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Part of being Privileged is not having to think about being Privileged

Alceste

Alceste

Vagabond
Just thought I'd throw this in:

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YmirGF

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
dust1n said:
Well, unproductive thinking and productive thinking I don't think necessarily hinge on the topic of discussion. It's more about the manner in which the discussion proceeds.
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I suppose, Dustin.

dust1n said:
So, if I can ask, do you see the notion of privilege as being anything other then a negative occurrence?
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Well, it does provide some rather interesting foundations for implementing what some might consider to be fairly radical solutions. You can make a case for fair living wages, equality, social justice, et al, by hinging them to the notions of existing privilege and systemic inequality.

dust1n said:
Well, CRT is more then use "white privilege."
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I do recognize that, Dustin, but the notion of "white privilege" has its roots in CRT.

dust1n said:
But I'm curious about your phrasing here. White privilege [is] being yet another hurdle placed in front of the black community. Doesn't the "yet another hurdle" imply that there are actually many hurdles in front of the black community? Wouldn't these be hurdles that, say, a non-black person might not have in front of them?
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They may or may not. Poor folks, across the racial spectrum, have much in common. It's not that the world is out to get them. They're just poor - often through no fault of their own.

dust1n said:
I agree with this... or at least the sentiment. It's true to some extent. I know, for example, that wages now are equivalent to the wages my Dad had access to at his age. Such bleak realities are rather disenfranchising, and I find myself needing even extra motivation to go out and do stuff in society. Throw that in with ethical conundrums involving lots of fields and taxes, and I can't really see much reason to contribute to society.
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One person CAN make a difference, Dustin. Try to never let go of that. You don't have to change the world, but you can make YOUR world a little better. By improving your lot, you will automatically help people around you. Then again, perhaps I am just delusional.

dust1n said:
But such pessimism don't not change the facts. Even if acknowledging "white privilege" is something that makes black kids feel like there is no point in trying, that doesn't really say anything about whether white privilege exists or not.
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But it does, Dustin. IF this supposed "privilege" is nonexistent and you convince people it is real you harm them by robbing them of motivation. If it IS real, then you simply underscore the hopelessness. Bear in mind that it is almost impossible to prove that such "privilege" exists. You have to skew things just so, to bring it into focus.

dust1n said:
And I would be more then happy to provide empirical evidence detailing systemic racism in this country, if you would.
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I'd love to see even a couple of examples of what you are talking about. Bear in mind, I'm Canadian and we have a different set of issues here. From my perspective, for example, things here are not quite how Alceste describes them. Sure, you will get many who agree with her, but there is also many who would dispute her position. It's as clear as mud, really.

dust1n said:
But the psychological impact of actual systemic racial discrepancies can also be very damaging... probably more so then the abstraction of the discrepancies. And certainly, ignoring them isn't going to make uneducated blacks somehow feel more empowered. If anything, they will continue to resent their fair skinned countrymen even more.
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All the more reason to determine if such systemic privilege actually exists. I'm all for serious research into the question and sorry, I don't consider "Google" as one helpful poster suggested as being serious research. My bar is a bit higher than that.

dust1n said:
Well, if acknowledging white privilege is just an end itself, then I don't see much good coming from the notion. I don't see the concept of privilege as a very simplistic notion. I think think De Bois talked about simplistic notions at all. It's all.. actually.. very complicated. Whether or not the notions are limited, something to build off of, or divisive by virtue of who is using the terms, none of this speaks of the legitimacy of the issue, sad as it may be.
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A bit of a misunderstanding. No, De Bois concepts are fairly complex, but when compared to the complexity of the problems, they are simplistic, imo, of course.
 
Shadow Wolf

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Question_love_act said:
Well when I'm old I'll hope I'd rather be silly that being grumpy and messing with people I don't know!
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I've become quite fond of questioning people who laugh, ridicule, mock, joke, or whatever cruel jests they make towards the elderly, by simply asking what they themselves will do when they are old. The two most common responses are either "uhhhhh......." or "hopefully I won't live that long."
But in our society especially, the youth are highly privileged as the elderly are largely forgotten about and neglected. Too bad it isn't considered a crime to put your parents in a nursing home for the convenience.
 
Question_love_act

Question_love_act

Humanist... "Animalist"?
Shadow Wolf said:
Too bad it isn't considered a crime to put your parents in a nursing home for the convenience.
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Indeed it's one the main flaws of our culture. We say we are an "advanced" society yet the way we treat our elderly is not humane.

Youth privilege in an important one like you showed. It's ok to make fun of the old, like making fun of anybody in fact. But scatological jokes just maintain an ugly stereotype.

I agree about the main reactions of people being "unhhhh" or "hope I won't live that long"! But I truly mean I hope to live that long and still being able to joke about it!

Speaking of which, few people know that even though there is youth privilege and the inhumane treatment of some elderly people in nearing homes, elderly people are generally more happy than youths or adults!
Why Older Adults Are Happier | LiveScience
 
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Mercy Not Sacrifice

Well-Known Member
Alceste said:
No, but we white folks should probably badger our political leaders to formally apologize to cultures brutalized by the specific policies of their predecessors.

Like so:
[youtube]r7_GgoFhBMg[/youtube]
Indian Residential School Apology & Picture's of Manitoba school's Made by 11 yr. Old ;) - YouTube
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Sunstone said:
I'm against apologizing for things, like race, that are not ones choice. But it might be a good thing if governments apologized for the crimes of their predecessors.
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Seems reasonable. And we also need to realize that we are direct benefactors of racist systems and policies, past and present. Indeed, just as injustice can harm some, it can benefit others.
 
Alceste

Alceste

Vagabond
Mercy Not Sacrifice said:
Seems reasonable. And we also need to realize that we are direct benefactors of racist systems and policies, past and present. Indeed, just as injustice can harm some, it can benefit others.
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Sure. My ancestors had a huge economic bonanza thanks to the displacement of first nations populations. A veritable feeding frenzy of property values escalating from practically zero to millions in four short generations.

I'm not seeing any of that, though. It's my parents' generation's retirement fund. My generation can't afford to buy property.
 
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