Proof Against Evolution

[gnostic]

Life cannot come from non-life, that is a proven principle of science. So where did life come from? I believe in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. God, being outside time, has always existed, and we finite humans cannot understand all that. But we do know we cannot get life from non-life.

There are several non-life elements that can make life. All they need is the right mixture of carbon, oxygen, possibly iron and some other elements. Life can start primitively as a single cell created from these mixture of elements.

So, for me, evolution is a fairy-tail: billions and billions of years ago...long ago, in a land far away...It is much easier for me to believe that God created us than to believe in evolution. But if folks want to believe the fairy tales, that the princess kissed a frog and it became a prince, or we came from a frog or monkey or some such nonsense, that is their choice. I will trust in the Lord who loved me and died for me, and saved me freely, and in eternal life, and in a purpose for life. You believe we came from an evolved animal, go live like one. But I assure you, God is real, and death and judgement are, too. I myself wish to be clothed in Christ's righteousness freely imputed to me, rather than in my own, which is as filthy rags before a Holy God.

A divine being creating the world in only 6 days and the creatures, including the first man straight from the dirt, is far more of fairy tale than any scientific theory.

The biblical creation is a myth. Long before any Hebrews wrote any part of the bible, the 3rd millennium Sumerians had described the creation of man, made out of earth, thus clay. This has become the myth, which the Akkadians, and later the early 2nd millennium Babylonians had absorbed into their own religions. By the time Moses, or someone else composed the Genesis, they had used the myths of the original Sumerian, for their own purpose.

So in essenece, the ancient Hebrews of the late 2nd millennium or early 1st millennium, have stolen the idea of creation from the original Sumerian myth. The Hebrews have also stolen and adapted the story of the Flood including how mankind was saved in the Ark, from the Sumerian Ziusudra, Akkadian Atrahasis and Babylonian Uta-naphistim.

You can trace the sources of where the Biblical stories of creation and flood to the original sources. So essentially the Genesis, particularly that of the Creation and the Flood, is nothing more than myths.

So which is fairy tale, joeboonda? The Genesis from the Bible? Or science?

Sorry, joeboonda, but your use of fairy tale on science can actually be used against your faith.

 

[Super Universe]

There are several non-life elements that can make life. All they need is the right mixture of carbon, oxygen, possibly iron and some other elements. Life can start primitively as a single cell created from these mixture of elements.

Uhh, yeah, with very heavy emphasis on the "other elements". Carbon, oxygen, and iron are the same things that go into making a vehicle, a Dodge perhaps, but they do not give that vehicle life. It needs a passenger (spirit) for that.

Non life elements do not make life. DNA/RNA attracts life, not carbon or oxygen or iron or any other element on your periodic table.

Scientists can't create anything, they assemble and they disassemble, that's it. If they are able to "bring life" to any form it is because life (spirit) is attracted to DNA/RNA.

 

[rojse]

Non-life elements make life? No, they don't.

Uhh, yeah, with very heavy emphasis on the "other elements". Carbon, oxygen, and iron are the same things that go into making a vehicle, a Dodge perhaps, but they do not give it life. It needs a passenger (spirit) for that.

DNA/RNA attracts life, not carbon or oxygen or iron or any other element on your periodic table.

Scientists can't create anything, they assemble and they disassemble, that's it.

If they are able to "bring life" to any form it is because life (spirit) is attracted to DNA/RNA.

If an animal needs spirit for life, how come we are always told that only people have spirits, and this is what differentiates us from animals?

Secondly, many animals are symbiotic - that is, they require other life forms to stay alive. For example, we have bacteria in our gut that help to break down food. Does this mean that if we take these away, we would not be alive in the philosphical sense you discuss?

As for your point about scientists not being able to create life, I would agree that this is not possible at this very moment, but estimates for the first artificially created life vary between three to ten years.

Artificial Life Likely in 3 to 10 Years

 

[yossarian22]

Uhh, yeah, with very heavy emphasis on the "other elements". Carbon, oxygen, and iron are the same things that go into making a vehicle, a Dodge perhaps, but they do not give that vehicle life. It needs a passenger (spirit) for that.

Hardly.
Carbon Dioxide+Oxygen+Nitrogen+Water+other gases which I cannot remember+ thunderbolt = organic molecule

Non life elements do not make life. DNA/RNA attracts life, not carbon or oxygen or iron or any other element on your periodic table.

Some forms of DNA and RNA can be considered alive. Ever heard of a virus.

Scientists can't create anything,

Eh....plutonium disagrees with you. As does nylon, Kevlar, and plastics.

they assemble and they disassemble, that's it. If they are able to "bring life" to any form it is because life (spirit) is attracted to DNA/RNA.

Great. Now prove a "spirit" exists.
Non life becomes life. Its how everything reproduces.

 

[Super Universe]

If an animal needs spirit for life, how come we are always told that only people have spirits, and this is what differentiates us from animals?

Secondly, many animals are symbiotic - that is, they require other life forms to stay alive. For example, we have bacteria in our gut that help to break down food. Does this mean that if we take these away, we would not be alive in the philosphical sense you discuss?

As for your point about scientists not being able to create life, I would agree that this is not possible at this very moment, but estimates for the first artificially created life vary between three to ten years.

Artificial Life Likely in 3 to 10 Years

I don't know who you listen to so I can't really explain that.

Spirit gives life but in a very basic form and the quality of that spirit depends on the DNA/RNA meeting certain requirements.

Compare a calculator to computer. The calculator is equal to bacteria, the computer is an animal. Now what differentiates us from animals isn't spirit but soul. The soul is an evolved form of spirit that has it's own personality but lacks experience. So in comparison you could say that a human is a super computer.

Symbiosis, in itself, does not give life. The bacteria you mentioned have their own DNA/RNA, thus, their own life. Now, having said that, symbiosis is a fact of every life form, even ones you do not see as being alive like the earth itself.

You have dead objects that are a part of you and many live objects that are alive in their own right. Your cells are alive, they have their own spirit, they are a part of you, but they are not you.

My point about scientists not being able to create life is not something that will ever become possible although I don't doubt they will claim it anyway. Once you understand the nature of spirit you know it cannot be created by anything. It can only come from it's source.

And, as I stated, the scientists will never "create" life anyway, they will simply assemble a suitable DNA or RNA structure and it will attract the correct amount of spirit. This is the function of DNA/RNA. It is it's designed purpose. It's not something the scientists will create.

 

[gnostic]

Carbon, oxygen, and iron are the same things that go into making a vehicle, a Dodge perhaps, but they do not give that vehicle life. It needs a passenger (spirit) for that.

Are you telling me all life-forms have spirits?

Even bacteria and viruses?

 

[Super Universe]

Hardly.
Carbon Dioxide+Oxygen+Nitrogen+Water+other gases which I cannot remember+ thunderbolt = organic molecule

Some forms of DNA and RNA can be considered alive. Ever heard of a virus.

Eh....plutonium disagrees with you. As does nylon, Kevlar, and plastics.

Great. Now prove a "spirit" exists.
Non life becomes life. Its how everything reproduces.

Carbon dioxide + oxygen + nitrogen + water + other gasses + thunderbolt = mess. This theory isn't proven and won't ever be, oh, unless they mix in some suitable DNA/RNA (aka nucleotides), no spark needed.

Scientists expect to create life in next 10 years - Science - MSNBC.com

I did not say DNA/RNA isn't alive. In fact I have been stating the exact opposite. You misunderstood. Non life elements do not make (meaning create) life. DNA/RNA attracts life. And yes, virus' are the most basic life forms because they are DNA/RNA.

Name one scientist who created a plutonium atom from nothing? Name one who created the atoms that form nylon, kevlar, plastic, or anything else?

You are assemblers and disassemblers, that's all, nothing more. And you won't ever be given the power to do anything but assemble and disassemble. Just imagine the consequences if you were?

Your "so called" scientists simply used neutrons to change uranium into something they'd never seen before then patted themselves on the back for it as if they were the first being's in the universe to discover it. You worship them when they are barely more than tribal men afraid of a comet.

Prove a spirit exists? Prove it doesn't...

Non life becomes life? Nope, not possible.

 

[Super Universe]

Are you telling me all life-forms have spirits?

Even bacteria and viruses?

No, all life forms attract spirit. The amount and quality of that spirit depends on the amount and quality of the DNA/RNA.

A virus has a tiny amount of spirit but it does not have "A" spirit as in a spiritual being.

Humans do not necessarily have spirit, our alive cells do. You can take any one of them out of us and it does not change us, the cell still lives. Many even live after we're dead because they have their own life giving spirit.

Only the human soul can qualify as a spiritual being.

 

[yossarian22]

Carbon dioxide + oxygen + nitrogen + water + other gasses + thunderbolt = mess. This theory isn't proven and won't ever be,

It already has. It forms basic organic molecules.

I did not say DNA/RNA isn't alive. In fact I have been stating the exact opposite. You misunderstood. Non life elements do not make (meaning create) life. DNA/RNA attracts life.

That means they are not alive.
And how does this make sense? A certain combination of carbon oxygen hydrogen nitrogen, and a few other compounds which I forget attract a spirit?

And yes, virus' are the most basic life forms because they are DNA/RNA.

So a virus has a spirit?

Name one scientist who created a plutonium atom from nothing? Name one who created the atoms that form nylon, kevlar, plastic, or anything else?

This is not what we are arguing so your analogy is broken.
You say that non-life can NEVER become life, and the laws of physics disagree with you.

You are assemblers and disassemblers, that's all, nothing more. And you won't ever be given the power to do anything but assemble and disassemble. Just imagine the consequences if you were?

Thats all there is. Assemble, disassemble, and convert. That is all there is. That is all there will ever be.

Your "so called" scientists simply used neutrons to change uranium into something they'd never seen before

Something that would never form in nature. Well, natural conditions that we are aware of.

Prove a spirit exists? Prove it doesn't...

you are unfamiliar with the rules of debate aren't you?
I would suggest you at least read a book about logical argumentation before continuing..

Non life becomes life? Nope, not possible.

Where do you think the plant cell gets the materials it needs to undergo fission?

 

[Super Universe]

It already has. It forms basic organic molecules.

That means they are not alive.
And how does this make sense? A certain combination of carbon oxygen hydrogen nitrogen, and a few other compounds which I forget attract a spirit?

So a virus has a spirit?

This is not what we are arguing so your analogy is broken.
You say that non-life can NEVER become life, and the laws of physics disagree with you.

Thats all there is. Assemble, disassemble, and convert. That is all there is. That is all there will ever be.

Something that would never form in nature. Well, natural conditions that we are aware of.

you are unfamiliar with the rules of debate aren't you?
I would suggest you at least read a book about logical argumentation before continuing..

Where do you think the plant cell gets the materials it needs to undergo fission?

Your scientists consider carbon to be an organic molecule, meaning that it is derived from and a part of living organisms. It is also a part of dead organisms, thus, it does not give or attract life it is simply a building block of DNA/RNA which attracts spirit.

Carbon does not give life, nitrogen does not give life, neither does the joining of these two elements. Suitable DNA/RNA attracts life meaning you must have all of the elements (carbon/nitrogen/hydrogen/oxygen) that make up DNA/RNA in their proper places. Only then will spirit join with it.

If you wish, you could say that one element of spirit is attracted to the smallest element of suitable RNA. Joining one additional suitable RNA molecule with this one would then double the amount of spirit.

DNA/RNA isn't life, it is the form that attracts spirit which is life. It is like giving movement to a childs toy, spirit is the battery and this battery only fits DNA/RNA.

No, a virus does not have a spirit. I say this because humans have an incorrect idea of what spirit is. Spirit is not a being, it is like the city water system. Spirit is the water in the pipes, it goes where it's directed.

My analogy is not broken. I have a different perspective than you because you are stuck inside of the box that human theory has built around you. Some of your theories have to come down before you will truly understand how the universe works.

I do not consider the person who baked the first lemon cake to be a creator of anything while you do.

Show me where your laws of physics prove that non-life shall become life?


That's all there is? Assembly and disassembly... You have quite a small view from your cheap seats, some day you will move up closer but not today.

Plutonium is a natural, though rare, element. Add it to the long list of things you don't understand about the universe.

I'm unfamiliar with the rules of debate? Who told you there were rules? Are these rules the same physics ones you were talking about that ensure that life comes from carbon and nitrogen and a spark? Hehe... the spark always makes me laugh. It's cute though. You think that life needs an electric spark to get it going, hehe... You guys crack me up...

I understand, you can't provide the evidence that spirit doesn't exist today. I'll wait...

Plant mytosis? Cells are the most basic assemblers. They do not create carbon or nitrogen or oxygen, they split with each new cell receiving a full complement of genetic material. The cell is the most basic assembler.

 

[joeboonda]

There are several non-life elements that can make life. All they need is the right mixture of carbon, oxygen, possibly iron and some other elements. Life can start primitively as a single cell created from these mixture of elements.


A divine being creating the world in only 6 days and the creatures, including the first man straight from the dirt, is far more of fairy tale than any scientific theory.

The biblical creation is a myth. Long before any Hebrews wrote any part of the bible, the 3rd millennium Sumerians had described the creation of man, made out of earth, thus clay. This has become the myth, which the Akkadians, and later the early 2nd millennium Babylonians had absorbed into their own religions. By the time Moses, or someone else composed the Genesis, they had used the myths of the original Sumerian, for their own purpose.

So in essenece, the ancient Hebrews of the late 2nd millennium or early 1st millennium, have stolen the idea of creation from the original Sumerian myth. The Hebrews have also stolen and adapted the story of the Flood including how mankind was saved in the Ark, from the Sumerian Ziusudra, Akkadian Atrahasis and Babylonian Uta-naphistim.

You can trace the sources of where the Biblical stories of creation and flood to the original sources. So essentially the Genesis, particularly that of the Creation and the Flood, is nothing more than myths.

So which is fairy tale, joeboonda? The Genesis from the Bible? Or science?

Sorry, joeboonda, but your use of fairy tale on science can actually be used against your faith.

I believe that science and Genesis go together much better than evolution and science. That is my observation and folks are free to disagree, I really don't care.

 

[rojse]

I don't know who you listen to so I can't really explain that.

Spirit gives life but in a very basic form and the quality of that spirit depends on the DNA/RNA meeting certain requirements.

Compare a calculator to computer. The calculator is equal to bacteria, the computer is an animal. Now what differentiates us from animals isn't spirit but soul. The soul is an evolved form of spirit that has it's own personality but lacks experience. So in comparison you could say that a human is a super computer.

I do not get your analogy about calculators or computers. You assume that a larger, more powerful machine is better, and I would disagree. My calculator takes less than a second to start, but my computer can take nearly five minutes. My calculator can do complex calculations in moments, but my computer takes much longer to do the same calculations. I can carry my calculator around anywhere, but I need to set my computer up at a power outlet.

I would also add that although a computer has severe limitations, very few of us would be able to calculate a value for pi, or add one hundred numbers in several seconds.

I do not know how this spirit evolves into a soul, because I do not know what you believe in terms of when a person receives a spirit or a soul, or how this comes about.

Symbiosis, in itself, does not give life. The bacteria you mentioned have their own DNA/RNA, thus, their own life. Now, having said that, symbiosis is a fact of every life form, even ones you do not see as being alive like the earth itself.

If a creature requires the presence of a different species to be able to live, then the lack of presence of symbiosis will remove life from both of the creatures. If we remove the presence of the second animal from the first, it soon dies. Although each of these creatures are alive, they do not survive when parted. Under your ideas, I am not sure how you consider these animals alive. Please explain.

You have dead objects that are a part of you and many live objects that are alive in their own right. Your cells are alive, they have their own spirit, they are a part of you, but they are not you.

My point about scientists not being able to create life is not something that will ever become possible although I don't doubt they will claim it anyway. Once you understand the nature of spirit you know it cannot be created by anything. It can only come from it's source.

And, as I stated, the scientists will never "create" life anyway, they will simply assemble a suitable DNA or RNA structure and it will attract the correct amount of spirit. This is the function of DNA/RNA. It is it's designed purpose. It's not something the scientists will create.

If you had bothered to read the article, you would be aware that this life would be created from inert materials - no changing DNA or RNA, but creating everything from base molecules.

I would like to know where this spirit will come from when this creature is created.

I find it hard to define what is an animal and what is a person based on spirits and souls, which we cannot define, let alone measure. If you come up with a spiritometer, which can detect spirits, or a soulometer (guess what it would measure) I will take heed of what you are discussing as a viable method of working out if something is a human or an animal.

 

[Super Universe]

I did not state that a more powerful machine was better, you did all the assuming. The computer is more complex and more able.

Spirit does not evolve into a soul. It's more complicated than that, I should have rephrased that answer.

A person does not receive a spirit. Spirit is attracted to suitable DNA/RNA. This spirit does not care or even know the form the DNA/RNA will program for. Spirit is dumb energy. It is not a being.

The spirit in DNA/RNA does not blend with the spirit in the DNA/RNA next to it. In any being, all of the spirit in each element of DNA/RNA does not combine. Each cell has it's own spirit energy. If you cut away a single live cell from your body you do not lose spirit, you can't because you never had it, the DNA/RNA has it.

I'm not sure where you are going with the symbiosis argument but not all symbiotic elements are alive. Our bones are dead, if removed we would likely die. Our teeth are dead but now we would likely live on if we lost them. Our fingernails are dead but we could live without them. Microorganisms live in our intestines, if removed from us we would likely die although they may live elsewhere. Our hair is mostly dead, if removed we will still live.

You wonder how I can consider these animals alive? They are considered alive because they can be killed.


I read the article, thank you very much. As I have said many times now, suitable DNA/RNA will attract spirit. If your scientists can finally assemble a tiny piece of RNA in the correct fashion then it will "magically" come to life and they will walk around so happy with themselves and they'll win a prize and have no idea what really just happened.

Where will the spirit come from when this RNA is finally formed? Where do you think? Also, nothing will be created, nothing will be destroyed. You don't have that power.

Just because YOU cannot define or measure spirit and souls does not mean others cannot. Your scientists are really bumping up against some very hard walls that they have built around themselves. One of them has to come down at some point.

You keep using the word "spirits". It's inaccurate for what we've been discussing. It's a misused word that describes a higher dimensional being that possesses something in our dimension. While this is possible it is not what I have been talking about. Spirit is simple energy that gives life, it has no sentience to it whatsoever.

Generally animals do not have souls because that would be regressive. Would you like to be an unknowing infant again? It is possible for a soul to want to relive an animal experience so it does happen but it's quite rare.

I don't have a spiritometer or a soulometer but some do.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

A person does not receive a spirit. Spirit is attracted to suitable DNA/RNA. This spirit does not care or even know the form the DNA/RNA will program for. Spirit is dumb energy. It is not a being.

How may I test to see if spirits actually exist? You seem to know alot about spirits...

The spirit in DNA/RNA does not blend with the spirit in the DNA/RNA next to it. In any being, all of the spirit in each element of DNA/RNA does not combine. Each cell has it's own spirit energy. If you cut away a single live cell from your body you do not lose spirit, you can't because you never had it, the DNA/RNA has it.

Do you have data available that I may see on this?

Generally animals do not have souls because that would be regressive.

It is interesting that NO ONE has ever been able to prove this. Saying it doesn't make it so.

 

[Super Universe]

Sigh... I've said many, many, times now. There are no SPIRITS.

There is only spirit, dumb energy with no intelligence. It gives life, simple motor function to biologic processes, it has no mind, spirit is not a being.

These beings that rarely possess humans are higher dimensional beings. They are evolved souls that have chosen selfish personalities and are stuck in the next dimension because they won't be allowed any higher.

Data? Believe it or don't believe it.

What I give you is a tiny sliver of the universe, anything more, absolute proof, would be handing you a Nobel Prize that you did not earn.

There are two kinds of laws in the universe, those physical laws that are unbreakable and general laws that all beings should abide by with consequences for breaking them. Giving unearned knowledge to immature beings is a violation of a general law. You have to earn it the normal way.

No one has ever been able to prove the existence of souls? No human. Oh, that's right, all those star systems above you in the night sky must be completely unoccupied. They must be because...?

 

[yossarian22]

Your scientists consider carbon to be an organic molecule, meaning that it is derived from and a part of living organisms.

Hardly. I would suggest you read a high school textbook.
Everything with carbon in it is not considered organic

It is also a part of dead organisms, thus, it does not give or attract life it is simply a building block of DNA/RNA which attracts spirit.

Dead organisms which become absorbed and are turned into a living being again

Carbon does not give life, nitrogen does not give life, neither does the joining of these two elements. Suitable DNA/RNA attracts life meaning you must have all of the elements (carbon/nitrogen/hydrogen/oxygen) that make up DNA/RNA in their proper places. Only then will spirit join with it.

So why aren't spirits attracted to TNT? Its got everything they could want in it.

DNA/RNA isn't life, it is the form that attracts spirit which is life. It is like giving movement to a childs toy, spirit is the battery and this battery only fits DNA/RNA.

But why?
The order?
Would a 1 block long piece of DNA be alive?

No, a virus does not have a spirit. I say this because humans have an incorrect idea of what spirit is. Spirit is not a being, it is like the city water system. Spirit is the water in the pipes, it goes where it's directed.

By blocks of elements in an arbitrary pattern?

My analogy is not broken.

yes it is. You say that unless you produce something out of nothing, then you are not creating. This has nothing to do with the point that non-life becomes life on a regular basis. Non living nitrogen is converted into a form usable by plants. A bit of that nitrogen forms into DNA. Becoming life.

That's all there is? Assembly and disassembly... You have quite a small view from your cheap seats, some day you will move up closer but not today.

And I suppose you have a larger view from your seat?

Show me where your laws of physics prove that non-life shall become life?

Its called the first law of thermodynamics.

Plutonium is a natural, though rare, element. Add it to the long list of things you don't understand about the universe.

Not the form that we make bombs out of.

I'm unfamiliar with the rules of debate?

Yep. I would suggest you read a book. Oh wait, is that to narrow for you?

Are these rules the same physics ones you were talking about that ensure that life comes from carbon and nitrogen and a spark?

Apparently reading comprehension fails you too. Perhaps it is too narrow again.
There is no creation of anything. It just changes forms.

Hehe... the spark always makes me laugh. It's cute though. You think that life needs an electric spark to get it going, hehe... You guys crack me up...

Apparently you cannot understand the spark argument in the slightest. It explains how the first organic molecule forms. Not all life.
And this coming from somebody who says there is a spirit which turns life on? It sounds like something you'd tell a 5 year old. Or coming from somebody who reads too many fantasy books.

I understand, you can't provide the evidence that spirit doesn't exist today. I'll wait...

I understand that you have absolutely no evidence behind your claims, and you still treat them as truths.

Plant mytosis? Cells are the most basic assemblers. They do not create carbon or nitrogen or oxygen, they split with each new cell receiving a full complement of genetic material. The cell is the most basic assembler.

And where do you think they get the materials they need to reproduce? Its from non-organic sources

I have a different perspective than you because you are stuck inside of the box that human theory has built around you.

I love how you assume your perspective is right. You assume that you are right and that every other view point is wrong and trapped because of the narrow confines of human thoughts even though you yourself are trapped in the same confines. Your "perspective" is hypocritical, arrogant, and senseless. "Prove a spirit doesn't exist" is ALL you have to back up your ridiculous claims, and yet you have to gall to say my perspective is limited?

 

[Super Universe]

Hardly. I would suggest you read a high school textbook.
Everything with carbon in it is not considered organic
Dead organisms which become absorbed and are turned into a living being again
So why aren't spirits attracted to TNT? Its got everything they could want in it.

But why?
The order?
Would a 1 block long piece of DNA be alive?
By blocks of elements in an arbitrary pattern?
yes it is. You say that unless you produce something out of nothing, then you are not creating. This has nothing to do with the point that non-life becomes life on a regular basis. Non living nitrogen is converted into a form usable by plants. A bit of that nitrogen forms into DNA. Becoming life.

And I suppose you have a larger view from your seat?
Its called the first law of thermodynamics.

Not the form that we make bombs out of.
Yep. I would suggest you read a book. Oh wait, is that to narrow for you?
Apparently reading comprehension fails you too. Perhaps it is too narrow again.
There is no creation of anything. It just changes forms.
Apparently you cannot understand the spark argument in the slightest. It explains how the first organic molecule forms. Not all life.
And this coming from somebody who says there is a spirit which turns life on? It sounds like something you'd tell a 5 year old. Or coming from somebody who reads too many fantasy books.
I understand that you have absolutely no evidence behind your claims, and you still treat them as truths.
And where do you think they get the materials they need to reproduce? Its from non-organic sources
I love how you assume your perspective is right. You assume that you are right and that every other view point is wrong and trapped because of the narrow confines of human thoughts even though you yourself are trapped in the same confines. Your "perspective" is hypocritical, arrogant, and senseless. "Prove a spirit doesn't exist" is ALL you have to back up your ridiculous claims, and yet you have to gall to say my perspective is limited?

I was explaining the meaning of "organic" which is something derived from and a part of living organisms. If you are going to misunderstand me, perhaps you could refrain from being rude.

All carbon is not turned into living beings again.

Spirits? What spirits? I never said spirits were attracted to anything since there is no such thing as spirits. I'm losing count of how many times you've misunderstood me.

Why? Huge answer but here's a quick simple response, because God didn't want to be alone.

The order? I don't know what you are asking here.

Would a 1 block long piece of DNA be alive? Nice try with the trick question.
Answer: If it isn't dead.

The pattern of RNA/DNA is not as arbitrary as you think.

Non-life becomes life? No, it doesn't. Nitrogen does not live, it does not become alive.
It is just nitrogen. Spirit may surround RNA/DNA, it may inhabit it, but the nitrogen/carbon/oxygen are not alive. An element inside a light bulb does not possess, own, or even know anything about the electrons that give it it's shine. The element is simply used as a vehicle.

My view is infinite. One you'd see if you could look up and open your mind.

You're going to have to give me your interpretation of how this human law proves that non-life becomes life.

Natural Plutonium is not the form that we make bombs out of? What does that have to do with the price of tea in china?

Ah, now the anger and insults come out. Is this because you are not the smartest person in the universe? Maybe it will help you feel better if I told you that everything I know was given to me. I discovered none of it.

A spark explains how the first organic molecule forms? Hmm, a spark does that now? Why don't your scientists try to "create" life by forming something without RNA/DNA in it? Yeah, go spark that.

Spirit doesn't turn life on, it is life.

Spirit is fantasy? Welcome to the real world.

Cells follow instructions they are given. They might take this or that and use it to make a copy but the copy better be within certain standards. Otherwise it fails to attract spirit, aka dies.

I assume my perspective is right? Uh, yeah.

I'm arrogant? Sigh... Fine then, be stubborn and don't learn a thing. Keep on sparking away...

I'm trapped in human confines... Are you sure about that?

 

[rojse]

Sigh... I've said many, many, times now. There are no SPIRITS.

There is only spirit, dumb energy with no intelligence. It gives life, simple motor function to biologic processes, it has no mind, spirit is not a being.

If spirit is an essence as you say, when it splits up and inhabits multiple beings, then it becomes multiple spirits. The plural of spirit is spirits, so I do not see how this can be a debate. Perhaps our perception of this could be, but please clear this up before we continue.

These beings that rarely possess humans are higher dimensional beings. They are evolved souls that have chosen selfish personalities and are stuck in the next dimension because they won't be allowed any higher.

Data? Believe it or don't believe it.

What I give you is a tiny sliver of the universe, anything more, absolute proof, would be handing you a Nobel Prize that you did not earn.

This sounds like a scientology speech - beings possessing humans and controlling them. I am not being dismissive of Scientology, but are you affiliated with them at all?

There are two kinds of laws in the universe, those physical laws that are unbreakable and general laws that all beings should abide by with consequences for breaking them. Giving unearned knowledge to immature beings is a violation of a general law. You have to earn it the normal way.

No one has ever been able to prove the existence of souls? No human. Oh, that's right, all those star systems above you in the night sky must be completely unoccupied. They must be because...?

What is this "general law?" How do you know of this law, and what makes you so special that you would be privvy to such knowledge?

No one has said anything about the existence or non-existence of aliens in this thread. But then again, we have not seen them land on the lawns of the United Nations buildings, either. Although I do believe in aliens, I don't think they have travelled billions of miles to earth merely to kidnap simple people and probe them in uncomfortable ways, either.

 

[Super Universe]

A single molecule of H20 is called water but when there are many of them you do not call it waters. A single photon is called light, but many photons are not called lights.

I am not affiliated with Scientology whatsoever.

The general law is as I described. The universe is designed for beings to grow, develop, and gain knowledge through a certain process. Think of a pyramid with the answer to a difficult physics problem being the top block, you must first discover and understand ALL the lower blocks of this specific pyramid before you will be allowed to discover the top block with the answer. This is the way God's library works. You have to earn it but all knowledge of God is available to you.

In the discussion of spirit you already have some of the blocks you just don't know how one block relates to another block in the pyramid. I'm only helping you put together a puzzle, you already have the pieces.

Why would aliens land on the lawns of the UN? Do you think the aliens respect the UN?
Some of them think of you as you think of cattle, do you introduce yourself to a cow? They come here because they are curious about God's newest addition to the universe. Some of them come here because you have something they desire - spirit.
There are many good aliens but they abide by the policy of non-interference, which is another general law.

 

[camanintx]

Just because YOU cannot define or measure spirit and souls does not mean others cannot.

I suppose you could just measure the midi-chlorians.