Same Sex Marrige By a Church.

[jnm66]

I am judging none I am asking if anywhere in the scriptures is it condoned (homosexuality). If it is not then same sex marriage should not be carried out by a Christian church.

as far as i can tell-it should not be carried out in a Christian church.....

 

[jnm66]

Personally, I think it's their way of putting in place the principles of the Gospel: that most important above all else are the virtues of love, mercy, justice and faithfulness. Everything else is secondary. IMO, prohibiting same-sex marriage goes against these virtues.

I realize you're trying to stay true to the Bible, but I think that in your desire to abide by the words of the Bible, you lost sight of its larger message.

And honestly 9-10ths I dont find it to be the "principles"of the Bible really i think that it would be the exact opposite....

 

[Archer]

@ 9-10ths_Penguin
I do not disagree with the premise of love being the ultimate teaching or Christ. There is not any reason that one cannot Love his brother while at the same time not condone their activities.

Drinking is taboo in most Churches? Why? It is not what goes into the mouth that defiles the body but what comes out.

Should the Church condone alcoholism? No. Many Churches go to the extreme and shun any alcohol use.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

@ 9-10ths_Penguin
I do not disagree with the premise of love being the ultimate teaching or Christ. There is not any reason that one cannot Love his brother while at the same time not condone their activities.

I agree. I'm sure there are many gay-friendly Christians who love you but don't condone what you're doing here.

Drinking is taboo in most Churches? Why? It is not what goes into the mouth that defiles the body but what comes out.

Drinking isn't taboo in most churches. In fact, in most Christian churches the world over, alcohol is actually consumed during worship services.

Should the Church condone alcoholism? No. Many Churches go to the extreme and shun any alcohol use.

This is relevant how? Alcoholism causes significant measurable harm. Homosexuality causes no harm at all. The two aren't comparable.

 

[Archer]

I agree. I'm sure there are many gay-friendly Christians who love you but don't condone what you're doing here.

So you think I have issues with gays? I dont.

Drinking isn't taboo in most churches. In fact, in most Christian churches the world over, alcohol is actually consumed during worship services.

it is here in the Bible belt USA

This is relevant how? Alcoholism causes significant measurable harm. Homosexuality causes no harm at all. The two aren't comparable.

I am saying we should love oue Gay and Lesbian Brothers and sisters, we need not condone their activities.

We should love all of Gods children, we should not condone what is condemned in our holy book.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

So you think I have issues with gays? I dont.

Sure you don't. They're all God's issues, not yours, right?

it is here in the Bible belt USA

Even in "Bible Belt USA", I'm sure you've heard of the Catholic, Orthodox, and Episcopalian/Anglican Churches, haven't you?

 

[McBell]

I am judging none I am asking if anywhere in the scriptures is it condoned (homosexuality). If it is not then same sex marriage should not be carried out by a Christian church.

and I am STILL asking for the ones that command that same sex couples are not to be married.

I say STILL because you have not yet presented any.

Are you going to?

 

[gnomon]

For those who may have missed the point, I am only saying a Christian church can not by following it's own doctrine marry a same sex couple.

Now can anyone present a clear retort to this? NO it is not there.

Points of opinion are fine and dandy but there is nothing that can be presented that is from the Bible to counter what is in this post.

I got the point.

Which is exactly why I wonder where in the Bible the marriage of intersex people should be prohibited or condoned in the Bible.

It's like people act like these human beings don't exist.

 

[Archer]

and I am STILL asking for the ones that command that same sex couples are not to be married.

I say STILL because you have not yet presented any.

Are you going to?

Exactly what are you asking?

 

[Archer]

Sure you don't. They're all God's issues, not yours, right?


Even in "Bible Belt USA", I'm sure you've heard of the Catholic, Orthodox, and Episcopalian/Anglican Churches, haven't you?

My issues are with churches not homosexuals.

 

[Smoke]

For those who may have missed the point, I am only saying a Christian church can not by following it's own doctrine marry a same sex couple.

But you're wrong. You have this completely arbitrary and completely irrational rule that nothing is justifiable unless it's biblical, but there's no reason for any church to follow your little rule. You don't follow it yourself, which makes you a hypocrite as well as a bigot.

 

[Archer]

Some of you intrigue me, some of you challenge my intellect but most of you well........................ ..... Goodbye I am through here and thank all of you. I have learned nothing. There is no education here for the most part only contempt, lies, foolishness and some logic.

I think I am leaning toward becoming a fundamentalist or an atheist, both have similar attributes.

 

[gnomon]

:sleep:

and I am STILL asking for the ones that command that same sex couples are not to be married.

I say STILL because you have not yet presented any.

Are you going to?

Yes, Mestemia. Could you be a little more explicit. Kind of hard to understand when you say "the ones that command that same sex couples are not to be married". I don't get it. Are you talking about sheep? The economy?

I am judging none I am asking if anywhere in the scriptures is it condoned (homosexuality). If it is not then same sex marriage should not be carried out by a Christian church.

I'm pretty sure the Bible doesn't explicitly condone Swedish filmmakers creating stories exploring the human condition.

Is this what you are trying to say?

Some of you intrigue me, some of you challenge my intellect but most of you well........................ ..... Goodbye I am through here and thank all of you. I have learned nothing. There is no education here for the most part only contempt, lies, foolishness and some logic.

I think I am leaning toward becoming a fundamentalist or an atheist, both have similar attributes.

But you were doing so well.

 

[Magic Man]

For those who may have missed the point, I am only saying a Christian church can not by following it's own doctrine marry a same sex couple.

Now can anyone present a clear retort to this? NO it is not there.

Then why are you here? If you already know you're right, and you leave no room to listen to what others say, there's no point in debating, is there?

The real retort is that the Bible says a lot of things, and doesn't say a lot of things. People decide what they want to believe. Everyone interprets the Bible based on their own sensibilities. If you want to go by what the Bible actually says, then don't eat shellfish or wear clothes made of blends of fabrics. You pick and choose what you like from the Bible just as everyone else does. You're no more wrong or right than they are, but you certainly don't have the authority to say which things people should pick and choose to believe.

The other problem is that the Bible has been translated many times from ancient languages. Someone may translate a word as one thing, when the meaning was slightly different. Who knows what the original actually meant?

 

[Magic Man]

There is no education here for the most part only contempt, lies, foolishness and some logic.

I think it would be more accurate to say that there is no education here for you. Generally it's hard to find education for those who choose to ignore anything that goes against their beliefs. If you wanted to open up and listen, you'd find plenty of education here.

I think I am leaning toward becoming a fundamentalist or an atheist, both have similar attributes.

Are you implying that you're not already a fundamentalist? And, not that I expect an answer at this point, but what qualities do atheists and fundies share?

 

[jnm66]

:sleep:



Yes, Mestemia. Could you be a little more explicit. Kind of hard to understand when you say "the ones that command that same sex couples are not to be married". I don't get it. Are you talking about sheep? The economy?



I'm pretty sure the Bible doesn't explicitly condone Swedish filmmakers creating stories exploring the human condition.

Is this what you are trying to say?



But you were doing so well.

The Bible does yes it does explicitly state "not to lay with a man as a woman"
so also anywhere marriage is talked about it is between a man and woman.
If two people feel they love each other and they want to be together and are homosexual-that is their business.They can stay together and good luck to them...it just cannott be sanctified by christian church...nor is it to be legal "matrimoney"in Gods eyes nor the legal system....

 

[jnm66]

I think it would be more accurate to say that there is no education here for you. Generally it's hard to find education for those who choose to ignore anything that goes against their beliefs. If you wanted to open up and listen, you'd find plenty of education here.



Are you implying that you're not already a fundamentalist? And, not that I expect an answer at this point, but what qualities do atheists and fundies share?

I speaking for myself have found it to be fascinating the wide spectrum of views here...I think anyone who comes here can have an open mind and can learn many different points....you may not agree with all of them...but it does give you the ability and reason to do research....

 

[Bware]

As I understand it the King James version was the mos direct translation. I could buy a Latin Bible but it will not be there. So as I said show me. I doubt you can find any translation in any language that interpreted or not supports homosexual marriage in the church.

Pretty sure that in any translation of the bible the commandent "Thou shalt not judge" rings pretty true. It seems to me that you are really bothered by same sex marriage and are judging those who practice/desire it. Someone isn't following their doctrine very well, tsk, tsk.

 

[MoonWater]

Put up or shut up. No scripture no point.

This is the love spoken of, agape: selfless love of one person for another without sexual implications (especially love that is spiritual in nature)

since you have seen fit to repeat yourself then so will I.

"Do you think that just because two people are having sex that that automatically means it is not a relationship of "selfless love of one person for another" or that the love is not "spiritual in nature"?"

oh and another point: Is it not your own interpretation to say that those passages are referring ONLY to agape love? And if that is your own interpretation then surely others could interpret those passages as referring to love in all it's forms, whether sexual or asexual. Under that interpretation those passages WOULD be in favor of same-sex marriage.

 

[gnomon]

The Bible does yes it does explicitly state "not to lay with a man as a woman"
so also anywhere marriage is talked about it is between a man and woman.
If two people feel they love each other and they want to be together and are homosexual-that is their business.They can stay together and good luck to them...it just cannott be sanctified by christian church...nor is it to be legal "matrimoney"in Gods eyes nor the legal system....

It's not my business to state what any Church can sanctify or not. I really don't care anyway.

Nor do I really care that the Bible, quite apparently the OT, has a proscription against homosexual behavior.

What I do care about is when individuals use the Bible as an be all and end all of inquiry yet cannot answer this one simple question I ask them: What does the Bible state explicitly about intersex?