The Cause without a Cause

[F1fan]

Jesus was not created, he was always part of the one God.

Oh, so thst whole "born to a virgin in a manger" story is a fraud?

Of course God is not inherently any gender, although he appeared in the flesh as a man.

So when you call God "he" you are just assigning a gender identity to "him"? You are so progressive. Good for you becoming liberal.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

God became incarnate in Christ. No need for a messenger.

Christ is not a person. Jesus, born as a human, was Christ, Christ is not a surname.

Christ means "Annointed One". Thus Jesus was Annointed of the 'Holy Spirit', not the human spirit like us. Jesus and all Messengers are born with this capacity, this is the meaning of the virgin birth.

The Holy Spirit is given of God, it is an emanation of the Attributes given of God, the most great Spirit, the Holy Spirit is notGod in Essence.

So Jesus was indeed the 'Self of God' for us, a Messenger given of God, the perfect reflection of the Attriburltes of the Holy Spirit, but not God in Essence, who as the Most Great Spirit does not decend into creation, into imperfection.

When one reads the Bible knowing this, one realises that it is Christ that will return, the Holy Spirit will be Annointed to another Messenger, with a New Name, a name the Lord will announce, and has announced.

It is the Bab and Baha'u'llah, IMHO

Regards Tony

 

[blü 2]

It makes sense to me why President Lincoln's spirit would linger at the White House. I'm sure he was troubled by what he had to deal with in his personal life and as the president, not to mention worrying about the Civil War during his term in the White House. To be honest, it wouldn't surprise me if his spirit was deeply troubled and unable to crossover. I've read a few stories about his troubled life.

But why the White House? Why not Ford's theater or its site?

And in what form do ghosts exist? If they can be seen then they're material. If they can be photographed, they're material. If they can make sounds, either voice or knockings, then they're material. If, poltergeist style, they can propel objects around the room, they're material. So it seems only fair to say, Really? Then show us, no?

If you've ever had goosebumps on your arms and the hair on your arms and neck stand up, or if you felt like you were being watched even though you knew you were alone, then you were in the presence of a spirit or spirits.

No, I'd say getting the creeps is a response to unknown situations, very usually in darkness. Creatures that have impaired sensory detection of threats in such circumstances survive better by avoiding them, hence humans have the capacity for the creeps ─ and also a symbiosis with dogs, whose sensory awareness of potential threats in the dark is much superior to humans.

It seems to me that what the ghost hunters lack is any testable hypothesis, any repeatable experiment, to account for their claims. I don't doubt the sincerity of some of them, but I indeed doubt the sincerity of others of them.

 

[blü 2]

I think most of us believers are not suggesting Lincoln spends 24/7 still as a ghost loitering in the White House. Most would think he has an active intelligence and shows himself in a familiar place and appearance at some rare times.

But why? Why not FDR, who spent longer there than any other president and died in office? Why not JFK, who was assassinated? Indeed, why not Millard Fillmore, remarked only for his unimportance?

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Don't know about God, but will not make a categorical statement about 'a thing' or 'nothing' with Quantum Mechanics looking over my shoulder.

If you think the concept nothing represents anything other than nothing, then that is crazy, but then I understand that English is your second language.

Now quantum mechanics can look over anyone's shoulder, it they find something where there was thought to be nothing, then it just means the science in question was in error, it does not change the meaning of nothing!

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Is this religious belief that lacks evidence and credibility, or are you making a factual claim about reality?

It is a claim about reality. What do you understand the meaning of nothing to be, something or nothing?

 

[George-ananda]

But why? Why not FDR, who spent longer there than any other president and died in office? Why not JFK, who was assassinated? Indeed, why not Millard Fillmore, remarked only for his unimportance?

I guess I don't 'get' your question. It's almost like asking, why not everybody all the time? A ghost appearance is a rare effort for reasons we cannot see on the surface. Some might. Some might not ever.

 

[blü 2]

I guess I don't 'get' your question. It's almost like asking, why not everybody all the time? A ghost appearance is a rare effort for reasons we cannot see on the surface. Some might. Some might not ever.

I'm seeing no rhyme or reason, so it seems fair to ask.

 

[George-ananda]

I'm seeing no rhyme or reason, so it seems fair to ask.

Fair to ask, and I answered it only appears random to us because all we can see is the physical level.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

But why on earth (or as the case may be) would the ghost of Lincoln want to hang around the White House at all?

Very good & valid question! Great use of reasoning!

Note there were other links I gave, not tied to ‘ghosts,’ but to spirits. I referred to all as invisible, intelligent and powerful entities.
The point I was making, is not their identity; but rather, that these intelligent beings exist.

I could understand the ghost of Donald Trump unable to wake from its dream of being President,

Lol! You’d never get him out of there! Good one.

I can remember times when (a lot younger than now) I've had the creeps (including one where I turned and ran) but that's not the same thing as seeing or hearing or otherwise detecting spooks via the senses.

I agree…but these people have.

Im gonna contact you in PM (Conversation)

 

[F1fan]

God is not nothing, God is infinitely present. By definition nothing does not exist.

Is this religious belief that lacks evidence and credibility, or are you making a factual claim about reality?

It is a claim about reality.

OK, then provide facts that your claim that God is not nothing. God must be something, yes? OK, what is that thing, and what are the facts that inform our knowledge about it?

What do you understand the meaning of nothing to be, something or nothing?

Is the word "nothing" confusing? It isn't to me. But I won't play word games with words, syntax, and definitions.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

OK, then provide facts that your claim that God is not nothing. God must be something, yes? OK, what is that thing, and what are the facts that inform our knowledge about it?


Is the word "nothing" confusing? It isn't to me. But I won't play word games with words, syntax, and definitions.

God is all that exists!

Haha,,, why do you refuse to accept that the concept of nothing means no thing, nothing, zilch, naught, zip, nil, zero, diddly squat?

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Fair to ask, and I answered it only appears random to us because all we can see is the physical level.

My husband will often ask me, "What do you see?" And then he'll ask me to describe what I see to him whenever he sees me standing still and I seem to be gazing off into the distance. I was like that when we were sightseeing in Boston in early June. Of course, I've seen plenty of spirits from different historical eras (such as spirits of Union and Confederate soldiers at Civil War battlefields; the spirits of pioneers, Native American spirits at burial mounds; and spirits of sailors in decommissioned WWII submarines that are open to the public), but seeing many spirits from the 18th century colonial era was a first for me. We visited the Paul Revere House and the Old North Church, and then we went to the USS Constitution. I immensely enjoyed the first two locations because of the spirits I saw, but I could only use my ghost hunting equipment at the Old North Church because cameras weren't allowed inside the Paul Revere House.

And although I had a good experience at both of these locations, I especially liked going to the USS Constitution. I enjoyed it so much, in fact, that my husband and son left me there by myself for more than an hour so I could document more of my experiences as well as have more time to interact and communicate with the spirits onboard. We went to the Salem Witch Museum the next day, but the museum was too crowded and loud for me to document my experiences while I was there. I posted a thread (click here) about my experiences at these locations, as well as some evidence that I documented at the Old North Church and the USS Constitution.

 

[Brian2]

I mean, cool assertions and definitions. I could just assert other things in the same way. For example:

"All the humans that exist are always conscious and no cause is needed." "Everything I do is good, so no one can force me not to do good." "I could stop that man in front of me from molesting that kid, but that would take away his free will and stop him from being human."

Do you see how ridiculous this sounds, when applied to anything that isn't a core emotional part of your self-identity due to your indoctrination? What you said about your god sounds just as ridiculous to non-Christians.

You could assert anything you want and yes there are parts of what the Bible tells us that no doubt sound ridiculous to non Christians including yourself.
And it should be remembered that I am explaining what the Bible tells us and so am not just asserting things from my own ideas.
If you want to see God as just another human, as the pot and not the potter, as part of the creation and not the creator who is miles above any part of His creation in any way, then that is your prerogative but it means you are doing injustice to the Bible story even if you see it as being a work of fiction.

 

[George-ananda]

My husband will often ask me, "What do you see?" And then he'll ask me to describe what I see to him whenever he sees me standing still and I seem to be gazing off into the distance. I was like that when we were sightseeing in Boston in early June. Of course, I've seen plenty of spirits from different historical eras (such as spirits of Union and Confederate soldiers at Civil War battlefields; the spirits of pioneers, Native American spirits at burial mounds; and spirits of sailors in decommissioned WWII submarines that are open to the public), but seeing many spirits from the 18th century colonial era was a first for me. We visited the Paul Revere House and the Old North Church, and then we went to the USS Constitution. I immensely enjoyed the first two locations because of the spirits I saw, but I could only use my ghost hunting equipment at the Old North Church because cameras weren't allowed inside the Paul Revere House.

And although I had a good experience at both of these locations, I especially liked going to the USS Constitution. I enjoyed it so much, in fact, that my husband and son left me there by myself for more than an hour so I could document more of my experiences as well as have more time to interact and communicate with the spirits onboard. We went to the Salem Witch Museum the next day, but the museum was too crowded and loud for me to document my experiences while I was there. I posted a thread (click here) about my experiences at these locations, as well as some evidence that I documented at the Old North Church and the USS Constitution.

Thanks for sharing. Must be interesting to be you.

 

[F1fan]

God is all that exists!

Really? Cool, let's see the evidence.

Haha,,, why do you refuse to accept that the concept of nothing means no thing, nothing, zilch, naught, zip, nil, zero, diddly squat?

I don't.

So don't forget to present evidence that any sort of god exists. I can't wait to see you back up your fantastic claim.

 

[F1fan]

You could assert anything you want and yes there are parts of what the Bible tells us that no doubt sound ridiculous to non Christians including yourself.

Right, and that's because the fantastic, non-factual elelments of the Bible can't be believed true. Why? Not only the lack of evidence, but that these stories are contrary to what we know of reality. You are asking rational thinkers to accept fictional stories and trat them as if factual.

And it should be remembered that I am explaining what the Bible tells us and so am not just asserting things from my own ideas.

What makes your explanation necessary if the Bible is so clear? And let's not ignore how Christians disagree about what the Bible means greatly, so your interpretation is more accurate than other Christians, why?

If you want to see God as just another human, as the pot and not the potter, as part of the creation and not the creator who is miles above any part of His creation in any way, then that is your prerogative but it means you are doing injustice to the Bible story even if you see it as being a work of fiction.

No, we thinkers want claimants to provide facts and evidence for their fantastic claims. If you can't, we defer to the default of not being convinced.

 

[Wildswanderer]

Oh, so thst whole "born to a virgin in a manger" story is a fraud?


So when you call God "he" you are just assigning a gender identity to "him"? You are so progressive. Good for you becoming liberal.

No to both.
Born of a virgin in human form does not equal a beginning of Life. He always was God before he had a human form.

God is Spirit. A Spirit is neither male or female but can have elements of both.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

If God is the uncaused cause, if literally nothing-at-all is responsible for God's existence, what then stops another God from arising from nothing-at-all?

Equally, why suppose the uncaused cause is eternal, and hasn't since transformed/passed/retired/moved to his next world?

 

[lewisnotmiller]

If another God did arise, how would anyone know? Nobody can even prove the God that exists exists.

God can.