Satan's Claws (Santa Claus): Satanic Deception

[FFH]

I sure hope none of our POWs are LDS then.

"Thou shalt not bear false witness," for any reason.

Unless commanded otherwise.

You didn't read my later posts concerning this.

 

[DeepShadow]

Chronicles of Narnia does not violate any commandments and the reader is very much aware of the symbolism. No lion could ever be a God or Jesus Christ, all kids know that and when they are reading the story they know it's only fiction, whereas the Santa fable is told as truth to kids.

So suppose someone says to their kids that Santa isn't real, but that it's fun to pretend that he is. Then they go ahead and have all of the secular Christmas trimmings, pretending that Santa brought all their presents and filled their stockings, etc. The kids know their parents really did it, but have fun playing along.

Would you have a problem with this scenario?

 

[FFH]

Isaiah 5: 20
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

2 Nephi 15: 20
Wo unto them that call evil good, and good evil, that put darkness for light, and light for darkness, that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

 

[DeepShadow]

Isaiah 5: 20
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

2 Nephi 15: 20
Wo unto them that call evil good, and good evil, that put darkness for light, and light for darkness, that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

This is only begging the question yet again: if Santa is good, then calling him evil would be bad, and vice versa.

 

[BFD_Zayl]

this is highly amusing! i think i'll sit back and watch. seriously, is this entire thread a running inside joke? but FFH DOES have an argument... you ever watch the movie called Santa's Slay? santa is actually the child of satan and kills people! hey, hollywood made it up so it MUST be true you know... seriously folks... i was raised with the story of santa in my brain, i tried to act good all year round so i would be able to have fun in a time of desolation (to me winter is desolate, here at least) one can only go out in the bitter cold for so long before becoming bored. and if i could get that toy firetruck i wanted at christmas, hell, i would be entertained till the next years holiday. and when i was told Santa was not real, i really didn't care, as long as every year we could gather together as a family and share stories, laughs, and experiences, to exchange gifts and appreciation, then i was happy. so yes, that all seems very satanic.

 

[Quath]

Yes these were sins in the old testement. But these were part of the old law. When Christ came he gave us the new law and many of these old laws that goverened the Jews were done away with.

EDIT: Upon reading the thread I see this has already been brought up. Sorry.

Well, this is a tough part of theology. Jesus says that the laws are not filled until heaven and Earth pass away:

Matthew 5:18 - For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

He follows it up with

Matthew 5:19 - Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

So according to these verses, the laws are still in effect and you should not teach people to ignore them.

But say you do come up with some way to ignore them. Hw do you pick some and not others? Why is homosexuality worse than Sabbath breaking or eating lobster?

FFH seemed to reconcile it by saying the laws are in effect, but they are paid for in the afterlife. I am not sure if that is your position as well.

 

[Katzpur]

FFH seemed to reconcile it by saying the laws are in effect, but they are paid for in the afterlife. I am not sure if that is your position as well.

You can be sure that FFH's position on almost any topic is unique to FFH. Bless his heart, I think the best we can do is let him wear himself out.

 

[DeepShadow]

I sure hope none of our POWs are LDS then.

Let's be clear here, this is FFH doctrine, not LDS doctrine.

 

[DeepShadow]

Well, this is a tough part of theology. Jesus says that the laws are not filled until heaven and Earth pass away:

Matthew 5:18 - For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

But that verse itself distinguishes between things that "pass from" the law versus being "fulfilled." This difference is the crucial part.

 

[Bishka]

Show me any link to any talk, where any past or present church leader has expressed that they have taught the Santa story as truth, to their kids, and then acted this lie (that Santa is real) to it's full extent.

Any talk by any church leader.

Don't be an idiot.

Deepshadow posted several instances, besides, even if they told a little, that's still "mental child abuse" isn't it?

Stop beating around the bush and answer the damn question.

 

[DeepShadow]

Vaughn J. Featherstone actually recruited someone to dress up as Santa Claus. Seriously, read it yourself.

Can you provide any talks that preach against Santa Claus? If this is the pervasive evil you say it is, why are the prophets silent on it?

 

[FFH]

So suppose someone says to their kids that Santa isn't real, but that it's fun to pretend that he is. Then they go ahead and have all of the secular Christmas trimmings, pretending that Santa brought all their presents and filled their stockings, etc. The kids know their parents really did it, but have fun playing along.

Would you have a problem with this scenario?

Yes, it's very self serving and sends kids the wrong message.

It's an extremely self centered/self serving tradition, completely opposite of how Christ would want us to act.

I'll never forget going to a home of a family in desperate need of the basics of life with Bonnie Parkin (current General Relief Society President of the LDS church). This was over 20 years ago. I grew up with her in my ward for about 15 years. She was an example of the true "spirit of Christmas". She also took us to Liberty park fed hundreds of homeless individuals, part of a larger community effort. We cooked bacon and eggs for hundreds until we ran out. The line was so long and shocking to see.

She opened our eyes to real "in your face" poverty. After all isn't that the job of the Relief Society, to relieve the poor ??? She was the epitomy of that effort and an example to all she came in contact with. There are so many in need, yet we give ourselves gifts as if we really need them. Lose this tradition, it's very self serving and the opposite of what Christ taught us to do.

 

[Sola'lor]

Well, this is a tough part of theology. Jesus says that the laws are not filled until heaven and Earth pass away:

Matthew 5:18 - For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

He follows it up with

Matthew 5:19 - Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

So according to these verses, the laws are still in effect and you should not teach people to ignore them.

But say you do come up with some way to ignore them. Hw do you pick some and not others? Why is homosexuality worse than Sabbath breaking or eating lobster?

FFH seemed to reconcile it by saying the laws are in effect, but they are paid for in the afterlife. I am not sure if that is your position as well.

No I don't view this in the same way as FFH. The Law of Moses was given to the Children of Isreal after comming out of egypt. They were supposed to have been given the Law of the Gospel. But they were being wicked at the time the Law of the Gospel was given to Moses. THey were worshiping the golden calf at the time. So Moses smashed the first set of plates that contained the Law of the Gospel and went back up to the Mount where he recieve the Law of Moses. This law was a preperatory gospel. It was supposed to prepare the children of isreal to live the Law of the Gospel. Jesus brought the Law of the Gospel when He began to teach. So we don't live the Law of Moses anymore because Jesus brought us the higher law, the Law of the Gospel. The Law of the Gospel contains elements from the Law of Moses.

How do we determine which ones to follow? That's why we have modern prophets. So we can know what God's will is for us today.

I don't think eating lobster is a sin unless you are eating an unhealthy amount of it. I don't think homosexuality is worse than breaking the sabbath. I think both are serious sins.

 

[FFH]

This is only begging the question yet again: if Santa is good, then calling him evil would be bad, and vice versa.

Right, so should we call Santa good or evil.

I have no problem calling this fictional character evil, because he comes too close to being seen as a God of sorts in kids eyes, who are lied to and told that Santa is real.

This is very dangerous territory to be venturing into. Better to leave it alone and drop the tradition altogether, even if your kids finally figure out that Santa's not real, it's still a bad tradition.

 

[Sola'lor]

Yes, it's very self serving and sends kids the wrong message.

It's an extremely self centered/self serving tradition, completely opposite of how Christ would want us to act.

I'll never forget going to a home of a family in desperate need of the basics of life with Bonnie Parkin (current General Relief Society President of the LDS church). This was over 20 years ago. I grew up with her in my ward for about 15 years. She was an example of the true "spirit of Christmas". She also took us to Liberty park fed hundreds of homeless individuals, part of a larger community effort. We cooked bacon and eggs for hundreds until we ran out. The line was so long and shocking to see.

She opened our eyes to real "in your face" poverty. After all isn't that the job of the Relief Society, to relieve the poor ??? She was the epitomy of that effort and an example to all she came in contact with. There are so many in need, yet we give ourselves gifts as if we really need them. Lose this tradition, it's very self serving and the opposite of what Christ taught us to do.

You know FFH you have a good point with this one. Santa Claus is a tradition only more well off people can really afford. I think I might have to award this one to FFH.

 

[DeepShadow]

Right, so should we call Santa good or evil.

I have no problem calling this fictional character evil.

And I have no problem calling him good.

Begging the original question.

More to the point, a modern prophet felt the "true spirit of Christmas" in a little girl excited about Santa Claus. You have failed to respond to this. Was Thomas S. Monson wrong to call this the true spirit of Christmas?

 

[Francine]

This is very dangerous territory to be venturing into. Better to leave it alone and drop the tradition altogether, even if your kids finally figure out that Santa's not real, it's still a bad tradition.

Once kids learn that it's a rite of passage to drop belief in Santa, by the time they're ready for college they equate God with Santa and drop belief in God.

 

[Sola'lor]

Actually I heard in one culture somewhere they belive that the baby Jesus delivers gifts to all the children. But since He's still a baby an angel does it for him. I can't remember what nation has this tradition.

Of course we also need to keep in mind that the American Santa Claus isn't the only one. There and many different version with many different traditions. Maybe some of those would be more child friendly for FFH.

 

[FFH]

You can be sure that FFH's position on almost any topic is unique to FFH. Bless his heart, I think the best we can do is let him wear himself out.

You don't know me, I worked 83 hours last week and still found time to post here.

I'll keep posting my responses here as long as there's an interest

 

[FFH]

Vaughn J. Featherstone actually recruited someone to dress up as Santa Claus. Seriously, read it yourself.

Can you provide any talks that preach against Santa Claus? If this is the pervasive evil you say it is, why are the prophets silent on it?

Do I have to quote this scripture again ???

D&C 58: 26
For behold, it is not meet that I should command in all things; for he that is compelled in all things, the same is a slothful and not a wise servant; wherefore he receiveth no reward.


Figure it out yourself, that's why the Lord gave us minds of our own, so we can search these things out in scripture and see if it does or does not violate Christ's teachings.