The Debate of God.

[godnotgod]

And if you reaaly believe your last post.....
you would see that it is essential for God to have good company....
even if it be only a Thief.

separate from God? ....yes I am...so are you....

If not, then this discussion would not even exist.

Use your head: it exists because everything is interconnected to everything else in what is called a 'uni-verse'. You know...uni-verse....ONE.

The fact that discussion exists is evidence of interconnectedness. You, however, want to establish a separate 'discusser' of the discussion, where no such entity exists. Such a 'separate discusser' exists only as illusion within your mind, an illusion you have bought into, hook, line, and sinker.

When God awakens from the dream-sleep that is Thief, Thief will be no more, dissolving like so much foam on the surface of the sea.

 

[Thief]

Use your head: it exists because everything is interconnected to everything else in what is called a 'uni-verse'. You know...uni-verse....ONE.

The fact that discussion exists is evidence of interconnectedness. You, however, want to establish a separate 'discusser' of the discussion, where no such entity exists. Such a 'separate discusser' exists only as illusion within your mind, an illusion you have bought into, hook, line, and sinker.

When God awakens from the dream-sleep that is Thief, Thief will be no more, dissolving like so much foam on the surface of the sea.

"I" will continue.

"You" can disovle into nothing....if you like.
Ask God that you be dissassenbled.

I'm sure He won't mind.

 

[godnotgod]

"I" will continue.

That is what "I" has led you to believe, because its sole purpose is to perpetuate its own illusion so it can continue to receive egoic gratification and reward.

You keep saying you want to talk about God, but you always end up preoccupied with your self.

 

[godnotgod]

"A wizard exists in all of us. This wizard sees and knows everything.

The wizard is beyond opposites of light and dark, good and evil, pleasure and pain.

Everything the wizard sees has its roots in the unseen world.

Nature reflects the mood of the wizard.

The body and the mind may sleep, but the wizard is always awake.

The wizard possesses the secret of immortality."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyMfuTzSDLw

 

[Thief]

That is what "I" has led you to believe, because its sole purpose is to perpetuate its own illusion so it can continue to receive egoic gratification and reward.

You keep saying you want to talk about God, but you always end up preoccupied with your self.

It could be said I have lead myself.
I have no congregation.
I have no religion or practice.
No one follows me....I follow no one.

But that's not the same as to say as you do.
The body is created to form unique spirit...and it does.

To say all of this fails and no one survives the last breath is futile.
Billions to zero?...no survivors?....no spiritual realm?
No thought or feeling without the flesh?

You might as well be an athiest.

 

[godnotgod]

It could be said I have lead myself.
I have no congregation.
I have no religion or practice.
No one follows me....I follow no one.

But that's not the same as to say as you do.
The body is created to form unique spirit...and it does.

To say all of this fails and no one survives the last breath is futile.
Billions to zero?...no survivors?....no spiritual realm?
No thought or feeling without the flesh?

You might as well be an athiest.

As long as you are still leading and following and becoming, you are not yet realized in the spiritual realm. You are still self-seeking, and you are putting off finding until after death.

The spirit is not subject to birth or death, and therefore not to becoming.

 

[Thief]

As long as you are still leading and following and becoming, you are not yet realized in the spiritual realm. You are still self-seeking, and you are putting off finding until after death.

The spirit is not subject to birth or death, and therefore not to becoming.

The last line pertains to the Almighty.
Most believers think of Him without begining or end.

But most people believe spirit has thought and feeling.

Rocks and piles of dust....don't.

 

[idav]

The last line pertains to the Almighty.
Most believers think of Him without begining or end.

But most people believe spirit has thought and feeling.

Rocks and piles of dust....don't.

Data/spirit doesn't have thought or feeling without something interpreting the data to begin with.

 

[Tiberius]

You know, I bowed out of this thread because GNG was posting vague comments and acting like they proved something. I see nothing has changed.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

In the immortal words of (Sheldon Cooper - BBT).....'It's all hokum'....!

 

[Thief]

Data/spirit doesn't have thought or feeling without something interpreting the data to begin with.

And the 'Something' with the ability to interpret....would be a spirit having thought and feeling?

 

[godnotgod]

And the 'Something' with the ability to interpret....would be a spirit having thought and feeling?

Where do you get an interpreter of thought and feeling? Can you show me the interpreter? There is no interpreter; there is only interpretation.

You are making things much too complicated. Why do you want to interject a middle-man, where such a middle-man is totally unnecessary?

It is raining. There is no 'rainer' of the rain.

 

[godnotgod]

god exists. no one can say god doesn't just like mythical creatures do not exist

The very moment that you say that 'God exists', you automatically imply the background against which God does not exist, as 'existence' can only be seen against the background of 'non-existence'. In doing so, you have made God subject to the dual world. Is that how you wish to portray God, or is God the Absolute, in which case God neither exists, nor not-exists.

 

[Thief]

Where do you get an interpreter of thought and feeling? Can you show me the interpreter? There is no interpreter; there is only interpretation.

You are making things much too complicated. Why do you want to interject a middle-man, where such a middle-man is totally unnecessary?

It is raining. There is no 'rainer' of the rain.

This last post is a shallow attempt at word play....dealt only by the motivation of denial.

 

[godnotgod]

This last post is a shallow attempt at word play....dealt only by the motivation of denial.

Denial of what? Your mentally-created concoction that an anthropomorphic rain-er is responsible for the action of rain-ing? All you are doing is projecting your own ego onto an image of a supernatural being, one which you yourself are guilty of concocting.

If I am wrong, then please come forth here and show me this 'rain-er' you insist that I am in denial of.

You need to think about WHY you insist upon the existence of a creator of the world as an object, as an artifact, when in reality, there are no such artifacts; the phenomenal world is one action, and is not composed of separate, created 'things' that exist. That you think they do is a flaw in the rational mind, which attempts to 'fix' reality into something it can contain. It can't, so it convinces you that it can by trickery and deceit. That is why I continue to say that Reason and Logic are ultimately flawed systems. The only view that is not flawed is one where there is no system to represent reality at all; one that simply sees reality as it is, rather than to create a rational model as to how it should be. Both religion and science are guilty of this. Only the mind which does not create concepts about reality can see reality as it actually is.

 

[DevientGenie]

What is science guilty of besides always winning?

 

[Ben Dhyan]

*Post Deleted*

Because when you eventually find out what and who you really are, there is only one consciousness in existence, though infinite expressions, and you are presently one of those expressions. The irony is though, it is only through humility that this realization comes, not through the arrogance of considering yourself separate from the rest of the Universe,..as an observer..me and all else is not me..

The kingdom of God is within you,..you are that,..only the humble realize..

 

[godnotgod]

What is science guilty of besides always winning?

Winning and losing are not the concerns of science. If that is what you think, then you are being very un-scientific.

The fact is that science does'nt always 'win', as you put it. What it is guilty of is to create concepts of reality, and then to try to interpret reality in terms of those concepts, concepts such as Time, Space, and Causation. It falls short due to the very nature of the scientific method. Don't get me wrong: I am not knocking science. It is a very useful tool, but when it comes to telling us what the nature of reality is, it cannot do so. In order to see into the true nature of things, one must abandon all methodologies, all models, all concepts, because reality is non-conceptual. That is why it can be called 'reality'. Science, though a useful tool, is still nibbling around the edges of reality, telling us about its characteristics and even predicting its behavior, but as to its nature, zilch. The theoretical physicist and creator of string theory, Mishio Kaku, is smart enough to realize this:

[youtube]wHHz4mB9GKY[/youtube]
Science v's God : Its The Collapse Of Physics As We Know it - YouTube

"The universe is the Absolute as seen through the glass of Time, Space, and Causation"
Vivikenanda

 

[godnotgod]

Even if there is this an intelligent designer, who was responsible for evolution and the extraordinarily beautiful and complex world of sub atomic particles, even if there were a god who created or started these processes from cells with a nucleus, and made gravity, what makes you so arrogant that you also believe this source or reason for everything is somehow concerned with your daily life on such a personal level....

Perhaps there is no 'design-er' of the design, but only design-ing itself, which is how the Supreme Intelligence expresses itself as play, this Supreme Intelligence not being a 'someone' in a personal, anthropomorphic sense, but an IT, and it is this IT that really does care for you in the greatest sense of the word, but not in the way that your limited mind may think. This IT takes care and nurtures all of life, but does not interfere with it. The Chinese call this force 'Tao":



Infinite Tao flows everywhere,
creating and destroying,
Implementing all the World,
attending to the tiniest details,
Claiming nothing in return.
It nurtures all things,
Though it does not control them;
It has no intention,
So it seems inconsequential.
It is the substance of all things;
Though it does not control them;
It has no exception,
So it seems all-important.
Because it favours no finite thing,
It is infinite.

Tao te Ching, Ch. 34

 

[Thief]

Denial of what? Your mentally-created concoction that an anthropomorphic rain-er is responsible for the action of rain-ing? All you are doing is projecting your own ego onto an image of a supernatural being, one which you yourself are guilty of concocting.

If I am wrong, then please come forth here and show me this 'rain-er' you insist that I am in denial of.

You need to think about WHY you insist upon the existence of a creator of the world as an object, as an artifact, when in reality, there are no such artifacts; the phenomenal world is one action, and is not composed of separate, created 'things' that exist. That you think they do is a flaw in the rational mind, which attempts to 'fix' reality into something it can contain. It can't, so it convinces you that it can by trickery and deceit. That is why I continue to say that Reason and Logic are ultimately flawed systems. The only view that is not flawed is one where there is no system to represent reality at all; one that simply sees reality as it is, rather than to create a rational model as to how it should be. Both religion and science are guilty of this. Only the mind which does not create concepts about reality can see reality as it actually is.

WAY too much assumption on your part...
AND a plea for evidence!

Faith has no proving...you know that.

Spirit however has return.....
and you will return this post!
'YOU' can't help 'yourself'.