I already linked it several pages ago. If you want to view it you do the work to go find it. If you want it done stop being lazy and do it yourself.
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"Pornography Offends the Holy Ghost"
- Thread starter Skwim
- Start date
I already linked it several pages ago. If you want to view it you do the work to go find it. If you want it done stop being lazy and do it yourself.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
I also refuted it several pages ago. The offer is still out there.
Denial is not refutation.
This circular logic of yours does not work.
Your offer is less valuable than soiled toilet paper.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
And I did not merely deny early. That is what you have been doing every since the refutation.
I am not the one that uses circular logic. If I was I would not have made the offer that I did.
The offer is still out there.
ETA: But I am getting tired of you running away. This is the last time the offer is out there. If you don't take me up on it I will take it as an admission of defeat. I have been more than generous, and that generosity is now ended.
Wait...what was we talking about again?
Frater Sisyphus
Contradiction, irrationality and disorder
Firstly, main point - porn shouldn't be controversial (outside of abuse cases, which are the legal systems..) but it is really terrible at it's job, so I don't endorse it.
The biggest danger of porn is the lack of quality or eroticism, it is just vapid, empty videos of people either touching their own organs or putting their organs into other human's organs and making comedic sounds that are intended to be interpreted by other humans as arousing - regardless if the actors are attractive or not (same goes for amateur films). Porn too, can never fulfill any of the beauty of real, genuine sex - or properly relieve one of one's tensions.
I believe sexuality is an immensely powerful thing (and a significant base of our psychology) but you gotta be real (those who claim to like porn) - Pornography is stupid, awkward and soulless.
As a person who has spent much time with studying filmmaking (actual cinema), I think every camera-man needs to be fired and sent to work at a garbage dump.
Sex/sexuality is the most beautiful and positive thing in the universe, yet we've still got far to improve (if pornography is any indication
)
The biggest danger of porn is the lack of quality or eroticism, it is just vapid, empty videos of people either touching their own organs or putting their organs into other human's organs and making comedic sounds that are intended to be interpreted by other humans as arousing - regardless if the actors are attractive or not (same goes for amateur films). Porn too, can never fulfill any of the beauty of real, genuine sex - or properly relieve one of one's tensions.
I believe sexuality is an immensely powerful thing (and a significant base of our psychology) but you gotta be real (those who claim to like porn) - Pornography is stupid, awkward and soulless.
As a person who has spent much time with studying filmmaking (actual cinema), I think every camera-man needs to be fired and sent to work at a garbage dump.
Sex/sexuality is the most beautiful and positive thing in the universe, yet we've still got far to improve (if pornography is any indication
)
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Frater Sisyphus
Contradiction, irrationality and disorder
I agree, parents should be educating their kids about sexuality and not in a negative light. It's a hard balance keeping them away from what they are not mentally or physically ready for; and still keeping a positive impression about it.
But I myself know from my own teen years, that there nothing worse that growing up with a strong burden of shame and guilt about sexuality - which itself can lead to more negative mental patterns about sex, or even traumatic experiences. (which through my own interest and studies into clinical psychology has helped me out of)
Keep kids socializing and growing in relationship skills and keep them away from porn, but for god's sake don't mess up their sexuality, through the parents own insecurities! (religious or otherwise)
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Firstly, main point - porn shouldn't be controversial (outside of abuse cases, which are the legal systems..) but it is really terrible at it's job, so I don't endorse it.
The biggest danger of porn is the lack of quality or eroticism, it is just vapid, empty videos of people either touching their own organs or putting their organs into other human's organs and making comedic sounds that are intended to be interpreted by other humans as arousing - regardless if the actors are attractive or not (same goes for amateur films). Porn too, can never fulfill any of the beauty of real, genuine sex - or properly relieve one of one's tensions.
I believe sexuality is an immensely powerful thing (and a significant base of our psychology) but you gotta be real (those who claim to like porn) - Pornography is stupid, awkward and soulless.
As a person who has spent much time with studying filmmaking (actual cinema), I think every camera-man needs to be fired and sent to work at a garbage dump.
Sex/sexuality is the most beautiful and positive thing in the universe, yet we've still got far to improve (if pornography is any indication
Due to the stigma against porn there is no investment into quality productions. Compare the budget of a porn movie to the budget of a Hollywood hit. There are often several orders of magnitude difference in the budgets. A movie that costs more than one hundred million dollars to produce is common place, A porn movie with over a $100,000 budget is a rarity.
And yes, compared to real sex porn runs worse than a distant second. But it still has its place. The important thing to do is to keep it in its place. It is fantasy of the same order as a Spiderman movie. Yes, there will be a few nuts that think Spiderman is real. And yes, there will be a few nuts that believe porn is real. Enjoy it for what it is. The good news is that with ever increasing acceptance there will be ever increasing quality.
Frater Sisyphus
Contradiction, irrationality and disorder
I wasn't talking about quality via budget* but I agree.
*I was meaning quality of the genuine and/or erotic: - the layer that lies in real life passionate sex which instills emotions larger than simply just arousal (and I'm not just meaning dedicated marriages) - which is absent from 99.99% of porn, I doubt VR (as I've heard is becoming a thing) would care enough to it either.
Essentially: Porn; is like watching a snail crawl across a floor. Real sex; is like parachuting out of a plane billions of miles in the air.
But I'm not meaning real vs fake in this particular comment - as movies can instill those emotions to an extent, it is in the power of art (which porn runs as far away from as it can, through it's lack-of-care approach)
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Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
I do not disagree with you at all. Porn has a long way to go before it can claim to be a genuine art form.
In reply to Subduction Zone:
I think the likelihood of rape being less due to the availability of porn can be made but that is only one aspect, and I would propose it is outweighed by all the negative effects. I know the same argument has been made for illegal images of children, for example - that any actual abuse might be lowered if we allowed a certain amount of this (virtual images for example), but the result of doing so would probably be far worse overall. The current amount and nature of internet pornography I would place in the same category as our contamination of the oceans and our lack of foresight with regards to space junk - we will inevitably pick up the tab later - or future generations will actually. And I believe religions fall into this category too, that is, that the deficits tend to outweigh any benefits overall.
I think the likelihood of rape being less due to the availability of porn can be made but that is only one aspect, and I would propose it is outweighed by all the negative effects. I know the same argument has been made for illegal images of children, for example - that any actual abuse might be lowered if we allowed a certain amount of this (virtual images for example), but the result of doing so would probably be far worse overall. The current amount and nature of internet pornography I would place in the same category as our contamination of the oceans and our lack of foresight with regards to space junk - we will inevitably pick up the tab later - or future generations will actually. And I believe religions fall into this category too, that is, that the deficits tend to outweigh any benefits overall.
Truly Enlightened
Well-Known Member
Normally your position has been the voice of reason. It seems out of character that your argument's position is defensive, rather than logical or intuitive. I have no idea how the stats from the largest porn site in the world, can be considered bogus. Unless you are suggesting that these electronically collected stats are also bogus? But to be fair I did find that there are 3 positives supporting the watching of internet porn.
When women watch porn, evidence suggest for a time, sexual relationships can be a net positive.
When porn is used by consensual partnered adults as a sexual aid to spice up their relationship.
When used by adults to relieve pent-up sexual desires, from their hormonal overload.
Other than the 3 I mentioned, what other positives do these experts deposit, that don't share my more than informed opinion? There are so many studies supporting the negative effects of porn, that I can only call it willful denial, or the "creationist syndrome"(close eyes and cover ears). This is the same social apathy that has allowed alcohol, tobacco, drugs, gambling, and now pornography, to establish itself as a normal part of society. It doesn’t take a genius in cultural theory to grasp the social meaning behind images of women being repeatedly penetrated in every orifice to a chorus of “****,” “*****” and “whore.” It does however require a special kind of person, who is unwilling to think beyond the rhetoric of, “choice,” “empowerment” and “free speech”. This is the crap that porn industry representatives use to justify the use of its content. They try to distract attention away from the nature of mainstream pornography, by framing those who object to its harm as censorious, illiberal and of course "prudish”. But we're smarter than this, right?
This is not simply an alarmist hand-waving diatribe. I believe that people should be educated in the true effects of porn. They should also be encouraged to find out for themselves. That is, before they reach the point where they just don't care anymore. How can you warn, protect, or set an example for kids not to watch porn, if you are a porn addict yourself? And, considering the number of porn viewers, it is blatant hypocrisy to expect kids not to watch. I believe all we can really do is lead by example. No matter what evidence is presented, Is Internet Pornography Causing Sexual Dysfunctions? A Review with Clinical Reports, porn addicts and sympathizers will always crave their pleasures, and justify their actions, by using whatever rationale they choose. The evidence is crystal on the effects of watching porn, even if you are an adult. Problems include:
It causes "Porn induced ED"(only 15% is organic in origin), sexual problems in adolescence, diminished libido, reliance of porn as a sexual outlet(orgasm), the negative effects on partnered sex, the negative effects on intimacy, the negative effects on marriage relationships, the escalation to hypersexuality disorders, the danger of becoming an internet porn addict, the dangers that lead to more extreme genres of internet porn, the negative effect of unnecessary personal and/or vocational stressor, the creation of chemical imbalances in the brain(between dopamine and the hypothalamus and dopamine surges and our reward systems), the negative effects in the rewiring of the brain, the negative effects on our psychological and social imaging of self, relationships, and sex.
The good news about porn addition, is that the physical damage can be cured by 8-10 months simply by abstinening. The psychological damage will take a lot longer. Don
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Depends on the porn. Some porn has artistic value. Erotica is really a form of porn, too, just "classier" and is usually considered art. The definitions of "pornography", "erotica" and "art" are subjective, anyway.
Real sex is mostly overrated. I've personally been content with watching porn and masturbating for a while now.
Truly Enlightened
Well-Known Member
I rest my case. Don
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Sorry but this appears to be just an argument based upon emotion and myth.In reply to Subduction Zone:
I think the likelihood of rape being less due to the availability of porn can be made but that is only one aspect, and I would propose it is outweighed by all the negative effects. I know the same argument has been made for illegal images of children, for example - that any actual abuse might be lowered if we allowed a certain amount of this (virtual images for example), but the result of doing so would probably be far worse overall. The current amount and nature of internet pornography I would place in the same category as our contamination of the oceans and our lack of foresight with regards to space junk - we will inevitably pick up the tab later - or future generations will actually. And I believe religions fall into this category too, that is, that the deficits tend to outweigh any benefits overall.
Don't use me as an example for your anti-porn bull****. I've never really been a type to pursue sex and relationships, compared to my peers. Besides, a person isn't "broken" if they don't and if they are satisfied with giving themselves pleasure. At least the orgasm is guaranteed. Lol. Romantic relationships just aren't a priority in my life right now.
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When the evidence is hardly one-sided I would disagree - and it is hardly one-sided. So, I am just as likely to be right as wrong.