral said:
Last week's lottery numbers were probably unique. Doesn't mean they can't happen again, though. And doesn't mean that uniqueness is a "real" object.
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Numbers repeat.
Might take a while....but they will.

Only one of you.
Unless you would say you are not a 'real' object.
 
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