Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
It kind of does.
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Solution to homosexuals is by government executions according to Pastor.
- Thread starter Twilight Hue
- Start date
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
How so? What is the word we should use for a person with a penis or a vagina? Just because there are other possibilities does not mean we do not have a word for these two cases. Is biological female/biological male acceptable?
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
It appears that you are conflating gender and sex. Gender is how one expresses oneself, sex deals with whether one has an XX or XY chromosome pair. If one is born with a penis or vagina. He/she/they whatever is more of a gender issue. It is how one expresses oneself. If a guy told you his name was Bob it would be rude to call him "Rob" and even worse to call him Steve. Why would you call someone a name other than they wish? When a person tells you that they prefer to be referred to as "he" and is biologically female what difference does it make to you? Why insult a person by not calling them what they preferred to be called? It won't harm you. Calling them something other than they wish can harm them.
Are you worried that you might date a transwoman by mistake?
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
I am not confusing gender and sex. I have repeatedly said I will call anyone whatever they want to be called. My question remains. What do we call a person with a penis or vagina? What word do we use? is biological male/biological female acceptable? I seem to get pushback from those terms.
JDMS
Academic Workhorse
I think most trans people are fine with the the use of those terms (biological male/female) as long as you use them appropriately. Additionally the most accepted terms are "assigned male/female at birth" (AMAB, AFAB). The reason these are preferred is because after a certain amount of hormone therapy, trans folks begin to break away from their biological sex. For example, a trans man (female to male) who has been on testosterone for several years will need male doses of certain medications or drugs. They are somewhere between biologically male or female. So AFAB would be the most accurate. Hope this made sense!
EDIT. You could also say genotypically male or female.
This is all coming from a trans person fyi.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
The issue is for many reasons a man may not have a penis. But he's still a man, even if traditional societal views would say otherwise.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
You call them what they want to be called.
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
Ok, thank you. I did not know about the AMAB and AFAB terminology.
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
I agree. I am only asking what a person with a penis or vagina is called. It was answered by someone else.
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
I do. Now what do we call a person with a penis/vagina? If you don't want to answer the question JDMS did.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
I already answered that. You just responded to that post.
By the way, when you first meet someone how would you know how they are equipped?
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
And I expanded on this question to bring up the point going by genitals isn't a consistent means of defining people, and that's before the trans issue is brought.
muichimotsu
Holding All and None
No, that's not remotely what I said, you assume there are essential traits about being a man or a woman that are purely physical in nature, but those don't manifest absolutely even in cis women. Do you think all women have to have a uterus and particular secondary sexual traits we tend to associate with being female? Because then you're discounting probably more women than you realize.
Transition is more complex than you're making it and it's far more about internal perception and experience than just what society tells you, because that is not set in stone or indicative of any absolute truth remotely, it's always in flux. Blue used to be associated to girls and pink to boys and in some cultures, pink is considered a masculine color.
There's nothing that is an absolute definer, but if that's what you want, you're going to be disappointed that such a thing doesn't really apply to much, especially because we aren't static entities, we change necessarily over our lives in countless ways, gender identity and expression (which are 2 thinigs that are distinct, btw, even if they can intersect) are just 2 of them, alongside sexual orientation, sexual behavior, religion/spirituality, etc.
If you want people to fit into a neat box, I think the problem is with your expectations, not how people behave in a way that is not demonstrably harmful in any way, in the same sense that other things not conforming to a comfortable status quo for white colonizers and the like is not the end of society as we know it, except in that society is changing, something you appear to be threatened by
muichimotsu
Holding All and None
More importantly, why is it anyone's business unless it's a situation that directly involves your genitals?
muichimotsu
Holding All and None
Except the assigning is often done by people having cisnormative assumptions in the first place, like with this stupid stunt of gender reveal parties that essentially is just telling people about your baby's genitals without being upfront about it. Even the person who popularized it admits it's a dumb idea now and it's exploded (no pun intended) into stuff that has literally caused property damage and other major damages because we can't just not be extra about everything out of insecurity.
So much of these accusations about grooming are by people who want to act like hetero people sexually abusing children is not a thing when objectively, the stats I'm pretty sure, indicate that is the case far more than non hetero people
muichimotsu
Holding All and None
Except we generally are talking about gender, not sex, when we are referring to people and their identity thereof that can incidentally align with sex. If your first question when you meet a person is their sex, I'm pretty sure you're cruising to be on a registry
Guitar's Cry
Disciple of Pan
In biological terms, it would be female/male, gonadally. But it's far more complex than that, because the sexual organs don't always develop the same and there are hormonal and genetic aspects to sex that may be different. Even brain structure plays a part. But in social terms, when referring to gender, it depends on how they present and what they identify as. Consider what I had stated before: without checking a person's genitals, performing a genetic or hormonal test, you just don't know (and I do recognize that you stated you would use their preferred terms). A person could have all the biological markers of male or female, or a mix of these (genetically female but gonadally and hormonally male), but present socially as different.
One of the things about biology as a science is, it's messy. It's not quite as black and white as other sciences.
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
Yet, this is not my question. I am not defining anyone by their genitals. I have said many times I will call anyone what they want to be called. This has been answered by JDMS and I am satisfies with that answer.
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
Sigh, I just asked a simple question that JDMS answered. No one else did.