Salvation

[Thief]

Of course I did.

Right. You will be standing in trust rather than clinging for false idols and delusions to create a mock sense of certainty. Why shouldn't Chaos be acknowledged and embraced as much as apparent order?
What about it?

Here in this life, total chaos is held back.
Religion, politics, military, and economy, all come together to fix and control
most of what we do.

Virtually none of the above carry over.
And it is common to say,
'you came into this world naked...you will leave the same way'.

It is also common to say,
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

Can you trust it will be done unto you as you did unto others?

 

[doppelganger]

Here in this life, total chaos is held back.
Religion, politics, military, and economy, all come together to fix and control
most of what we do.

They do? You think religion, politics, military and economy reign over chaos?

Can you trust it will be done unto you as you did unto others?

You've got that backwards. Regardless, there is no "me," and there are no "others" except to the extent that I need to perceive it as such.

 

[Thief]

They do? You think religion, politics, military and economy reign over chaos?

These are the four basic motivators when dealing with your fellow man.
If you want to influence his behavior...his will...there you go.

You've got that backwards. Regardless, there is no "me," and there are no "others" except to the extent that I need to perceive it as such.

And in the after life you will have no need? to deal with others?

 

[doppelganger]

And in the after life you will have no need? to deal with others?

What is the "after life"? I don't have any idea what you are talking about. Fill me in on what it is and how you know about it.

 

[Thief]

What is the "after life"? I don't have any idea what you are talking about. Fill me in on what it is and how you know about it.

And this question raises doubt upon your motivation to participate in this thread.

If you have no faith in an after life...how do expect to discuss salvation?

 

[doppelganger]

And this question raises doubt upon your motivation to participate in this thread.

If you have no faith in an after life...how do expect to discuss salvation?

Maybe salvation has nothing to do with an "after life" but salvation from something in the now. Had this idea ever occurred to you?

 

[Thief]

Maybe salvation has nothing to do with an "after life" but salvation from something in the now. Had this idea ever occurred to you?

Yes.
If that item of salvation is delivered, here and now, then it becomes your life and code of behavior, here and now.

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you....
would be such an item.

Having been forewarned....you can make such practice....become accustomed to it....before it is dealt unto you by greater powers....in the next life.

Without it, there may be some 'difficulties'.

 

[doppelganger]

Yes.
If that item of salvation is delivered, here and now, then it becomes your life and code of behavior, here and now.

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you....
would be such an item.

Having been forewarned....you can make such practice....become accustomed to it....before it is dealt unto you by greater powers....in the next life.

Without it, there may be some 'difficulties'.

Again, what does this have to do with "belief in God" or an "after life" then? You keep changing what you are talking about.

 

[Thief]

Again, what does this have to do with "belief in God" or an "after life" then? You keep changing what you are talking about.

I didn't see a change.
Perhaps if your question was more to understanding salvation?

 

[Green Kepi]

Really? You sure? Sign me up.

Funny....

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Maybe salvation has nothing to do with an "after life" but salvation from something in the now. Had this idea ever occurred to you?

For the already dead, then salvation [resurrection] could only be after: life.

For those of us that are alive and living on earth at the time of Jesus 'glory' [Mt25v31,32] can have the prospect of remaining alive and keep on living right into the start of Jesus 1000-year reign over earth, thus being saved from death.

 

[Thesavorofpan]

Its also interesting to note that there is no need for faith for salvation in Judaism, based on the same books from the "old" testament that Christians believe form the foundation of their religion. In fact, there is no need to be saved from anything. Original sin and salvation by faith are entirely Christian constructions. Which is interesting, because you would think that if these were the two most important things for people to understand about there souls and final destinations, they would be believed in by Jews as well and be found in the "old" testament. But alas, they are not.

Your totally correct because in the old testament you received salvation by following the mosianic law right down to the dot, but in the new testament you received salvation from grace. Most Christians don't realize this, but whatever.

 

[Thesavorofpan]

I have never been able to grasp the idea of salvation by faith, and you're saved now. That makes no sense. You are supposed to be saved so you can make it into heaven. How can you know that you're saved if you haven't made it yet?

You can have all the faith you want that doesn't mean crap if the Grace of God isn't there.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Your totally correct because in the old testament you received salvation by following the mosianic law right down to the dot, but in the new testament you received salvation from grace. Most Christians don't realize this, but whatever.

The Mosaic law showed that no one could live up to it and mankind needs a Messiah, Savior or Deliverer from death because no one can resurrect oneself or another.

So salvation comes via resurrection.
Remember that Abraham know through Isaac all nations would be blessed through his seed. Abraham believed so strongly in the resurrection that he was willing to sacrifice Isaac knowing he would be resurrected back to him.

Since death is the price sin pays, then even those under the law paid the death price tag by their death. Doesn't Romans [6v7] say the one who has died is freed or acquitted from sin? So with the exception of the unforgivable sin of Matt 12v32; Hebrews 6vs4-6, all dead ones because of inherited Adamic sin [sin because of inherited imperfection] will be part of the resurrection of Acts [24v15].

Through God's grace, his undeserved kindness, we can gain life again.
Although death frees or acquits does not mean innocent, but as a governor can pardon a person so the crime [sin] charges no longer stick.
God sent Jesus to be our Redeemer, Savior, Deliverer, Messiah so the dead can live again.

As for those of us alive on earth at the time of Jesus 'glory' [Mt 25vs31,32] we can remain alive and keep on living right into the start of Jesus peaceful 1000-year reign over earth with having everlasting life in view with the prospect of never having to die.

 

[Thesavorofpan]

So salvation comes via resurrection.
Remember that Abraham know through Isaac all nations would be blessed through his seed. Abraham believed so strongly in the resurrection that he was willing to sacrifice Isaac knowing he would be resurrected back to him.

No Abraham had faith in God that God wouldn't let him kill Isaac.

"And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together" Genesis 22:8

 

[Thesavorofpan]

Since death is the price sin pays, then even those under the law paid the death price tag by their death. Doesn't Romans [6v7] say the one who has died is freed or acquitted from sin? So with the exception of the unforgivable sin of Matt 12v32; Hebrews 6vs4-6, all dead ones because of inherited Adamic sin [sin because of inherited imperfection] will be part of the resurrection of Acts [24v15].

8Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: Romans 6:8

Only if we be dead with Christ via Repentance/Baptism/Holy Ghost infillment.

 

[flipseven77]

Thier is way more to it than that to recieve salvation, you have to change your entire life and orchastrate it according to God's will

 

[uu_sage]

As a Christian Universalist, I take issue with the ideas of "salvation by faith", "salvation by character" and "salvation by works" In the case of "salvation by faith and "character" both these methods say that if you have strong faith or good character you are saved and if you don't one is dammed. In the case of "salvation by works" it says that if you do a certain number of works one is saved and if you don't meet that number of works they are damned. God's grace is not merited. One can not earn God's love or grace. It is freely given of God, and has nothing to do with human effort. Salvation is a process over one's life not just a one time event. Throughout our life's journey we become more aligned with God's love, and inclusion and we are reconciled.

 

[Misty]

8Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: Romans 6:8

Only if we be dead with Christ via Repentance/Baptism/Holy Ghost infillment.

Those seem like meaningless phrases to me!

 

[Thief]

Those seem like meaningless phrases to me!

Are you confessing your own inability?