The Debate of God.

[Prophet]

You misunderstand: I am not using the word 'rational' as the opposite of 'irrational', or insane; I am saying that the divine nature is non-rational. It does not think; it just is pure conscious essence, and is beyond the duality of 'rational/irrational', as it is beyond ALL dualities.

This is an ignorant style of teaching. Not discussing. You do not bother with support. You just try to tell me how it is. And when I ask you for explanation, its likely going to be some nonsense poetry about you pointing at the moon. I know that you are a fraud.

You are not in a position to teach. You are ignorant of the divine nature, yet allow yourself license to endless streams of meaningless drivel about it. There isn't anything that you think you know about the divine nature that you didn't read from some book, and mash (artfully I'm sure) into your "arational" world view that doesn't have to toil with the rigors of reason and logic.

Unfortunately the Truth you thought you found is not found by fooling yourself into believing you have "realized" it through your signature "arational" means.

Nyet! What do you suppose? That God 'reasoned' the world into existence? To what end?

I suppose that eons ago God allowed all of His children to find their own way when He allowed the universe to come into existence, allowing chance along with the free will of His children to shape it, never once interfering with the results so that when we reason our way back to where love comes from and what good truly is, we would also reason our way back to who we Truly are, united with Him along with our Brothers and Sisters here, forever.

 

[godnotgod]

This is an ignorant style of teaching. Not discussing. You do not bother with support. You just try to tell me how it is. And when I ask you for explanation, its likely going to be some nonsense poetry about you pointing at the moon. I know that you are a fraud.

You are not in a position to teach. You are ignorant of the divine nature, yet allow yourself license to endless streams of meaningless drivel about it. There isn't anything that you think you know about the divine nature that you didn't read from some book, and mash (artfully I'm sure) into your "arational" world view that doesn't have to toil with the rigors of reason and logic.

Unfortunately the Truth you thought you found is not found by fooling yourself into believing you have "realized" it through your signature "arational" means.

I see. So you fail to comprehend. That's OK. Not everyone does. They want God to fit into their nice neat little system of thought, as you do.

I suppose that eons ago God allowed all of His children to find their own way when He allowed the universe to come into existence, allowing chance along with the free will of His children to shape it, never once interfering with the results so that when we reason our way back to where love comes from and what good truly is, we would also reason our way back to who we Truly are, united with Him along with our Brothers and Sisters here, forever.

Yes, of course, and then He'll call you over to His side and invite you to sit on His lap, and He will perfectly explain exactly and precisely how He did it, making everything perfectly clear via Reason and Logic, and when He finishes, you will say: "Oh, I see", and then you'll know. Why, what could possibly be more simply put to fit the mind of a simpleton?

Puh-leaze!:slap:

(I might add that your silly, asinine scenario is what is known as 'The Long Way Home'. Been der; done wit dat. Now just shoo!)

Uh...re: 'Rigors of Reason and Logic'....:biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh:...don't get a hernia, now, LOL.

 

[Prophet]

Continuously saying that I fail to understand you doesn't make it true.

Mocking and name calling doesn't make my scenario assinine or silly. This would be correctly done by exposing flaws in my logic, but you've made logic your enemy.

You are a fraud who has abandoned all debate for nonsensical "arational" hot air. I will continue to expose you for as long as I see fit.

 

[godnotgod]

This is an ignorant style of teaching. Not discussing. You do not bother with support. You just try to tell me how it is. And when I ask you for explanation, its likely going to be some nonsense poetry about you pointing at the moon. I know that you are a fraud.

Uh, pointing to the moon is neither fraudulent or not-fraudulent. There is no such thing as a fraudulent finger pointing to the moon.I can't miss, but it is you who do when you continue to attack my pointing finger. So instead of being honest and squaring with the moon, you fraudulently turn instead and lunge for my finger...every single time. That's your knee-jerk indoctrination at work again. That's OK. It is said that a fool in his folly shall eventually become wise, though in some cases, can take an eternity.

You are not in a position to teach.

Thank you for confirming my previous statement that I am not here to teach. All I can do is eat when hungry, and sleep when tired. And, oh yes....sometimes when my sap rises to the occasion, I find myself spontaneously pointing to the moon.

Have you seen it yet? Or is that silly placard blocking your vision? The one whose author claims he is both Enlightened and Prophetic.:clap Dreary....(*yawn*)... Next.

 

[godnotgod]

Continuously saying that I fail to understand you doesn't make it true.

Mocking and name calling doesn't make my scenario assinine or silly. This would be correctly done by exposing flaws in my logic, but you've made logic your enemy.

You are a fraud who has abandoned all debate for nonsensical "arational" hot air. I will continue to expose you for as long as I see fit.

Don't get a hernia from apoplexy, now.

 

[godnotgod]

Poor Prophet! He thinks my finger pointing to the moon is actually trying to teach him something! He's got a lot to un-learn before he sees the moon the way it actually is.

 

[godnotgod]

Continuously saying that I fail to understand you doesn't make it true.

No, what makes it true is you throwing down red flags all over the place and stomping around in a mad rage.

Mocking and name calling doesn't make my scenario assinine or silly. This would be correctly done by exposing flaws in my logic, but you've made logic your enemy.

I love Logic and Reason, but they have their place, and the world of the divine is not it. What makes your scenario asinine and silly is the nature of the scenario itself. If you fail to understand why, then you fail to understand why. Someday it may dawn on you. I don't want to push the river and deprive you of that experience with a rational explanation, which is no explanation at all. You just have to see it for yourself, that's all. And stop asking for an explanation based on logic and reason. You have to SEE it, not THINK about it.

You are a fraud who has abandoned all debate for nonsensical "arational" hot air. I will continue to expose you for as long as I see fit.

So you think you can debate God, do you? Come now. You know better than that!

 

[Prophet]

I am not saying your finger is a fraud. I would classify it as a distraction (a technique commonly employed by magicians and rhetoricians to conceal their deception). I am saying YOU are a fraud. Your poor attempts to badly word me and purposefully misunderstand me are "silly, asinine ".

 

[godnotgod]

Look, it cannot be seen -- it is beyond form.
Listen, it cannot be heard -- it is beyond sound.
Grasp, it cannot be held -- it is intangible.
These three are indefinable;
Therefore they are joined in one.

From above it is not bright;
From below it is not dark;
An unbroken thread beyond description.
It returns to nothingness.
The form of the formless,
The image of the imageless,
It is called indefinable and beyond imagination.

Lao-Tzu
Tao te Ching

 

[godnotgod]

I am not saying your finger is a fraud. I would classify it as a distraction. I am saying YOU are a fraud. Your poor attempts to badly word me and purposefully misunderstand me are "silly, asinine ".

I am merely responding to your statements, which I see as silly and asinine, ala 'childhood fantasy' propped up as serious and real. It is a facade, and I see right through it, that's all. When will you pierce the facade?

There is no finger-pointer.

There is only finger pointing, without a pointer.

Therefore, there is no pointer that is either fraudulent, nor not-fraudulent, as much as you would like there to be. Sorry to disappoint, but you fail to expose any such fraud here. If you think you have, bring this fraud forth here and let's have a look at him, OK?

Now do you see how Logic really works?

FRAUD! PROPHET THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY INVESTIGATING THIS CASE IS CALLING YOU DOWN! COME FORTH AND FACE THE MUSIC!

(SILENCE). NO FRAUDULENT POINTER OF ANY FINGER TO BE FOUND.

GAME OVER.

 

[godnotgod]

HEY LOOK! THE MOON!

 

[godnotgod]

*The Lost Pearl*


The Yellow Emperor went wandering
To the north of the Red Water
To the Kwan Lun mountain. He looked
around
Over the edge of the world. On the way
home
He lost his night-colored pearl*.
He sent out Science to seek his pearl,
and got nothing.
He sent Analysis to look for his pearl,
and got nothing.
He sent out Logic to seek his pearl,
and got nothing.
Then he asked Nothingness, and
Nothingness had it!
The Yellow Emperor said:
“Strange, indeed: Nothingness
Who was not sent
Who did no work to find it
Had the night-colored pearl!”

from “The Way of Chuang Tzu,” translated by Thomas Merton

*night-colored pearl = original nature

...."rigors of Logic and Reason"....ha! ha! ha!

 

[godnotgod]

Announcement:

Professor GodNOTActuallyGod would like to offer all participants in this thread an advance copy of his long-awaited book, titled:

"Leichenstarre der Logik undt Vernunft "*

which promises to be a block-buster on the NY Times Best Seller Top Ten List this year. It represents the distillation of thousands of hours of nose to the grindstone unforgiving blood, sweat, and tears to bring you the God-Honest Unvarnished Truth, never before revealed to humankind.

Don't miss out. Sign up for your advance copy now, beautifully stamped in gold on bound leather and personally signed by the author.

*"Rigors of Logic and Reason"

 

[godnotgod]

This is not a pipe.

 

[Prophet]

I am quite satisfied with my butchery of your insane arguments for now, but I'll be watching.

 

[godnotgod]

I suppose that eons ago God allowed all of His children to find their own way when He allowed the universe to come into existence, allowing chance along with the free will of His children to shape it, never once interfering with the results so that when we reason our way back to where love comes from and what good truly is, we would also reason our way back to who we Truly are, united with Him along with our Brothers and Sisters here, forever.

Oh yeah? Well, I say you're just making stuff up. Now suppose you tell us precisely when and where all the Bros and Sistahs split from God in the first place. I say you're dreaming and need to wake up.

 

[9Westy9]

Yeah, and scientists also believe that there must exist a 'force' which
causes that sometimes an apple will fall to the ground,
and arbitrarily they named this 'force', which 'must exist', 'Gravity'.

And religious people believe that there must exist a 'force' which
causes that sometimes they will have some kind of a spiritual experience,
and arbitrarily they named this 'force', which 'must exist', 'God'/'Hades'/'Quetzacoatl'

People see things fall to the ground when dropped and name this gravity

People build churches, mosques etc because they believe a god to exist

Do you see the difference between these two? In the first people are merely observing what happens when x happens (dropping an object) whereas in the second people are observing what other people do. Going back to your original analogy for the second

There are churchs, mosques and temples all over the world. <-- ('real') effect
These sacred buildings would not have been built,
if God had not revealed himself to anyone at any time. <-- obviously.

Where on earth do you get the the bold part from? Do you honestly believe that the only way people would have built buildings is because some supernatural being "revealed himself to them"

Let me use your logic.

There are office blocks being built all over the world <- real effect
These office buildings would not have been built unless the god of offices had not revealed himself to mankind <- Obviously

 

[godnotgod]

I am quite satisfied with my butchery of your insane arguments for now, but I'll be watching.

I see you've stuffed God into a nice, neat square fully explainable package, the likes of which is pure insanity itself.

Butchery is the only tactic you Rationalists can employ when your Logic and Reason fail to explain a world that cannot be explained in rational terms. But then to sit back and feel smug about having driven a square peg into a round hole takes the cake. Only a madman would feel self-satisfied with the resulting mess.

 

[9Westy9]

heh...heh...heh...because if you don't, you need to worry about eternal torture in some forgotten hell. If that caveat existed for not believing in gravity, you best believe (no pun) that we would have gravity-worshipping churches all over the world, due to the fear of going to non-belief-in-gravity hell.

Quickly everyone. Turn to gravity to save yourselves before it's too late

"I am the Gravity Way, the Gravity Truth, and the Gravity Life. No man goes to Gravity Heaven except through me"

amen :yes:

 

[godnotgod]

....but I'll be watching.

So are you retiring to your Heavenly Throne now, from which you watch over all of humankind, eagle-eyed, detecting even the slightest of flaws?

Hey! Look! A beam in Prophet's Eye! :biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh: