State Senator Proposes Mandatory Vasectomies for Nebraskans

[SomeRandom]

we used to have those lines to deny treating them well and respecting their rights.

Okay, now I get what you mean.

So can you provide me with a logical argument that a blastocyst should enjoy the same rights we give to a pregnant woman?
For reference this is literally a picture of what is called a blastocyst.
Google Image Result for https://www.mayoclinic.org/-/media/kcms/gbs/patient-consumer/images/2013/08/26/11/02/my01648_im04680_mcdc7_in_vitro_culture1.jpg
I mean, it’s quite literally a few dividing cells.
That’s not me denying it is a potential human being in the making, that’s just the reality of the situation. It is a fact, whether we like it or not. Let us deal with facts, not emotions

At such a stage, it’s not even close to viability. Hell the cells might even just be expelled from the uterus, because that’s just what happens sometimes.
(You know? A miscarriage which can occur before the person even knows they’re pregnant to begin with.)

 

[Truth in love]

Okay, now I get what you mean.

So can you provide me with a logical argument that a blastocyst should enjoy the same rights we give to a pregnant woman?
For reference this is literally a picture of what is called a blastocyst.
Google Image Result for https://www.mayoclinic.org/-/media/kcms/gbs/patient-consumer/images/2013/08/26/11/02/my01648_im04680_mcdc7_in_vitro_culture1.jpg
I mean, it’s quite literally a few dividing cells.
That’s not me denying it is a potential human being in the making, that’s just the reality of the situation. It is a fact, whether we like it or not. Let us deal with facts, not emotions

At such a stage, it’s not even close to viability. Hell the cells might even just be expelled from the uterus, because that’s just what happens sometimes.
(You know? A miscarriage which can occur before the person even knows they’re pregnant to begin with.)

it’s human and it’s alive, therefore we should not kill it. That’s my entire point.

I’m well aware of stages of development, miscarriages etc.

There is a lot in life we cannot control, but we can: not kill in mass the unborn.

there is no shortage of people willing to adopt an infant.

 

[Wildswanderer]

That does not support your claim. You are adding an unjustified interpretation to it.

Remember in the day of an eye for an eye in the Old Testament the killing of a fetus would at the most result in a fine.

Wrong.
When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine. But if there is harm, then you shall pay life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe.

Under the law, killing an unborn baby was punished by your own death.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Wrong.
When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine. But if there is harm, then you shall pay life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe.

Under the law, killing an unborn baby was punished by your own death.

Sorry, but you are wrong.

What do you call it when the interpretation of a Bible is changed for political reasons?

 

[SomeRandom]

it’s human and it’s alive, therefore we should not kill it. That’s my entire point.

I’m well aware of stages of development, miscarriages etc.

There is a lot in life we cannot control, but we can: not kill in mass the unborn.

there is no shortage of people willing to adopt an infant.

Okay. Just so I’m not misunderstanding or misrepresenting you, you are arguing that a few divided cells (a blastocyst specifically in this case) is alive and constitutes a human being?

I’m sorry, I respectfully disagree. It’s at best a potential human being. But at the end of the day, factually and biologically speaking, it’s quite literally a mass of cells. And nothing else.
It has potential to develop further, but that’s all it has. Potential.

I fail to see why I should recognise some divided cells the same way I would an infant or even a fetus at a viable stage of pregnancy.
Abortions typically occur well before viability anyway and late term abortions are for medically necessary procedures only. So I mean it’s a sad thing to happen, sure. I don’t relish that occurring. But I just don’t tend to give the same weight to some dividing cells as I do to an actual fetus. Sorry.

Am I to worry about killing bacteria too? I mean, by the same metric of the dividing cells being classed as a “alive” then bacteria are alive and constitute life as well.
So every time I spray some Glen 20 am I committing murder or killing organisms?

 

[Wildswanderer]

Sorry, but you are wrong.

What do you call it when the interpretation of a Bible is changed for political reasons?

What interpretation? It says right there that if the unborn baby is harmed, the penalty for the perp is the same as what happened to the baby.

 

[Subduction Zone]

What interpretation? It says right there that if the unborn baby is harmed, the penalty for the perp is the same as what happened to the baby.

The interpretation that you used. And you dodged a reasonable question. So I will take that as you admitting that you were wrong.

 

[Wildswanderer]

The interpretation that you used. And you dodged a reasonable question. So I will take that as you admitting that you were wrong.

As long as you don't mind being totally illogical. Shrug.

 

[Subduction Zone]

As long as you don't mind being totally illogical. Shrug.

No, that would be you. Do you have a good reason for running away from a reasonable question? People do that when they know that they are wrong.

Do you think that it is okay to change the interpretation of the Bible for political reasons?

 

[Wildswanderer]

No, that would be you. Do you have a good reason for running away from a reasonable question? People do that when they know that they are wrong.

Do you think that it is okay to change the interpretation of the Bible for political reasons?

It wasn't changed.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It wasn't changed.

Really? And you can prove that? Or are you just making a statement that you wish was true.?

You should know that I do not make claims that I cannot support. And my stupid mouse is still not here, but I can tell you how you can verify that I am right and I will gladly do so once you own up to your laughably ignorant error.

 

[Truth in love]

Okay. Just so I’m not misunderstanding or misrepresenting you, you are arguing that a few divided cells (a blastocyst specifically in this case) is alive and constitutes a human being?

I’m sorry, I respectfully disagree. It’s at best a potential human being. But at the end of the day, factually and biologically speaking, it’s quite literally a mass of cells. And nothing else.
It has potential to develop further, but that’s all it has. Potential.

I fail to see why I should recognise some divided cells the same way I would an infant or even a fetus at a viable stage of pregnancy.
Abortions typically occur well before viability anyway and late term abortions are for medically necessary procedures only. So I mean it’s a sad thing to happen, sure. I don’t relish that occurring. But I just don’t tend to give the same weight to some dividing cells as I do to an actual fetus. Sorry.

Am I to worry about killing bacteria too? I mean, by the same metric of the dividing cells being classed as a “alive” then bacteria are alive and constitute life as well.
So every time I spray some Glen 20 am I committing murder or killing organisms?

It a line drawn to deny life.

yes we do kill Bacteria and bugs in bulk. But human like should be protected.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It a line drawn to deny life.

yes we do kill Bacteria and bugs in bulk. But human like should be protected.

Why? What is "human" about a blastocyst? Or an embryo? Or even a fetus? Being human is more than a collection of cells to me.

 

[Wildswanderer]

Really? And you can prove that? Or are you just making a statement that you wish was true.?

You should know that I do not make claims that I cannot support. And my stupid mouse is still not here, but I can tell you how you can verify that I am right and I will gladly do so once you own up to your laughably ignorant error.

Um you make the claim, you prove it.
Try using search and peck on your phone and you will understand way I keep my posts short.

 

[Wildswanderer]

Why? What is "human" about a blastocyst? Or an embryo? Or even a fetus? Being human is more than a collection of cells to me.

He is never anything other than a human, being composed of humans DNA.
It's illogical to suppose he's some other species.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Um you make the claim, you prove it.
Try using search and peck on your phone and you will understand way I keep my posts short.

No, you made a claim that you need to prove. I can prove mine. We know that you can't prove yours.

Do you have any older Bibles in your house. I can pick one up in my house that shows that you are wrong. My mouse is supposed to arrive by 8:00 PM today and then I can link and show that you are wrong, or if you just own up to your error I can tell you how to find it right now.

 

[Subduction Zone]

He is never anything other than a human, being composed of humans DNA.
It's illogical to suppose he's some other species.

Nope, a human being is more than a clump of cells. By your standards when a polyp is cut out you cannot "kill it" because it is composed of DNA and given the right conditions one could make another person with it.

And remember, not even the Bible supports you.

 

[Ashoka]

Wrong.
When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine. But if there is harm, then you shall pay life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe.

Under the law, killing an unborn baby was punished by your own death.

Yet, in Numbers 5:11-31 gives instructions on how to have an abortion. From God himself.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yet, in Numbers 5:11-31 gives instructions on how to have an abortion. From God himself.

That is only because the interpretation of Exodus 21 22 was changed in the mid 1970's when US Christians first became very heavily into their antiabortion movement. Earlier I quoted from my housemates Catholic Bible printed in the 1960's. It is hard to find a church that has been antiabortion as long as the Catholics. It is a relatively recent movement among Protestants. But even that Bible said "miscarriage" and not "premature birth". The King James version is rather poetic and can be read in more than one way. I am waiting for my new mouse to arrive so that I can copy and paste again.

@Wildswanderer just does not want to face facts when it comes to this topic. I earlier asked him what he thought of the Bible being changed for political reasons and he could not answer that question. He had to go into instant denial. All he has to do is to admit that he might be wrong and I will give him the info so that he can find this for himself.

 

[Wildswanderer]

No, you made a claim that you need to prove

Nope you made the claim.