Pornography poll

[Alceste]

How do you know it is almost entirely composed of people who were abused?

Even if it is, who cares, everyone has baggage. They can't get out of the industry because it pays ridiculously well. Any other job they choose would be an enormous pay cut. You think the guy changing tires for minimum wage does it because he loves it? No, he does it because he isn't good for anything else.

It's just hard to feel sorry about someone's career choice when it pays amazingly well, especially when they work for two or three hours and get paid what many work 40 to 80 hours to get.

Research, that's how. Come on, man. It's not like you can't look this stuff up too.

Being pounded until you are internally bleeding, regularly being beaten and raped, regularly contracting STDs including a 7% likelihood of HIV, being killed at a rate 40 times higher than the general population, being required to dissociate from yourself for hours at a time in order to suppress feelings of rage, hopelessness and shame, PTSD - the money makes it all worthwhile, right?

Snap out of it.

 

[AspiringSatanist]

Shouldn't be banned. Honestly, it does exploit women in some way. It uses women and sex as a commodity to be traded and sold, but this in my opinion is not negative whatsoever. Just a way to exploit the nature of man to make a profit. If the act(s) is/are partaken by consensual adults I have zero problems with it.

 

[Alceste]

We see a lot of claims about the horrible backgrounds of these women in sex trades, but even if there were
actual studies to back them up, prohibiting these gals from skin flicking wouldn't change their background.
The anti-porn arguments here smack of ad hoc invention, desperation & double standards.

I have a solution though. Since women are not mature enuf, empowered & emotionally capable of making
their own decisions, & must be prevented from acting, I propose that only men act in porn. Certainly, men
(especially white ones) won't be victims, so it would be ethical to let them have a free choice in the matter.
They can play the part of women using prosthetics & even surgical modification. So just as in front line
military jobs, where women are too vulnerable & dependent to serve, men will fulfill the role. Porn is saved!

There you go again, not bothering to click anybody's links so you can pretend no evidence has been presented.

You're not fooling anybody. Claiming there has been no research after I linked to research is a terrible debate strategy. Can't you come up with an argument that is consistent with the facts thus far presented?

(I can't help but notice I'm the only person who has linked to ANY evidence. Where's yours? Oh, wait, you don't believe in facts. Never mind.)

 

[Alceste]

To believe prostitution has no victims, one must ignore these statistics published in Farley's Fact Sheet:

• 78 percent of 55 women who sought help from the Council for Prostitution Alternatives in 1991 reported being raped an average of 16 times a year by pimps, and were raped 33 times a year by johns.
• 62 percent reported having been raped in prostitution.
• 73 percent reported having experienced physical assault in prostitution.
• 72 percent were currently or formerly homeless.
• 92 percent stated that they wanted to escape prostitution immediately.
• 83 percent of prostitutes are victims of assault with a weapon.
• 75 percent of women in escort prostitution had attempted suicide.
• 67 percent meet diagnostic criteria for posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD).

Prevalence of Incest

In short, the victims of prostitution are mostly the prostitutes themselves. It just may be that they no longer have the ability left to "consent" to be a willing participant in their so-called victimless crime. Estimates of the prevalence of incest among prostitutes range from 65 percent to 90 percent. The Council for Prostitution Alternatives, Portland, Oregon Annual Report in 1991 found that: 85 percent of their prostitute clients reported history of sexual abuse in childhood while 70 percent reported incest.

Is Prostitution a Victimless Crime?

 

[Revoltingest]

There you go again, not bothering to click anybody's links so you can pretend no evidence has been presented.
You're not fooling anybody. Claiming there has been no research after I linked to research is a terrible debate strategy. Can't you come up with an argument that is consistent with the facts thus far presented?
(I can't help but notice I'm the only person who has linked to ANY evidence. Where's yours? Oh, wait, you don't believe in facts. Never mind.)

Woof!

Facts are useful things, but not opinion & speculation gussied up as a "fact". I've no use for
faux facts. Nor is it effective to bury your 'facts' within (just one) linked article by an
obscure slipshod anti-porn advocate, rather than quoting them within a cogent argument.
Tis as though you scream, "See! I'm right because I posted a link!".

 

[Alceste]

A comprehensive 2004 mortality study of women in prostitution, funded by the National Institutes of Health and conducted by the American Journal of Epidemiology, shows that workplace homicide rates for women in prostitution are 51 times that of the next most dangerous occupation for women (which is working in a liquor store). The average age of death of the women was 34.

...

Estimates of the prevalence of incest among people in prostitution range from 65% to 90%: The Council for Prostitution Alternatives, Portland, Oregon Annual Report in 1991 stated that: 85% of prostitute/clients reported history of sexual abuse in childhood; 70% reported incest.

...

About 80% of women in prostitution have been the victim of a rape. Prostitutes are raped, on the average, eight to ten times per year. They are the most raped class of women in the history of our planet. (Susan Kay Hunter and K.C. Reed, July, 1990 "Taking the side of bought and sold rape," speech at National Coalition against Sexual Assault, Washington, D.C. ) 83% of people in prostitution are victims of assault with a weapon. (National Coalition Against Sexual Assault) 85% of people in prostitution are raped by pimps. (Council on Prostitution Alternatives, Portland, 1994)

10 Facts that Shaped the Ugly Truth Campaign | End Demand Illinois

 

[Alceste]

Woof!

* carving another victory notch into my Revolting Debate Memorial Stick *

 

[Skwim]

http://www.prostitutionresearch.com/Farley%202006%20-%20Prosituttion%2C%20Trafficking%20and%20Cultural%20Amnesia.pdf

Lots of evidence in there. The statistics on childhood abuse are on page five. 85% rate of incest, 99% rate of emotional and / or physical abuse.

Other interesting facts from that article: prostitutes die at a rate that is 40 times higher than the general population. There is also a 35% rate of attempted murder of prostitutes. Additionally, 68% of recovering prostitutes meet the clinical criteria for PTSD.

Interesting piece, although assuming the "page 5" you mention is page 105, there are no rates of incest or emotional and / or physical abuse listed. And because the article is 36 pages long I'm not about to go through it, particularly after reading the extreme bias of the author, Melissa Farley. To wit:

"Farley is also an anti-pornography activist. In 1985, she led a National Rampage Against Penthouse alongside Nikki Craft. The "Rampage" was a campaign of public destruction of bookstore-owned copies of Penthouse and Hustler (which they denounced as violent pornography). Farley was arrested 13 different times in 9 different states for these actions. In March 2007, she testified in hearings about Kink.com's purchase of the San Francisco Armory, comparing the images produced by Kink.com to images of prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib. Farley is opposed to sadomasochism more generally, and in her essay "Ten Lies about Sadomasochism", outlines her opposition to BDSM practices, arguing that such practices are abusive, harmful, and anti-feminist.

"Melissa Farley is a feminist psychologist and antipornography activist who understands that pornography is 'pictures of prostitution'".

source
​

Such a blatant anti-predisposition toward pornography completely demolishes any confidence in her objectivity. Believe her if you wish, but to my way of thinking she doesn't deserve anyone's time of day.

 

[freethinker44]

How many little girls and boys do you know who say "When I grow up, I wanna be a prostitute!"

Seriously. Use your head.

How many say they want to grow up and work on an assembly line?

 

[Me Myself]

How many little girls and boys do you know who say "When I grow up, I wanna be a prostitute!"

Seriously. Use your head.

D you honestly think that is an argument?

Since when has not being an astronaut been explotation?

Have you ever heard a little boy say "when I want to grow up I wanna be an accountant"?

A lot of jobs are taken because of the money you can gain from them.

Actually, according to polls, most men take jobs that would t have been their dream job just so they earned more money.

There is nothing wrong with that, as long as the person is doing that because of its own choosing.

Now you want to force everyone to become an astronaut?

There is nothing inherently wrong with doing porn for money.

 

[Me Myself]

There you go again, not bothering to click anybody's links so you can pretend no evidence has been presented.

You're not fooling anybody. Claiming there has been no research after I linked to research is a terrible debate strategy. Can't you come up with an argument that is consistent with the facts thus far presented?

(I can't help but notice I'm the only person who has linked to ANY evidence. Where's yours? Oh, wait, you don't believe in facts. Never mind.)

He didnt at all based his argument on that. That was merely a passing notice.

As you could see (if you actually read what he said) the point is that banning them to perform such job if they want to earn all that money in that way does not in any way change their past.

Of course, if you actually addresed that maybe he would have taken seriously your response with another one.

Bt by all means, put your notch in your self dilusion memorial

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

There you go again, not bothering to click anybody's links so you can pretend no evidence has been presented.

You're not fooling anybody. Claiming there has been no research after I linked to research is a terrible debate strategy. Can't you come up with an argument that is consistent with the facts thus far presented?

(I can't help but notice I'm the only person who has linked to ANY evidence. Where's yours? Oh, wait, you don't believe in facts. Never mind.)

Sometimes I think liberals just like the sounds of their own voice. They talk a lot but it doesn't change anything or help anyone.

 

[oldbadger]

How do you feel about Scotsmen holding garden implements wearing tiny tiny kilts?
(Btw, the implements aren't the ones wearing the kilts.)

How did you guess? So.....now that you've uncovered eek my dirty little secret, how much do you want for it all to just 'go away' :sad4:

OK..... ok..... Big gorgeous redheaded scotsmen in very tiny little kilts..... oh the joy..... the tingle in the winky.....:drool:

But if I discover that they've been forced into this sordid business for huge returns, or that their uncles nicked their favourite toy when they were three......... well, obviously that's just dreadful.

 

[oldbadger]

Research, that's how. Come on, man. It's not like you can't look this stuff up too.

Being pounded until you are internally bleeding, regularly being beaten and raped, regularly contracting STDs including a 7% likelihood of HIV, being killed at a rate 40 times higher than the general population, being required to dissociate from yourself for hours at a time in order to suppress feelings of rage, hopelessness and shame, PTSD - the money makes it all worthwhile, right?

Snap out of it.

We already snapped out of it.......

And what have serious offences against the person got to do with pornography? I've already been told that serious sexual offences against persons etc are not part of this thread. You would need to come back to 'pornography', I think.

And what research? You don't seem to trust your own government to survey, research, empower, enforce and prosecute, but all of a sudden we all have to wake up to your accepted researchers and your chosen surveyors, and accept every stat you dig up?

Where did you get your pornography (prostitution?) life expectancy figures from? Canada?

You write erotica (professionally?), if so, we need to see the manipulation in your choice of words....... your calculated rhetoric.

 

[oldbadger]

Is Prostitution a Victimless Crime?

Lord, but you post some junk...........

Melissa Farley PhD wiki extract:-
Melissa Farley (born 1942) is an American clinical psychologist and researcher[1][2][3] and feminist anti-pornography and anti-prostitution activist.[4][5] Farley is best known for her studies of the effects of prostitution, trafficking, and sexual violence.

So........ no agenda there then? :biglaugh:

You don't feel that you can trust your own governmental surveys etc, but snatch up some stat drawn up by an anti-porn anti-prostitution activist and expect us to be that stupid? :biglaugh:

 

[Heathen Hammer]

Some of it exploits women, but for the most part these days the ones that do are catering to a certain taste where the exploitation is enacted, overtly. The people participating purposefully makes it appear that way. That's the theme of it.

Shouldn't be banned, no.

 

[Flankerl]

Oh right, what is that thing called again where women are paid to have sex with random men?

Ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhh.

Clearer now? Prostitution isn't always porn, but porn is always prostitution.

Yeah but uhm somehow prostitutes arent filmed most of the time. They also have sex with their costumer and not with a man or woman who also does porn.
And thats quite a difference.

Also believe it or not most people who do porn do it out of their free will. The people who get forced to do porn usually end up in real rape flicks and all that "fun" stuff which is illegal, forbidden etc.

How many little girls and boys do you know who say "When I grow up, I wanna be a prostitute!"

Seriously. Use your head.

How many kids say that they want to work in a factory? Oh so many?

Guess they must be forced to do that...

 

[Father Heathen]

You don't think it would be preferable to provide mental health services to the victims of childhood abuse than to jerk off to images of them perpetuating their resulting self-destructive habits?

How did you infer that from anything I've said?

 

[Revoltingest]

How many say they want to grow up and work on an assembly line?

Let's base public policy on banning all professions which children dream of.
Then we would have no:
Actuaries
Fry cooks
Proctologists
Property managers
HVAC technicians
Database designers
Secretaries
Groundskeepers

 

[Revoltingest]

* carving another victory notch into my Revolting Debate Memorial Stick *

The constant need to feel a "win" bespeaks a Charlie Sheen type of desperation.