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The Big Bang Theory is dead.

Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Sargonski said:
Probably is lack of gravity as you say .. certainly not the cosmic rays .. which are causing the real evolution ..
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I cannot say for sure, but I think that a cosmic ray striking DNA would fry it. Radiation in general can cause mutations, and we have plenty of that. But cosmic rays are so powerful that they would just scramble the info in a cell. The cell would quickly die.
 
S

Sargonski

Well-Known Member
Subduction Zone said:
Neanderthals were a sister or brother species to us. We did not evolve from them.

Here is a cladogram of human evolution. Homo heidelbergensis was our "link" to Homo erectus:

View attachment 83378
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we evolved from a common parent somewhere down the line .. which is all that matters to show evolution -- we were close enought to be able to mate with them .. showing small gradual changes over time. Apparently -- when you get your DNA done - they can tell you how much Neanderthal DNA you have .. and apparently more is better .. less suceptible to disease ..
 
blü 2

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
SavedByTheLord said:
God made man, not the other way around.
It is mentioned in Romans.
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We know a lot more about the evolution of Homo sapiens than they did in 50 CE. Through no fault of their own they had no idea of the nature of the universe, its age, what stars and galaxies are, a heliocentric solar system, the age of the earth, the evolution of life on earth, that the earth is spherical, all that stuff ─ as indeed I showed you by quoting the bible.

We don't know how long H sap sap was around before the concept of supernatural beings became general. Perhaps it was quite early, as some aspects of very early burial rites hint. But certainly there was no Yahweh in 2000 BCE, whereas there were God's ancestors the gods of Mesopotamia by then, and gods of Egypt and probably many many more that left no record.
 
S

Sargonski

Well-Known Member
Valjean said:
Which claim is actually evidenced?

No. It's only a link if it's incorporated into the chain; if it becomes an established feature of a population.

Define "twin."
Twins may be formed with identical genomes, but with every cellular generation the identity deteriorates. Genetic changes occur throughout one's lifetime. Environmental variations -- like space travel -- can increase mutation rates.
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I know it is not a link .. technically you can say it was connected to the link .. but -- sometimes that mutation does become an established feature .. just not all ... very few in fact .. regardless .. makes no difference to the point which is that mutations happen .. and this is how evolution works.

Turned out the changes were only epigenetic .. so the twin was still geneticly a twin ..

"Space Travel" :) all those cosmic rays gonna make many mutations.. probably not a good thing for the crew
 
cladking

cladking

Well-Known Member
Sargonski said:
There is nothing stating the changes can not be abrupt .... adapting to some kind of environmental change .. and there has been no sinking of the survival of the fittest theory .. and we do see rather gradual evolution in many cases .. just because there are links and gaps does not sink evolution. .. its not like you find everything over a billion years .. stuff gets wiped out.

In particular we see a large degree of evolution in humans over a relatively short period of time Neanderthal to Homo Sapien. Survival of the fittest is reality in proper context .. taken out of context you have Eugenics :)
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I have not seen any evidence for gradual change. I believe it is certainly possible for a species to change gradually but i doubt it is common because niches don't last long enough.

I believe "survival of the fittest" is a mirage created by a very poor perspective about life and its nature. Life is about cooperation and consciousness much more than it is about competition and chaos. Some species live so short a time they rarely experience chaos.
 
S

Sargonski

Well-Known Member
cladking said:
I have not seen any evidence for gradual change. I believe it is certainly possible for a species to change gradually but i doubt it is common because niches don't last long enough.

I believe "survival of the fittest" is a mirage created by a very poor perspective about life and its nature. Life is about cooperation and consciousness much more than it is about competition and chaos. Some species live so short a time they rarely experience chaos.
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Then perhaps you need to look harder --- The change between Neanderthal and Homo Sapien .. once the same species with the same parent .
We see gradual changes in humans every day via mutations .. really teeny tiny changes .. we see larger changes over time in features and so forth ..

Survival of the fittest is a loaded term .. most well adapted is a better description .. but there are other factors impacting the genetic path .. you can be better adapted than the next tribe over the hill but that hill protected them from the Tsunami that wiped the more well adapted tribe.
 
Valjean

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
cladking said:
I suppose if a gene didn't turn off or on properly the individual would be less "fit" and die. Mebbe over the course of a few generations needed genes would be reproduced and unneeded ones fall off like the eyes of fish that moved into caves.
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By what mechanism?
 
Valjean

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Sargonski said:
I know it is not a link .. technically you can say it was connected to the link .. but -- sometimes that mutation does become an established feature .. just not all ... very few in fact .. regardless .. makes no difference to the point which is that mutations happen .. and this is how evolution works.

Turned out the changes were only epigenetic .. so the twin was still geneticly a twin ..
Click to expand...
Exactly! I never claimed it wasn't. I'm just pointing out that there's a chance of mutation with every cell replication, and, in sexual species, a mixing of genes with every birth.
Beneficial changes tend to be passed on and accumulate in a population. Deleterious one tend to be weeded out.
Sargonski said:
"Space Travel" :) all those cosmic rays gonna make many mutations.. probably not a good thing for the crew
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Agreed! -- You won't find me going up in one of those things.
 
SavedByTheLord

SavedByTheLord

Well-Known Member
Valjean said:
Exactly! I never claimed it wasn't. I'm just pointing out that there's a chance of mutation with every cell replication, and, in sexual species, a mixing of genes with every birth.
Beneficial changes tend to be passed on and accumulate in a population. Deleterious one tend to be weeded out.

Agreed! -- You won't find me going up in one of those things.
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And that just shows that you do not understand mutations or how sexual reproduction works.
 
Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
SavedByTheLord said:
And that just shows that you do not understand mutations or how sexual reproduction works.
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1696914803657.png
 
Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
SavedByTheLord said:
Ironic how evolutionists have abandoned the scientific method completely.
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They haven't. You simply do not understand it and prove that by running away from offers to discuss it.

There is a reason that creationists lose all of their court cases. Judges are experts on the concept of evidence. They can easily understand the concept of scientific evidence and can see that creationists have no evidence. It is just a hysterical religious belief. They can also see that scientists do have scientific evidence for evolution. The last few cases have been slam dunks for teaching evolution and banning creationism, even with conservative judges.
 
McBell

McBell

Admiral Obvious
SavedByTheLord said:
I have many more questions to ask?
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Yes.
Yes you do.
We have seen the long list of questions you have.
Sadly, you have been completely unable to demonstrate you understand any of them.
You have completely demonstrated you do not understand how they would refute evolution.
You have completely demonstrated you do not understand the answers to your long list of questions.
You run tail tucked whenever confronted point blank with a truth you dislike.


Yeppers.
All the making of Pigeon Chess.
 
SavedByTheLord

SavedByTheLord

Well-Known Member
McBell said:
Yes.
Yes you do.
We have seen the long list of questions you have.
Sadly, you have been completely unable to demonstrate you understand any of them.
You have completely demonstrated you do not understand how they would refute evolution.
You have completely demonstrated you do not understand the answers to your long list of questions.
You run tail tucked whenever confronted point blank with a truth you dislike.


Yeppers.
All the making of Pigeon Chess.
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Where did the first living creature come into being?

What do you think of the evidence from the Mount Saint Helen’s eruption?
Rock layers and a carved out canyon just like the Grand Canyon. And in such a short time.
And what about the inaccuracy of even an isochron dating?

www.icr.org

Remembering Mount St. Helens 35 Years Later

The volcano’s main 1980 eruption filled in an entire valley with hundreds of feet of sediment. Another smaller eruption event deposited more material on top of that, and then a third deposition occurred in 1982. Later, a catastrophic flood of snowmelt water and muddy debris tore a gash through...
www.icr.org www.icr.org
 
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