The Coffee House - the UU Fellowship Thread

[Trey of Diamonds]

May I also suggest:

Notable American Unitarians 1740-1900 amazon
Notable American Unitarians 1936-1961 amazon

Both are published by the Harvard Square Library but can also be found online. The links above are to the amazon listing and the ones below are for the online version.

Notable American Unitarians 1740-1900 online
Notable American Unitarians 1936-1961 online

 

[lilithu]

Freedom Moves West: A History Of The Western Unitarian Conference. This one mostly seems useful for our specific geographical area, though I'm sure that it has fascinating information in general.

Three Prophets Of Religious Liberalism: Channing-Emerson-Parker

A History of Unitarianism. He told me that it was out of print. I found out just now that it's all printed online! Thanks for inspiring the search, since it sounded like one of the most fascinating works he recommended.

Soul Work: Anti-Racist Theologies In Dialogue. This seems to be a particular issue for Rev. Clyde, and rightly so.

The Larger Faith: A Short History Of American Universalism

Also, any decent biography of Olympia Browne, who sounds like an amazing person and fascinating character.

He additionally suggested "Up In Flames", but I'm having a hard time finding that one.

I hadn't heard of the first one or the last one. Thanks!

And btw, I *love* Soul Work. Definitely a must read. Start with Rosemary Bray McNatt's essay! (Tho just to warn you, if you didn't already know, it dwells more on what's wrong with us as a denomination than other UU books which talk more about how great we are.)

 

[J Bryson]

Well, most of what I've read so far tends to lean towards the self-congratulatory, so I don't mind checking out another perspective. I did try to find some UU criticism online, but mostly ran into disaffected UUs who wanted something stringent, fundamentalist sites, and one secular humanist who said that she didn't "feel anything".

 

[J Bryson]

May I also suggest:

Notable American Unitarians 1740-1900 amazon
Notable American Unitarians 1936-1961 amazon

Both are published by the Harvard Square Library but can also be found online. The links above are to the amazon listing and the ones below are for the online version.

Notable American Unitarians 1740-1900 online
Notable American Unitarians 1936-1961 online

Very awesome. Thank you!

 

[Storm]

So, I spoke with Rev. Disruid yesterday about joining the lay ministry. I won't be able to apply till fall of next year, maybe not even till the year after that. it's kind of a bummer, but otoh, I have time to reflect on whether it's something I really need/ want to do.

 

[J Bryson]

Well, that's a bit of a pain, but like you said, it does give you time to reflect. It's too bad, though, as one would think that we could always use more help from people who are willing to lend a hand.

 

[Storm]

Well, I understand why it's not done constantly. It's not something you just jump into, there are interviews, applicant screenings, and training programs. It's a major responsibility, they want to make sure you're ready for it. I just hope that they do it on schedule (next fall) is all.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

as one would think that we could always use more help from people who are willing to lend a hand.

Help is always appreciated but as Storm pointed out, this is a professional position that requires training. Trust me, if you want to help folks will bend over backward to find something for you to do.

 

[J Bryson]

Yes, but I'd like to see the training more widely available to those who profess an interest. I can see why not, though, as time and resources are always an issue. It's just that the evangelicals birth litters of evangelists on a daily basis, and we're already way behind in numbers. I'd like to see a lot more well-trained UU ministers (lay and professional) out there, helping society and showing that not all religious paths need to be judgmental and damnation-oriented.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

I'd like to see a lot more well-trained UU ministers (lay and professional) out there, helping society

Me too my friend, me too.

 

[lilithu]

So, I spoke with Rev. Disruid yesterday about joining the lay ministry. I won't be able to apply till fall of next year, maybe not even till the year after that. it's kind of a bummer, but otoh, I have time to reflect on whether it's something I really need/ want to do.

I can understand why you can only apply at certain times, perhaps only once a year. But having to wait more than one year??

Yes, but I'd like to see the training more widely available to those who profess an interest. I can see why not, though, as time and resources are always an issue. It's just that the evangelicals birth litters of evangelists on a daily basis, and we're already way behind in numbers. I'd like to see a lot more well-trained UU ministers (lay and professional) out there, helping society and showing that not all religious paths need to be judgmental and damnation-oriented.

Well, I don't feel the need to compete with conservative Christians in terms of churning out numbers, but I strongly feel that there is a need amongst UUs to "go deeper" that is not being met. We make it hard for lay leaders to deepen their faith, so they look to the ministry. And then we make ministry hard too. Why is it that UU requires so many more hurdles to be jumped thru before one is accepted into fellowship? For a people who claim we believe in freedom and equality, we are more bureaucratic and hierarchical than many of the more conservative denomations.

 

[Storm]

I can understand why you can only apply at certain times, perhaps only once a year. But having to wait more than one year??

Normally, they go through the process every other year. It might be delayed till 2010 due to the church transitioning through our senior minister's retirement.

 

[J Bryson]

Well, I don't feel the need to compete with conservative Christians in terms of churning out numbers, but I strongly feel that there is a need amongst UUs to "go deeper" that is not being met. We make it hard for lay leaders to deepen their faith, so they look to the ministry. And then we make ministry hard too. Why is it that UU requires so many more hurdles to be jumped thru before one is accepted into fellowship? For a people who claim we believe in freedom and equality, we are more bureaucratic and hierarchical than many of the more conservative denomations.

I'm not sure that I feel competitive in terms of numbers, but I am seeing a decided gap in the message getting across. We've allowed the religious right to hijack the majority of the religious discussion in this nation since 1980, with no sign of things getting any better. Where are the religious liberals on the talk shows, on the streets, hosting television shows (and owning cable networks), writing in the Op-Ed columns of newspapers?

The best way that we can begin to get an alternative message out is with a new generation of inspired, committed religious leaders and spokespeople. One of the best ways to do this is through showing the value of a life in the ministry, how one can truly make a difference to others. Get people out on the streets, handing out food and giving assistance rather than screaming at people and condemning them.

In my more Agnostic days, I was once tempted to take on the role of an Atheist street preacher. I wanted to set up shop across from one of the downtown ranters, take out a copy of Origin of Species, and go into a full-throttle sermon on the dangers of blind faith.

I'm not suggesting something like that, exactly, but we need visibility. We need to go into the gay neighborhoods, the African-American communities, the growing Hispanic neighborhoods. We need to pass out literature and let people know that we exist. We need to publicize. We need to let those on the margins know that they have not been forgotten, that they are not alone no matter what creed they may follow, or who they fall in love with. That so long as you live your life with love, compassion, and respect, then there is nothing that needs changing.

We've been whispering for so long that people have forgotten that we exist. Now we need to SHOUT. And in order for a religion to shout, it must have numbers in the pews and numbers in the pulpit.

 

[lilithu]

Hey, I agree with most of what you said. One of the things that I would like to see established within UU culture is the idea of going on mission the way that Mormon young adults do, except instead of going door to door to spread one's religion, our young adults would so service, like the Peace Corps, or Americorps. Except, explicitly as people of faith. UUs. I would love to see us out there, openly, as we do our petitions, and protests, and prayer vigils and lobbying, and volunteering and ... I would love it if elected officials who are UU were more open about their faith. We only know a few. I'm sure there are many more than we know of.

I have some reservations about going into African-American and Hispanic/Latino communities, however, as much as I want to see more UUs of color. If we're going to approach it the wrong way I'd rather we not do it at all. It's too awful. (Once again, read Soul Work.) But it can be done right. The First UU Church of San Jose with Rev Nancy Palmer Jones is a great example of us doing it right. We're starting to collect success stories and sharing them. (And hey, don't forget us Asians, especially in California. )

 

[J Bryson]

Hey, I agree with most of what you said. One of the things that I would like to see established within UU culture is the idea of going on mission the way that Mormon young adults do, except instead of going door to door to spread one's religion, our young adults would so service, like the Peace Corps, or Americorps. Except, explicitly as people of faith. UUs. I would love to see us out there, openly, as we do our petitions, and protests, and prayer vigils and lobbying, and volunteering and ... I would love it if elected officials who are UU were more open about their faith. We only know a few. I'm sure there are many more than we know of.

I have some reservations about going into African-American and Hispanic/Latino communities, however, as much as I want to see more UUs of color. If we're going to approach it the wrong way I'd rather we not do it at all. It's too awful. (Once again, read Soul Work.) But it can be done right. The First UU Church of San Jose with Rev Nancy Palmer Jones is a great example of us doing it right. We're starting to collect success stories and sharing them. (And hey, don't forget us Asians, especially in California. )

Oh, I completely agree about doing it the wrong way. The "misguided do-gooder liberal" stereotype isn't wholly without merit, and people who have acted in such a manner have done irreparable damage to our presence in various communities. However, I believe that outreach can be done in a realistic manner.

And damn right we want more Asians!

 

[Storm]

So, as of yesterday, I am officially a member of First Church. And thanks to the challenge grant, my pledge counts double!

Speaking of the challenge grant, we're over halfway there, and probably won't have to close in July after all! :woohoo:

 

[J Bryson]

Hooray on the membership, the pledge, and the non-closing!

So...yesterday I brought two of the books that I'd checked out of the library to church with me. As I sat in the pew meditating before services, I heard a whispered "Jeffrey" behind me. It was Rev. Clyde, who handed me three books: The Epic of Unitarianism, Faith Without Certainty, and Soul Work. I was especially pleased with the last one, as I'd been unable to find it at the library, and it had been so strongly recommended both by him and by people here. I would have bought it, but my budget is already strained to the maximum. He then glanced at what I'd checked out, said "Oh, this is the abridged version" about the Unitarian history book, and said "He wrote a better one later on" about Why I Am A Unitarian.

Good sermon, good service. Excellent meditation on and analysis of the witch-hunt mentality.

After the service and the lunch, we had a great class on spiritual practice and the mind. It got deeply philosophical and challenging, and the insights of others were fascinating. I think that I added something positive to the overall discussion, if the feedback that I got was any indication.

Where else but in a UU discussion group could I quote (in the space of one hour) Terry Pratchett, Rabbi Hillel, Jesus, my own LiveJournal, and Aleister Crowley, and get away with it?

They also liked my description of the congregation as people who lived together in a condition of "contentious respect".

 

[J Bryson]

Forgot to mention, I also got to quote the Inherit The Wind line "The Bible is a good book. But it is not the only book."

Just finished Soul Work, which proved to be more challenging than I'd thought. I was impressed with the numerous perspectives involved, although at times I felt that people were so in love with their own ideas regarding this tricky issue that they were not listening to the valid perspectives of others, thereby creating a "Blind Men And The Elephant" situation. The fact that one system of analysis of a situation is valid does not necessarily mean that other methodologies are invalid. Each method points out an angle of approach that can be used to resolve the problems, meaning that people of numerous talents, insights, and backgrounds can be drawn into finding potential solutions.

 

[lilithu]

I am guessing that you are responding largely to Tinker and Cone, sine they were the most provocative and hardcore. What did you think of Rosemary Bray McNatt's essay?

 

[challupa]

I have been asked by a Unitarian church in my city to do a talk about a book I wrote about more tolerance in religion and non-religion. Can anyone give me some insight into just how to address this group. There are atheists and theists and because my book it more directed to get traditional religion to think about their beliefs, I feel my thoughts would be like "preaching to the choir". I think they already hold many of the beliefs I try to outline in my book so any suggestions on presentation?