The demon possessed...

[Smoke]

thank you so much for your concern it means a lot. yes i am at tug o war with this.... it is such a hard transition i'm trying to be "a better person" my boyfriend mark and i have been struggling with this! he plays in a death metal band... he is an amazing drummer. they are about to release their first album. and i have promoted concerts for death metal for years! and what happened was i went to church and the pastor said we would be studying the demon possessed so i thought that would be really interesting anyways after church we went and seen the movie paranormal activity ironically because i didn't even know it was going to be about a demon so after the movie i went home and started researching it and that's were it started. the music thing isn't easy at all. i have been involved in it for a long time and i know im going to loose friends over this. i mean i was crying over it like a baby because i love my music sooooo much. i know i sound crazy and all. it's just a weird time for me.

Your pastor is jerking you around, and using fear to tighten his control over you.

I don't believe in your religion, but if I did I would ask myself whether it was really possible, if I loved Jesus and Jesus loved me, that demons could take me over -- against my will and against Jesus' will -- just because I enjoyed to a certain kind of music. It just doesn't add up.

 

[blackout]

Originally Posted by Kimberlee
thank you so much for your concern it means a lot. yes i am at tug o war with this.... it is such a hard transition i'm trying to be "a better person" my boyfriend mark and i have been struggling with this! he plays in a death metal band... he is an amazing drummer. they are about to release their first album. and i have promoted concerts for death metal for years! and what happened was i went to church and the pastor said we would be studying the demon possessed so i thought that would be really interesting anyways after church we went and seen the movie paranormal activity ironically because i didn't even know it was going to be about a demon so after the movie i went home and started researching it and that's were it started. the music thing isn't easy at all. i have been involved in it for a long time and i know im going to loose friends over this. i mean i was crying over it like a baby because i love my music sooooo much. i know i sound crazy and all. it's just a weird time for me.

This thread makes me want to weep.

 

[Cobblestones]

he already has a hold of nonbelievers. these "demons" are satans angels. the third of the angels that came with him when he rebelled against God.

And you have proof of this? As I already pointed out, it is irrational to believe that God would send the "fallen angels" to one of the only planets with intelligent life when he could have just as easily bound them to a comet or a Jupiter-like planet. To believe this necessarily leads to only one conclusion - God wanted and always intended for man to "fall" and for all the misery of disease and human conflict to occur. In which case I don't think we can really say that "God is love" can we?

 

[MSizer]

This thread makes me want to weep.

I know. The most frustrating thing is that the harder one tries to get through to her, the stronger she builds her defeses. If I met her pastor I would tell him he is scum and should lock himself away from poor well intended people like her who are so easily influenced. His foolishness has far reaching effects and he should be ashamed.

 

[Cobblestones]

I don't think it's necessarily a question of "wanting", it's pretty unavoidable really - if you believe something, true or flase, you'll interpret things to fit that. It doesn't have to be a case of "wishful thinking", such misinterpetations can be quite unpleasant.

EXACTLY! Frubals!

This is the basic problem with thinking as Kimberlee has described: One has to accept everything within the belief system because to question it is to question God and "who am I to question God?" right?

But we are rational beings and even if God created us this way that's the way we are. So to use reason to make value assessments is far more imperative than "simply believing" whatever you are told.

Kimberlee - Look at the basic ideas of your faith and ask yourself if any decent human being would have done any of the things attributed to God. If the answer is "no" then either God is sub-human or humans aren't as god-like as you might suppose. Here are some things that the God of the Bible is reported to have done:

• Created perfect beings "in His image"
• Cast down the devil to the same planet as his perfect beings
• Gave the perfect beings a test
• Allowed Satan to tempt the perfect beings
• When the perfect beings made the wrong choice, God cursed the two offenders and all of their offspring so that all humans would be born "in sin" and "slaves to sin"
• Cursed the entire physical universe because of the "fall of man"

And that's just the beginning. After that we get:

• God killing off almost the entire human race in a flood
• God killing off the people of Sodom
• God confusing the language of humans at Babel because they were getting along too well for his liking
• God hardening Pharaoh's heart and then punishing an entire nation for Pharaoh being hard-hearted
• God ordering his people to commit genocide
• God requiring the blood of animals for forgiveness of sins
• God sending his people into exile because they aren't paying enough attention to him
• God requiring a "perfect human" sacrifice for perpetual forgiveness of sins

The list goes on and on and every bit of it is offensive to any decent human being. You cannot look on the actions of the Christian god and still say that he is "good" or "loving." He is in fact narcissistic, exacting, cruel and petty.

And you're worried about demons? Shoot! I'd be more worried about this God that you are worshiping.

 

[Cobblestones]

If I met her pastor I would tell him he is scum and should lock himself away from poor well intended people like her who are so easily influenced.

Thus making him a martyr and building up his reputation. There is no way to win this battle.

 

[Nepenthe]

This thread makes me want to weep.

I know. The most frustrating thing is that the harder one tries to get through to her, the stronger she builds her defeses. If I met her pastor I would tell him he is scum and should lock himself away from poor well intended people like her who are so easily influenced. His foolishness has far reaching effects and he should be ashamed.

There's something heartbreaking in seeing someone's love of art, music, literature, etc., being stifled because a superstition or dogma prevents them from actively pursuing and enjoying what they love. Believing in the actual presence of malevolent magical beings is nonsensical enough; allowing that nonsense to stifle artistic expression is tragic.

 

[Cobblestones]

Believing in the actual presence of malevolent magical beings is nonsensical enough; allowing that nonsense to stifle artistic expression is tragic.

And leads to the Dark Ages...

 

[Mr Cheese]

5) To say that demons use music to corrupt people is as reasonable as saying that they are responsible for Fritos and other foods that are unhealthy and high in cholesterol and that such foods are designed with the express purpose of killing humans.

.

Well the universe is made up of vibrations

I think it is reasonable to say, some are in tune and in harmony
while others are in discord...and disruptive

I would argue if one gets into death metal and the surrounding genress deep
enough, the sounds are discord, and not in harmony with the universe
One that is suspectible to such things could clearly be imbalance by it.

It is a fact that classical music for instance increases the IQ.
It is not Vivaldi that prisoners get played to in USA torture prisons ...
it is metal....

I think demon possesion through music is a bit extreme and ill informed
I think its more a matter of "bad vibes" to put it really simply. Colors and sounds can effect moods, as can environment, it really depends on the person.

I happen to like death metal a bit, although I prefer some of the other genres surrounding it, personally.... but that is not all I listen to, and I am aware its nasty...and I dont listen to it often.

Its difficult to discuss thigns in a forum where most people have no experience of the non corporeal or belief of it.

I'd say more...but whats the point? lol

 

[Cobblestones]

Well the universe is made up of vibrations

I think it is reasonable to say, some are in tune and in harmony
while others are in discord...and disruptive

To whom or what? Your "harmony" may actually be a form of discord to other entities in the universe. That's kinda how the universe works after all. Whose who are uncomfortable with chaos and disruption ought to opt-out...

 

[Mister Emu]

we talked about how we believe people that are sucidal are demon possessed because God would never want anyone to harm their body (temple) only satan could promote such behavior.

Did anyone bring up chemical imbalances as a cause for depression?

Mental illness is real, and it is not demonic possession... and it needs to be treated by a trained professional...

Also, I would not worry about your music...

That said, I do believe demons exist, but if you put your trust in the Lord I think you will be just fine in that regard

 

[Mr Cheese]

To whom or what? Your "harmony" may actually be a form of discord to other entities in the universe. That's kinda how the universe works after all. Whose who are uncomfortable with chaos and disruption ought to opt-out...

well like I said, it depends on the person

Some people can drink alcohol for example
Many others are allergic

Discordant music can effect people..if they are suspetible

and many seek chaos and disruption....amongst those that are physical and those that are not

It is their choice.....

This is the choice, to be like the water that flows...or to pretend you can hold back the sea.

You are trying to make this a value call, I am assuming..good, bad...evil...right left,,green purple... such things are irrelivant...


If you throw a stone onto a calm pond ripples appear. The question is, do you want to throw pebbles or boulders...or would it be better to simply float and allow the pond to remain calm.....

but this is gettign into the nature of mysticism, reality and more...

 

[blackout]

we talked about how we believe people that are sucidal are demon possessed because God would never want anyone to harm their body (temple) only satan could promote such behavior.

Mental illness is real, and it is not demonic possession... and it needs to be treated by a trained professional...

As well, sometimes life is BRUTAL to people.
It is more brutal and difficult then they can handle,
or care to.
And there is no one to help them anyway.
or there IS no way for anyone to help them.
(uncurable painful illness or losing one's whole family overnight,
abuse at home and then bullying at school.... or whatever)
You know. Nothing happy to live for, nothing but grief and misery.
This is not mental illness, or demonic posession.



There are perfectly sane, hurting, suffering people who don't want to go on here.

I wonder... where is god for these people?

So easy to blame everything on the devil.
And even on the victims themselves.

 

[gnomon]

i have def heard of even atheist experiencing "demons"... and come to think of it actually there was some guy posting in the paranormal activity section of the forum who said his girlfriend was struggling with this and she was an atheist and people just made fun of him... i dunno it could not be real but you should still take something like that seriously when someone is wanting your help even if you don't believe in demons. there could be something serious going on and people just made fun of it. anyways it's not just christians that see it. plus christians are who satan wants... he already has a hold of nonbelievers. these "demons" are satans angels. the third of the angels that came with him when he rebelled against God.

One question. Did you check out any of the links I provided earlier in this thread?

 

[epizano1]

Whoever introduced mental illness into this topic is missing the point, even though they are probably well-meaning. The young lady had a religious question and it deserves an answer. Shame on everyone who treats people who believe in spiritual things as necessarily ignorant. That is not being charitable, it's arrogant and rude. :no:
Excuse me for my outburst. I searched online for "unless your mind is possessed by the truth," hoping to find a line of poetry. But reading this thread, I wanted to know how people were responding to her question.
She says demon possession is a real thing, but they were discussing it in Bible Study. I don't think it was prudent to advise medical attention at this point. As for what I believe, it is in the Bible obviously.
To answer your question mam, this is how I approach this topic: the devil doesn't bother those who are already in his possession. In other words, if he bothers you, that's a healthy sign, be on your guard "the devil lurks like a lion waiting to devour its prey." Those who do not believe in the existence of the devil probably do not believe in God either. But there are actually three enemies in the spiritual life: the devil, the flesh, and the world and its allures. Thanks be to God, who defeated death and sin by sending his Son to die on the cross for our forgiveness! Go to Jesus, do not get hung up on these other things. I have no word for unbelievers who are only looking to bring down and belittle others. They should be humbly looking for truth, not trying to teach others. JMJ Praise God :cross2:

 

[viole]

Whoever introduced mental illness into this topic is missing the point, even though they are probably well-meaning. The young lady had a religious question and it deserves an answer. Shame on everyone who treats people who believe in spiritual things as necessarily ignorant. That is not being charitable, it's arrogant and rude. :no:

Question: if someone very religious asked you how to remove the demon that causes her terrible chest pain and breathing problems, what would you do? An exorcism, so that you are not rude?

Excuse me for my outburst. I searched online for "unless your mind is possessed by the truth," hoping to find a line of poetry. But reading this thread, I wanted to know how people were responding to her question.
She says demon possession is a real thing, but they were discussing it in Bible Study. I don't think it was prudent to advise medical attention at this point. As for what I believe, it is in the Bible obviously. :

Obviously.

But there are actually three enemies in the spiritual life: the devil, the flesh, and the world and its allures.

You forgot the above mentioned mental illnesses. Or are they actually required in order to have a fulfilled spiritual life?

Thanks be to God, who defeated death and sin by sending his Son to die on the cross for our forgiveness! Go to Jesus, do not get hung up on these other things.

I am sure it was a real sacrifice to send his son to die knowing exactly that He would come back to life after the weekend. I really wonder how people can be impressed by that, even if it were true.

I have no word for unbelievers who are only looking to bring down and belittle others. They should be humbly looking for truth, not trying to teach others. JMJ Praise God :cross2:

You should not be surprised that we do that. There is actually a prophecy that expects believers to be scoffed at. A self fulfilling prophecy, I am afraid.

Ciao

- viole

 

[FunctionalAtheist]

so we have been studying demon possession in bible study at my church which has been a really interesting study and has actually convicted me to not listen to the music i used to and this was just about 2 weeks ago. anyways i believe satan works through people with demons to attack God and his believers. rather it be through music or your everyday people. we talked about how we believe people that are sucidal are demon possessed because God would never want anyone to harm their body (temple) only satan could promote such behavior. demon possession is biblical of course.----

BibleGateway.com - Keyword*Search: demon

not only that you can have more than one demon at a time. i dunno just wanna see what you guys think about it. do you think that satan is working through people with demons... his angels. because what i get from the scripture is that the demons are the third of the angels that came with satan from heaven. oh and being oppressed or possessed by demons what is the difference to you?

I've never known someone who firmly did not believe in demons to be troubled by them. I've seen numerous cases, in person and in the media, of individuals who mentally accepted their existence that were plagued by them.

There was a womon a few years ago, a born again god fearing bible believing woman with a wonderful heart who believed in the literal word. She cut her son's throat because she believed he had a demon and god was telling her to release the demon. This was in the news I'm not making it up. There are many others.

When I believed I had conversations with demons and angels. I interpreted them through my cultural background. As my skepticism grew I kept coming back to these encounters until one day I realized my experience was only about 10% actual experience and 90% pure clutural interpretaion on my part. These encounters are eaisily explained by cognitive anamoly.

The truth is never obvious on its own merits, it is only when we compare experience with a standard, a measure, that we find knowledge. I hope you find the standard of truth which reflects reality, rather then the standard that reflects authority and revelation. Without it you will never have knowledge.