Overturning Roe V Wade

[GardenLady]

I do know a woman who gave up a child for adoption, as an adult, not a teen. It was brutally painful. She ended up on medication for a couple of years. In the beginning I was hoping she'd change her mind, seeing how she was suffering, but she didn't.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

I think before you have a baby, you have to count the cost.

I wouldn't buy a 500,000 house unless I knew I could afford it.

Even fairly common complications like pre-eclampsia and premature birth can cost millions (yes millions) even with insurance! Trying to frame women becoming financially destitute from childbirth as a personal responsibility lecture shows a severe lack of insight as to how ****ty US Healthcare is.

 

[Subduction Zone]

If the Republicans get control and get their way, they will pass a federal law banning all abortions. Mark my words.

I doubt if that will happen. This is likely to be a rallying cry for the Democrats. Until this passed I expected to see Democrat numbers drop in the House and Senate next election. Now I expect to see them to rise. A whopping 59% of all Americans think that abortion should be legal in either all or most cases. This has been an issue that attracted single issue voters to the Republican party. Now that motivation is largely gone. They did what they set out to do. On the other hand things just got very very real for the 59% of Americans that support abortion.

I can't see this ending well for the Republicans and I am glad of it.

Oops, almost forgot my source:

About six-in-ten Americans say abortion should be legal in all or most cases

 

[SkepticThinker]

I think before you have a baby, you have to count the cost.

I wouldn't buy a 500,000 house unless I knew I could afford it.

Yep. And the cost is huge.
So if you find yourself pregnant and you can't afford it, then what?

You seem to be making my point for me.

 

[SkepticThinker]

So you wouldn't help your family?

Maybe you can't afford to.

 

[fantome profane]

Of course they don't, but Imo the mother should think of more than just herself.

Well good for you. As for myself I would never tell a women in that situation what I think she “should” do. This decision had got to be one of the most difficult decisions of a person’s life.

And I certainly would not make the assumption that every woman who had an abortion was only thinking about herself.

Of course you wouldn't be because you would not exist (at least not in this world) but you don't know how you would have felt if you were born into this world.

um, yeah, I kinda do.

I believe the soul comes into being at the time of conception so that is what I mean by "we all."

Ok, believe whatever you want. But we can’t go around making laws dictating how other people must live based on your metaphysical beliefs.

I don’t want to be disrespectful to your beliefs, but frankly they just don’t matter when it comes to other people’s reproductive rights.

 

[Kenny]

Banning access to abortive procedures does force people to have unwanted children.

If you don't want children, tie the tubes or a vasectomy. Wouldn't that be cheaper and prevent unwanted children?

 

[Kenny]

Maybe you can't afford to.

That sure is a big maybe. Even in the poorest of Hondurans (which makes our poor look rich) -= help their family.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Even fairly common complications like pre-eclampsia and premature birth can cost millions (yes millions) even with insurance! Trying to frame women becoming financially destitute from childbirth as a personal responsibility lecture shows a severe lack of insight as to how ****ty US Healthcare is.

Thank you for making the point I've been trying to make for several pages now!

 

[Kenny]

Even fairly common complications like pre-eclampsia and premature birth can cost millions (yes millions) even with insurance! Trying to frame women becoming financially destitute from childbirth as a personal responsibility lecture shows a severe lack of insight as to how ****ty US Healthcare is.

Those instances aren't about abortion, are they? Was that a "move the goal post?"

 

[Subduction Zone]

Even fairly common complications like pre-eclampsia and premature birth can cost millions (yes millions) even with insurance! Trying to frame women becoming financially destitute from childbirth as a personal responsibility lecture shows a severe lack of insight as to how ****ty US Healthcare is.

But . . . but:

“The health care is going to be less money, and we're going to have much better health care.”

“I support health care for people. I want people well taken care of. But I also want health care that we can afford as a country. I have people and friends closing down their businesses because of Obamacare.”

“We're going to get this bill to remake the health care system passed through the Senate. I feel so confident. As much as we've come up with a really incredible health care plan, this has brought Republican Party together.”

“The health care is going to be less money, and we're going to have much better health care.”

Donald J. Trump.

Are you saying that didn't happen?

 

[Kenny]

Yep. And the cost is huge.
So if you find yourself pregnant and you can't afford it, then what?

You seem to be making my point for me.

Not at all... if you don't buy a house, don't buy it. If you don't want the burden of caring for a child, don't have a baby or give it up to one of the thousands who want to adopt one. Some will even pay your medical costs.

 

[SkepticThinker]

I doubt if that will happen. This is likely to be a rallying cry for the Democrats. Until this passed I expected to see Democrat numbers drop in the House and Senate next election. Now I expect to see them to rise. A whopping 59% of all Americans think that abortion should be legal in either all or most cases. This has been an issue that attracted single issue voters to the Republican party. Now that motivation is largely gone. They did what they set out to do. On the other hand things just got very very real for the 59% of Americans that support abortion.

I can't see this ending well for the Republicans and I am glad of it.

Oops, almost forgot my source:

About six-in-ten Americans say abortion should be legal in all or most cases

I'm happy to know that most Americans support abortion rights, but I have zero confidence in the Republicans actually listening to that or caring. Banning abortion has always been one of their main goals, and I can't see them giving that up now, regardless of what the American people want. I don't see Republicans as being very interested in pushing for anything that their constituents actually want or need.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Those instances aren't about abortion, are they? Was that a "move the goal post?"

Considering possible complications is part of abortions. When you drive do you put on your seat belt? Why or why not?

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Those instances aren't about abortion, are they? Was that a "move the goal post?"

No, that's a reading comprehension issue on your part.
People get abortions because, among many reasons, ****ty US Healthcare makes fairly common pregnancy complications financially untenable.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

How are they denied rights?

The right to bodily autonomy.

Specifically, the right to refuse the use of your body, tissues, organs or fluids by someone else.

This is a right we even afford to corpses; anti-choicers would deny it to pregnant people.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I'm happy to know that most Americans support abortion rights, but I have zero confidence in the Republicans actually listening to that or caring. Banning abortion has always been one of their main goals, and I can't see them giving that up now, regardless of what the American people want. I don't see Republicans as being very interested in pushing for anything that their constituents actually want or need.

Oh no, the Republicans are not going to listen. At least not at first. What I see happening in the next election is a higher percentage of Democrats turning out since they have a cause to win. Fewer Republicans turning out because voters often think that they can sit on their laurels. And more people that were on the boundary between the two parties voting Democratic. After some serious losses the Republicans could easily become pro-choice. They used to be in the past. That change only occurred a bit more than 40 years ago after it looked like racism was a failed technique to keep voters in the south.

 

[SkepticThinker]

That sure is a big maybe. Even in the poorest of Hondurans (which makes our poor look rich) -= help their family.

Is it? I certainly couldn't afford it.

I'm not sure if you've noticed, or read any of the links I've provided, but a lot of people are facing extreme financial hardships these days.

And back to my original point, in a country where health care is paid out of pocket and no universal coverage exists, along with hardly any support systems in place, forcing people to carry a pregnancy to term can be financially devastating.

 

[SkepticThinker]

If you don't want children, tie the tubes or a vasectomy. Wouldn't that be cheaper and prevent unwanted children?

I have no idea how much such medical procedures cost in the US. I live in a country with universal healthcare. But I can't imagine it's cheap.

And even with a vasectomy, pregnancy can still happen, as it did with friends of mine. Twice.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Sorry, it's a book title, but also a theory. It holds that “severing the connection between the infant and biological mother through adoption causes a primal wound which often manifests in a sense of loss (depression), basic mistrust (anxiety), emotional and/or behavioral problems and difficulties in relationships with significant others affecting the adoptee’s sense of self, self-esteem and self-worth throughout life.” My son is definitely one of these.

Okay, I have read other theories that can explain that differently. So I am not that convinced. But okay, it could be that. We really have no way of knowing one way or another.