Smoker's Rights vs. Everyone Else's Rights

[Poisonshady313]

I've quit dozens of times. Do you know what "addiction" means?

Have you tried Easyway yet? Has it not worked for you?

 

[Storm]

I'm about halfway through. Hasn't done much good yet.

 

[Poisonshady313]

I'm about halfway through. Hasn't done much good yet.

I wouldn't worry about that. If it was supposed to work at halfway through, it would only be half as long as it is.

I'm interested to know how you feel about it once you've completed it.

 

[IsmailaGodHasHeard]

I am so tired of smokers forcing their habit on others. People have the right to be in a smoke free environment.

 

[Storm]

I am so tired of smokers forcing their habit on others. People have the right to be in a smoke free environment.

No, they don't. As for "forcing," how many laws are there preventing smoking, compared to those encouraging it?

ETA: "Many people find smoking objectionable. I myself find many things objectionable. I do not like adults who roller skate, children who speak French, or anyone who is unduly tan. I do not, however, run around enacting legislation and putting up signs."

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No, they don't. As for "forcing," how many laws are there preventing smoking, compared to those encouraging it?

IMO, as long as it's legal to smoke in the same house or car as a minor, I don't think there are enough laws preventing it, frankly.

 

[Storm]

IMO, as long as it's legal to smoke in the same house or car as a minor, I don't think there are enough laws preventing it, frankly.

That wasn't the question.

 

[Poisonshady313]

IMO, as long as it's legal to smoke in the same house or car as a minor, I don't think there are enough laws preventing it, frankly.

I grew up in the same house, and often being in the same car, with a smoker who would smoke in the house and in the car in my presence, and I have not been adversely affected by it.

There's a lot more hype about the dangers of second hand smoke than is justified.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

ETA: "Many people find smoking objectionable. I myself find many things objectionable. I do not like adults who roller skate, children who speak French, or anyone who is unduly tan. I do not, however, run around enacting legislation and putting up signs."

If you have adults roller skating across your lawn, you have legal recourse. Why shouldn't people who find smoking objectionable have similar recourse?

I enjoy listening to loud music in my car. I also prefer to keep my windows rolled down when I'm driving around town. However, any time when I think this might disturb people, I roll up the windows and turn down the volume. Am I being overly sensitive to the feelings of others?

 

[Storm]

I enjoy listening to loud music in my car. I also prefer to keep my windows rolled down when I'm driving around town. However, any time when I think this might disturb people, I roll up the windows and turn down the volume. Am I being overly sensitive to the feelings of others?

No. I stay away from non-smokers when I light up. I don't go onto other people's lawns, and if I did, I would move when asked.

What about the people who see me smoking on a park bench, come sit next to me, then cough ostentatiously and tell me to move. How considerate are THEY?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I grew up in the same house, and often being in the same car, with a smoker who would smoke in the house and in the car in my presence, and I have not been adversely affected by it.

How do you know? Plenty of people exposed to hazardous substances still have health that's in the normal range; this doesn't mean that the substance doesn't cause ill effects... it doesn't even mean that the person themselves wasn't adversely affected.

A sample size of 1 isn't even enough to calculate a standard deviation. And I doubt that you had an identical twin who grew up in a smoke-free home who we can use as a baseline.

There's a lot more hype about the dangers of second hand smoke than is justified.

Yes - people get way too worked up about cancer and lung disease. :areyoucra

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No. I stay away from non-smokers when I light up. I don't go onto other people's lawns, and if I did, I would move when asked.

Do you smoke upwind of other people's lawns?

What about the people who see me smoking on a park bench, come sit next to me, then cough ostentatiously and tell me to move. How considerate are THEY?

It's probably not the best use of their time, but I don't think that a person's necessarily being unreasonable if they happen to want to breathe comfortably even when they're tired from walking.

 

[Storm]

Do you smoke upwind of other people's lawns?


It's probably not the best use of their time, but I don't think that a person's necessarily being unreasonable if they happen to want to breathe comfortably even when they're tired from walking.

 

[Poisonshady313]

Yes - people get way too worked up about cancer and lung disease. :areyoucra

That's what I'm talking about. The studies put out by the EPA and by the WHO were based on dishonesty and lies... and other organizations which proclaim the same conclusion, that second hand smoke causes cancer and lung disease... rely on that initial dishonest EPA study. If you actually read the study put out by the WHO, you'll see that it doesn't find a connection between second hand smoke and cancer.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

That's what I'm talking about. The studies put out by the EPA and by the WHO were based on dishonesty and lies... and other organizations which proclaim the same conclusion, that second hand smoke causes cancer and lung disease... rely on that initial dishonest EPA study. If you actually read the study put out by the WHO, you'll see that it doesn't find a connection between second hand smoke and cancer.

Wait - are you talking about the study that the WHO itself says was misrepresented?

And are you seriously arguing that there have only been two studies on second-hand smoke?

 

[Mathematician]

Second hand smoke is a health hazard, smoking should be banned. Done.

Please no. We don't need to be paying billions of dollars to chase down millions of non-violent offenders. We already do that with weed.

 

[Poisonshady313]

Wait - are you talking about the study that the WHO itself says was misrepresented?

Yes.

And are you seriously arguing that there have only been two studies on second-hand smoke?

No.

 

[Mathematician]

I really hope people realize you can't "ban away" addiction. Effectively making it impossible to smoke anywhere is just unenforceable.

 

[Kathryn]

... "the property owner" in question being the owner of the property that's subject to the smoke, whether or not it's the property where the smoking is actually happening.

To an extent - but the occasional whiff of the scent of someone smoking on their own property is something that I think people should just deal with in a tolerant society.

For instance, if someone's smoking in the apartment below you and you can smell the smoke through an open window - damn, people, close your window (thanks, ssainhu). The same people smoking below you are the ones your kid wakes up when he's running through the house after they've gotten home from working the night shift. You expect them to exercise some tolerance - practice what you preach.

 

[Kathryn]

IMO, as long as it's legal to smoke in the same house or car as a minor, I don't think there are enough laws preventing it, frankly.

Are you going to make it illegal to drink in the same house as a minor too? Are you going to make it illegal to smoke in the backyard or on your front porch if a minor is around? Are you going to make it illegal for parents to allow their grandchildren to be around Grandpa when he's smoking? Are you going to make it illegal to give an overweight kid a piece of candy? Are you going to make it illegal to give an overweight baby any more than three bottles of formula a day? Are you going to make it illegal for parents to allow preteens to skip breakfast on school days? Are you going to make it illegal for parents to allow kids to play video games for more than two hours a day?