The bible and gays

[chessplayer]

It is not a big deal really to sacrifice oneselves when we know we will return, alive and kicking, after onLy three days and ready to take off to take control of the Universe with powerful Dad. I would do it, anytime, probably.

HMM , You would willingly be impaled with a crown of thorns and crucified etc and all for something you weren`t guilty of .

And when the ones you were doing it all for, were cursing you, and hammering in the nails. Are you sure ?

Anyway ,the difference is that you would have done it all for nothing , whereas He did it for others eternal benefit.

 

[leibowde84]

HMM , You would willingly be impaled with a crown of thorns and crucified etc and all for something you weren`t guilty of .

And when the ones you were doing it all for, were cursing you, and hammering in the nails. Are you sure ?

Anyway ,the difference is that you would have done it all for nothing , whereas He did it for others eternal benefit.

I think he's saying that if he was Jesus, and knew that he would be fine afterwards, he would do it to save everyone's soul. In other words, there is no actual risk, just temporary pain.

 

[viole]

HMM , You would willingly be impaled with a crown of thorns and crucified etc and all for something you weren`t guilty of .

And when the ones you were doing it all for, were cursing you, and hammering in the nails. Are you sure ?

Anyway ,the difference is that you would have done it all for nothing , whereas He did it for others eternal benefit.

I would definetely think about it. If I had the absolute certainty that I will come back in full glory to rule the Universe?

Well, i mean, why not? I would do it even if that does not save anybody from sin. If it does, that would be a welcome bonus.

Wouldn't you?

Ciao

- viole

 

[sojourner]

Now that surprises me , pray elaborate ,

Have you ever heard of the BIA -- Bureau of Indian Affairs? It's one of the very best examples of the (white) government being "Big Daddy White Boss." The First Nations don't need our "guidance" or our "help." that's only keeping them in a state of dehumanization. What they need are opportunities to establish their cultural and sovereignty heritage alongside ours.

 

[chessplayer]

The First Nations don't need our "guidance" or our "help." that's only keeping them in a state of dehumanization. What they need are opportunities to establish their cultural and sovereignty heritage alongside ours.

And does this not happen, are you saying they are denied opportunities ? that`s amazing in this Democratic society, why would a government do that and also put billions of dollars in welfare into these areas ., would it not be easier to give them opportunities and take away their welfare handouts ?

A society which I do admire is the only one I know of that rarely covets our materialism , the Masai from East Africa, still mostly as they were hundreds of years ago. Still proud independent unique people. One of their traditions is to chase lions off their kill and steal the meat, the most excitement our kids get nowadays is buying a new smart phone app.

 

[sojourner]

And does this not happen, are you saying they are denied opportunities ? that`s amazing in this Democratic society, why would a government do that and also put billions of dollars in welfare into these areas ., would it not be easier to give them opportunities and take away their welfare handouts ?

There's no easy fix, because the whole thing becomes a catch-22 cycle. One notable exception that I'm aware of is the Cherokee Nation. It would be nice if all Nations had the same clout and wherewithal. It would be nice if the US government would cede the First Nations their lands and sovereignty. But apparently it's too much of a security risk to do that?

 

[chessplayer]

There's no easy fix, because the whole thing becomes a catch-22 cycle. One notable exception that I'm aware of is the Cherokee Nation. It would be nice if all Nations had the same clout and wherewithal. It would be nice if the US government would cede the First Nations their lands and sovereignty. But apparently it's too much of a security risk to do that?

I can see how the US government could find this difficult to conclude to everyone's satisfaction , but I can`t quite see how missionaries are to blame for all this chaos.
Looking at it from an ideological basis could affect one`s view , but what about the NA Christians point of view depicted in the " withoutreservation . com " ,/ ask an elder , website as quoted before. They agree about the issues but also agree that forgiving and moving on is best for everybody. It`s poisonous to hold a grudge and to hold unforgiveness.

 

[Pudding]

I can see how the US government could find this difficult to conclude to everyone's satisfaction , but I can`t quite see how missionaries are to blame for all this chaos.
Looking at it from an ideological basis could affect one`s view , but what about the NA Christians point of view depicted in the " withoutreservation . com " ,/ ask an elder , website as quoted before. They agree about the issues but also agree that forgiving and moving on is best for everybody. It`s poisonous to hold a grudge and to hold unforgiveness.

Assume if God exists.
Is it best for God to agree that forgiving and moving on is best for everybody? It's poisonous to hold a grudge and to hold unforgiveness and blame everybody for the mistakes of Adam and Eve, assume that Adam and Eve indeed exists before.

Does God have already moving on and forgive everybody? If he has, then i suppose the forgiving is conditional, right? What is the condition? The condition of needing to obey him wholeheartedly even if the person finds there's no convincing evidence to believe in him? Does it make sense for the person to do so when there've many other religion's God which is as equally exists as the God?

 

[JoStories]

I think you have got that all wrong

What countries in Africa have you been to ?

Can you be a bit more specific ?

I'm curious what I got wrong. And I spent a year in Zimbabwe.

 

[JoStories]

But you have moved on ?,

Possibly that unforgiveness is destroying the NA people from within , as the perpetrators of the " crimes " you mention have long since passed away.

Every country has had terrible things done to them , eg the Jews , the Scots, the Irish , the Albanians, the Polish , the Dutch, victims of Stalin , Hitler, Pol Pot, all the crimes committed by the Roman occupations etc etc etc.

Wallowing around in self pity and unforgiveness is self destructive.

That was incredibly unfair. No where did I say I was not moving on or that I am wallowing in self pity and frankly, I find that rather offensive. I said I will not forget. There is a vast difference there. In all my life I have had many opportunities to get handouts due to what mom's people had done but I did not use any, even for college. and trust me, a PhD is expensive so I could have but rather than wallow..your words...I chose to make my mom and dad proud by doing it on my and and representing my tribe. I wanted to be an example to the younger members of my tribe of what we can do without the need for the white man. Destroying my people from within?? You have deeply offended me with this post. I will not forget that either.

 

[sojourner]

I can see how the US government could find this difficult to conclude to everyone's satisfaction , but I can`t quite see how missionaries are to blame for all this chaos.
Looking at it from an ideological basis could affect one`s view , but what about the NA Christians point of view depicted in the " withoutreservation . com " ,/ ask an elder , website as quoted before. They agree about the issues but also agree that forgiving and moving on is best for everybody. It`s poisonous to hold a grudge and to hold unforgiveness.

It's not about holding grudges, it's about doing away with the systemic violence that's flying under everyone's radar.

 

[chessplayer]

..I chose to make my mom and dad proud by doing it on my and and representing my tribe. I wanted to be an example to the younger members of my tribe of what we can do without the need for the white man. Destroying my people from within?? Okay , you disagree , what is affecting them so badly then .You have deeply offended me with this post. I will not forget that either.

Sorry I have no intention of offending you , ,The subject of my sentence was supposed to be the NA in general terms and not you in particular . I know very little about in the NA people , but I am willing to learn .
However I do know that for example the highland clearances were a terrible injustice done to rural Scots , but they moved on , some of them died , lots of them prospered in the US .

Almost every society has had injustice done to them , would you not agree ?.

 

[sojourner]

Christianity is a gift , all you require is to accept then it`s yours , but it can`t be mixed.

Sure it can! Because it's not *really* a religion. It's the way of love. Love will work with any religion.

 

[JoStories]

Sorry I have no intention of offending you , ,The subject of my sentence was supposed to be the NA in general terms and not you in particular . I know very little about in the NA people , but I am willing to learn .
However I do know that for example the highland clearances were a terrible injustice done to rural Scots , but they moved on , some of them died , lots of them prospered in the US .

Almost every society has had injustice done to them , would you not agree ?.

What you don't understand is that NA's are a tribal people. When you insult one you insult all. Yes. we are moving on and reclaiming our culture. Most tribes have their own medical facilities, schools, etc, and are trying to teach the old languages, and so on. But we as a people will never forget what was done. I wish you could see the difference between not forgetting and remaining stuck in a victim mode. I assure you, we are the former.

 

[chessplayer]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=815124448524086

 

[chessplayer]

What you don't understand is that NA's are a tribal people. When you insult one you insult all. Yes. we are moving on and reclaiming our culture. Most tribes have their own medical facilities, schools, etc, and are trying to teach the old languages, and so on. But we as a people will never forget what was done. I wish you could see the difference between not forgetting and remaining stuck in a victim mode. I assure you, we are the former.

Sounds good , but can you see my point about , eg the Jews ?

 

[JoStories]

Sounds good , but can you see my point about , eg the Jews ?

What point was that please?

 

[chessplayer]

What point was that please?

My awareness of the NA is limited to , a little common knowledge and a book I read recently" kiss the sunset pig " by Laurie Gough. She was a young idealist wanting to change the world , starting in the NA culture , helping where she could then seeing what was next . Good amusing stuff , but she was horribly disillusioned only after a few days teaching in a tribal school , perhaps you have read it ?

 

[Norman]

Well of course, but I believe that most homosexuals are much more friendly than our so called heterosexuals, and also most religious morals, they are just all round friendly people,

Norman: That blanket statement with out information to back up your opinions doesn't offer me any substantial evidence. I really think you are going to be entrapped by your own statements here.

they are just all round friendly people, you should get to know some..

Norman: I have two friends that are homosexuals and both are married to there partners. I went to the wedding of one of them in Hawaii.

 

[Norman]

I guess if you are comfortable with your constraints, more is the power to you. You are correct that I think there should be limits to free speech. Publishing how to books for rape is one that I think should be banned period. Yet, they persist and that makes me sick. Also hate tracts from people like the KKK and Skin Heads, etc. I would really prefer to move to another country, such as Canada or the UK or Australia because this country is doomed. Our government is a joke and while we were once a world power, we are now a laughing stock.

Norman: Hi JoStories, are you referring to the United States of America?