Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I do not believe this verse is about Jesus Christ.
I believe that the kingdom of God will come to earth.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Second Coming
- Thread starter Jimmy
- Start date
Dave Watchman
Active Member
Still playing the God ot card viole? It's a clever card to play. This is where I say:
"But it's still premature, at this time, for that boy, a messenger from Godot or not, to make the declaration that Godot will not be arriving. This was also baked in the cake. "For where is the promise of His Coming?
They will say, “Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the beginning of creation.” - 2 Peter: 3-4
I'm using Brave Browser. When I search for something like: "the promise of his coming", it will first give an AI generated answer prior to the search results:
Promise of His Coming
The Bible speaks extensively about the promise of Jesus Christ’s return, emphasizing its certainty and significance. In 2 Peter 3:4, the apostle Peter writes, “And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.” This question, posed by scoffers in the last days, is a challenge to the promise of Christ’s return.Old Testament Proofs
The Old Testament contains numerous prophecies and allusions to the Messiah’s second coming. Examples include:- Isaiah 61:1-2, which speaks of the Messiah’s return to redeem Israel, and is quoted in Luke 4:18-19.
- Malachi 3:1-2, which describes the Lord’s return to purify and refine His people.
- Daniel 7:13-14, which foretells the Son of Man’s coming with power and glory.
New Testament Confirmations
The New Testament reinforces the promise of Christ’s return, citing Old Testament prophecies and adding new revelations. Key passages include:- Jesus’ own teachings on His second coming, such as Matthew 24:30-31, Mark 13:26-27, and Luke 21:27.
- The apostle Paul’s emphasis on the certainty of Christ’s return in 1 Corinthians 15:52-53 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18.
- The Book of Revelation, which describes the events surrounding Christ’s return, including His judgment of the world and the establishment of His kingdom.
The Promise Remains
Despite the passage of time and the challenges posed by scoffers, the promise of Jesus Christ’s return remains unchanged. It is a cornerstone of Christian doctrine, and its fulfillment is eagerly anticipated by believers. As Peter reminds us, “The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance” (2 Peter 3:9).(AI generated answer)
I remain confident at this time, Godot will be coming around the mountain when He comes.
Peaceful Sabbath.
Dave Watchman
Active Member
I know, you say that all the time. It's about God and His Christ. (Messiah). But, I figure you've made your mind up about it by now.
That's what I was saying too. It has to land back on earth for Judgement Day.
We shall see who's right.
Peaceful Sabbath.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I do not understand why Christians believe that Jesus Christ is going to return to earth. Where did that belief originate?
Jesus never promised to return to earth, not once in the New Testament. Jesus said His work was finished here and He was no more in the world.
Of course, that means that the return of Christ has to be another Person.
John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
John 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more.
John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Yes, I made up my mind 54 years ago.
I believe that Judgment Day is already here.
"The Day of Judgment of which Christ speaks is evidently identical with the coming of the Lord of Hosts, the Father, which was prophesied by Isaiah and the other Old Testament prophets; a time of terrible punishment for the wicked, but a time in which justice shall be established and righteousness rule, on earth as in heaven.
In the Bahá’í interpretation, the coming of each Manifestation of God is a Day of Judgment, but the coming of the supreme Manifestation of Bahá’u’lláh is the great Day of Judgment for the world cycle in which we are living. The trumpet blast of which Christ and Muhammad and many other prophets speak is the call of the Manifestation, which is sounded for all who are in heaven and on earth—the embodied and the disembodied. The meeting with God, through His Manifestation, is, for those who desire to meet Him, the gateway to the Paradise of knowing and loving Him, and living in love with all His creatures. Those, on the other hand, who prefer their own way to God’s way, as revealed by the Manifestation, thereby consign themselves to the hell of selfishness, error and enmity."
Yes we will. I believe there will be a Judgment day on earth and then another Judgment Day after we die.
We won't know about the second one until we die.
The God of card? With all due respect, I don't know what you mean. I do not play cards.
All I can say is that Christians claim their Jesus will return. And have been doing that for the last 2000 years. Observations do not seem to confirm that. There is really no evidence of any Jesus having landed here recently.
So, how is that Jesus any different from Godot?
the Bible? Are you joking?
That prophecy about scoffers is a self fulfilling prophecy. If I wrote a book that says that Mickey Mouse created the Universe, and that there will be scoffers of that, I would also fulfill that prophecy. Everyone can write ridiculous things and then prophecies about scoffers of that. That is not difficult.
Therefore, it is quite evident that the magic book you are addressing is nothing but the figment of the imagination of some Bronze Age people who had vastly more knowledge of goats than anything else.
And that could explain why your Jesus is missing in action. And He will always be.
Your New Testament is not believed by people who believe the Old Testament only. The Jews, for instance.
So, how are you going to sell your proposition to skeptics, when you do not even believe in a certain prophecy fulfillment yourself?
I ask because from my vantage point you appear to be greatly confused. You have big groups of believers in the same section of prophecy, while having believers in the same section coming to very different conclusions about the fulfillment of that prophecy.
So, how do you intend to convince skeptics, when you do not even agree among yourself?
Yes, you believe in promises. Good luck.
I am sure it is a cornerstone of Christian doctrine, but I think you have to explain why your Jesus did not show up.
So, why didn't He show up? Apart from Him not existing, what can say about His absence?
You know what I think? I clearly do not believe in that Christian nonsense. But if I did, I would ask myself: why hasn't Jesus fulfilled that prophecy?
And if I believed that, I would conclude that it its because Satan is not playing along.
Ciao
- viole
Last edited:
Dave Watchman
Active Member
That is funny. The God of Card. It must be American slang from the movies. Playing the Trump card. Playing the Trump card refers to a strategic move in card games, particularly in the west, where a player uses an unexpected advantage or a high-ranking card to gain an upper hand over their opponents. This term has also been metaphorically applied to situations outside of card games, where someone uses an unexpected strength, skill, or resource to gain an advantage. Card Game Context. I do not play cards either.
A couple of the 18 prophetic time periods from Daniel and Revelation predict His Visitation.
This was also baked in the cake. And can thereby be used as evidence. Those Jews from the Torah are blinded in part until the times of the Gentiles are completed.
"For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Jesus hasn't come yet because the "time" has not yet been fulfilled. Early in Mark, in 27AD, Jesus said that the "time" is fulfilled and the kingdom of God is at hand. He was referring to the fulfillment of a specific time interval. It's the only place that sets out the timing for the arrival of Messiah, the 7 and 62 weeks of Daniel 9. Those same two time intervals have been fulfilled again, based on the more modern decrees to restore Jerusalem which Newton talked about in his Daniel 9 commentary. The things Newton suggested to be looking for, appear to be here now.
Satan has no choice, the decreed end will be poured out on the desolator.
We are caught up in the Devil's bargain.
- Dave
Dave Watchman
Active Member
I think He's coming two more times. The next time is a Visitation where we meet Him in the air. Very soon now. Then He brings us back after the thousand years of Revelation 20. That's just how I read it. You don't need to believe that. You believe what you believe, and I will believe what I believe. And let time be the interpreter. I'm a believer
As long as you do not give a date, your clam is as believable as me telling that Jesus will appear in 125 billion years.
Does that mean that they also believe in Jesus being the Messiah returning soon?
Any evidence they do?
I spoke with an observant Jew recently. He shares the same prophecy. But he also claims you are blasphemous in believing that God has a kid, and call that kid a messiah is something that only crazy people can believe.
So, from my neutral vantage point, it is clearly apparent that you still do not agree on the basics.
And if you do not, as you clearly do, why would we take you seriously?
Yes, Of course. You can always say that. No matter what happens, that time is not fulfilled.
My opinion is clearly that He has not returned because there is no Jesus to start with. Obviously. You guys are all waiting for the return of a being whose existence was just the figment of the imagination of some writers. Sweet, but not very rational.
So, you will all die in the hope that your Jesus will still come. To vindicate you. All of you. Which He will not do, on account of His non existence. And that is my prophecy.
Ciao
- viole
Dave Watchman
Active Member
A bunch of people think it's 2030 because it's been 2000 years since Jesus' Crucifixion in 30AD. One guy thinks it's 2031, so he's subtracting 7 years for the tribulation to begin in 2024. I think it's happening now, that 7 year span, the final heptad, began already. It's near to it's conclusion now. Another guy, using my same method, has moved the goalposts by using a start date based on stone plaques he found on the sabils of the Old City of Jerusalem. He's doing this primarily because he's not seeing what he thinks he should be seeing regarding the trumpets, and vials and various other apocalyptic events.
The Jews have their own ideas about how their Messiah will come and what he will do. They have too many preconceptions of what their Messiah should do. I don't keep track of them. They missed the time of their first Visitation. Right now all they're doing is holding up a sign. A pretty big and important one, but still just a sign.
You shouldn't. But if you wanted to prove it, with the resources we have now at our disposal, you should be able to figure it out for yourself.
The times I'm talking about will be fulfilled quite soon. They are based on events which are not repeatable or replaceable in time. If I experience a signal failure then, I'll boost this thread up and post my empirical for it. It might be fun.
Careful now. Steady as she goes. I think I remember being band a couple times here, accused of prophetic utterings or something like that. I am not now, nor ever have been, a prophet. Lol.
Yes, that is how it works. Make a prediction, and when it does not happen, as it is always the case, then you go though the books and find a computation error. And you have being doing that for the last 2000 years. I mean, when the room for interpretations is so vast, you cold do that for the next million years.
I could use the same method and use my Italian Cooking Book as a sacred book able to make prediction of catastrophic events. That would be pretty easy. Let me see: I am planning to prepare some spaghetti for my family. I had a vision that I should do spaghetti all'amatriciana. Spaghetti all'Amatriciana requires some pork meat. We know that pork is where demons are usually casted to, for some reason. That is a clear sign that not only my family, but the entire womankind family will be possessed by demons, and that therefore the Messiah (in this instance the Messiah is a monster able to fly, and has clearly inspired my holy book), will soon land on earth to pick us all up, before demons take over the world.
That is not difficult. And if that does not happen, well maybe that is because I was intended to make lasagne, instead, and my visions were caused by bad digestion.
Easy peasy.
Ciao
- viole
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe Paul tells us that we will be changed in the trinkling of an eye.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe we lump the two visits as the Second Coming. The first is to the Mount of OLives and the second is in the air.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
We will be.
1 Corinthians 15
New Living Translation
The Resurrection Body
35 But someone may ask, “How will the dead be raised? What kind of bodies will they have?”
40 There are also bodies in the heavens and bodies on the earth. The glory of the heavenly bodies is different from the glory of the earthly bodies.
41 The sun has one kind of glory, while the moon and stars each have another kind. And even the stars differ from each other in their glory.
42 It is the same way with the resurrection of the dead. Our earthly bodies are planted in the ground when we die, but they will be raised to live forever.
43 Our bodies are buried in brokenness, but they will be raised in glory. They are buried in weakness, but they will be raised in strength.
44 They are buried as natural human bodies, but they will be raised as spiritual bodies. For just as there are natural bodies, there are also spiritual bodies.
50 What I am saying, dear brothers and sisters, is that our physical bodies cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. These dying bodies cannot inherit what will last forever.
51 But let me reveal to you a wonderful secret. We will not all die, but we will all be transformed!
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
…and just what exactly do you think this “secret” is?
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Just what he said it was. We will not die, but we will be transformed!
We will be buried as natural human bodies, and we will be raised as spiritual bodies.
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
We will not all die he said. That’s the secret. What’s he mean by it?
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
It means we won't die. The physical bodies of all people will die. After our physical bodies die our souls will leave our bodies and take on a new form and then we will continue to live in that new form. It will be a heavenly form, not a physical form.
“The world beyond is as different from this world as this world is different from that of the child while still in the womb of its mother. When the soul attaineth the Presence of God, it will assume the form that best befitteth its immortality and is worthy of its celestial habitation.”
(Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 157)
“The answer to the third question is this, that in the other world the human reality doth not assume a physical form, rather doth it take on a heavenly form, made up of elements of that heavenly realm.”
(Selections From the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 194)
Feedmysheep
Active Member
At an hour you think not.
For this reason you also be ready, because at an hour when you do not expect it, the Son of Man is coming. (Matt. 24:44)
That is why the believer who has His indwelling presence must practice to abide in Him.
That is that it is not a shock when His coming upon them from without is matched by their enjoyment of Him within.
And now, little children, abide in Him, so that if He is manifested,
we may have boldness and not be put to shame from Him at His coming. (1 John 2:28)
Feedmysheep
Active Member
Christ trained His first disciples to live by His invisible presence.
This is why after the resurrection He alternatively appeared to them and was hidden from them.
Over the course of these weeks before His public asension He trained the disciples - they must
realize that He was with them though they could not see Him. And they got well trained.
In His coming again the same is true. Those who practice and develop the habitual abiding in the Holy Spirit
will be ready. The shock will be to those who have not developed the habit to enjoy His inward presence.
In the first rapture only those who are "watching" - vigilant - setting their mind on the spirit where the Spirit of
Christ is within them, will be prepared to be raptured. Those who were caught off guard will have to learn the hard
lesson of passing through the 3.5 year great tribulation to be raptured at its end.
Watching is not watching the sky. It is watching to live in oneness with His indwelling presence.