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The Koran is the Word of God? How do we know this?

kai

kai

ragamuffin
Mestemia said:
Honestly, I am actually waiting to hear things like "I know you are but what am I?" and "I'm rubber, you'e glue..."
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all classics! and you do realise you are giving certain individuals literary weapons that they never knew existed. :D
 
Riverwolf

Riverwolf

Amateur Rambler / Proud Ergi
Premium Member
Fatihah said:
Response: But your not explaining how it's like the qur'an or proving how it shows that the qur'an is not from Allah. Until you've done so, it's mentioning is pointless.
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Once again, I'm NOT trying to prove the Qur'an is not from God! How many times do I have to say that before you get it?

Jurassic Park (and many of Crichton's books) is about the problems that can arise with simple scientific thought.

Dancing With Siva is a catechism of the Vedic religion, Saivism, which is the worship of God in the form of Siva.

But before you do so, perhaps it would be best to read the following explanation:

It is a common response that everytime this challenge is stated, someone responds with something like, "can you produce something like Shakespere or a symphony like Beethoven? If not, does this mean that they are prophets of God?"

So before the thread is filled with those type of responses, let me explain further. The challenge is to produce a chapter "like" the qur'an. Therefore, it does not mean to simply write something in arabic and think you've accomplished something. What is the qur'an? Well what is any religous scripture? It is supposed to be inspiration from God. It's purpose is to inspire people to follow its teachings. So to produce a chapter like the qur'an means to produce a chapter as inspirational and as successful as the qur'an.

So what's the purpose of that? Well by doing so, you learn the miracle of the qur'an. And what is that miracle? The miracle is the following:
It is impossible for a person/s to create their own religion and use their made up religion to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation.

This is the miracle of the qur'an. This is the miracle of Muhammad. This is a challenge for those who claim that the religion of islam is man made as well as the qur'an. Muhammad used a religion to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation. So to those who claim that this was the act of a man made religion, then why don't you do the same? Why don't you create your own religion and see how far you get? And when you do, you will fail. Not only will you will fail, you will fail miserably. Muhammad conquered Arabia. I guarantee you, you won't even be able to conquer your own neighborhood. And once you fail, you will be forced to ask yourself the question "why was it possible for Muhammad but impossible for me and anyone else?" That is when you will come to realize that it was the help of Allah that made it possible for Muhammad. Without Allah, even Muhammad would have failed. You disagree, the 1400+ year challenge still stands.
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Can you back this criteria up, or is it just your own belief?

I have no intention of doing something so barbaric as conquering even another person, let alone a neighborhood, let alone a city, let alone a county, let alone a country. I follow Ahimsa (Non-violence) and Advaita (Non-dualism.) I cannot conquer a nation, because I don't believe nations to be anything other than large tribes; they are 100% man-made, and don't exist other that within the mind. Even if I were to conquer a nation, that would only be temporary.

The only things I have to conquer are within myself, and both the books I've listed (and many others) have thus far helped me do so.

Besides, there have been recently many modern religious movements that have amassed many, many followers: Baha'i, Scientology, etc. There have also been many political movements that have conquered many nations, such as communism, which I think we can both agree is not of God.

From http://www.religioustolerance.org/bahai4.htm

Here's the estimated number of Baha'is worldwide.
topbul1d.gif
[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]1.8 million in Africa[/FONT]
topbul1d.gif
[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]3.6 million in Asia[/FONT]
topbul1d.gif
[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]0.13 million in Europe[/FONT]
topbul1d.gif
[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]0.91 in Latin America[/FONT]
topbul1d.gif
[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]0.81 in Northern America[/FONT]
topbul1d.gif
[FONT=trebuchet ms,arial,helvetica]0.12 in Oceania.[/FONT]
That's enough to be a small nation, if they so desired.
 
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McBell

McBell

Admiral Obvious
Riverwolf said:
Can you back this criteria up, or is it just your own belief?
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The actual challenge says nothing at all about conquering anything, says nothing at all about what language the chapter has to be in, so one must conclude that these things that Fatihah is adding to ALLAH'S challenge are of his own making.

Why Fatihah thinks that Allah's challenge can not stand on its own I do not know.
 
F

Fatihah

Well-Known Member
Riverwolf said:
Still no answer to post #127, I see.
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Response: What is there to answer. The thread asks whether there is proof or not that the qur'an is the word of Allah and you have said several times already that you're not trying to show any proof that the the qur'an is not from Allah, thus ending any for further conversation.
 
Riverwolf

Riverwolf

Amateur Rambler / Proud Ergi
Premium Member
Fatihah said:
Response: What is there to answer. The thread asks whether there is proof or not that the qur'an is the word of Allah and you have said several times already that you're not trying to show any proof that the the qur'an is not from Allah, thus ending any for further conversation.
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Therefore you apparently failed to notice that I asked you a question in that post.

EDIT: Besides, I'm not trying to prove that the Qur'an is not from God, because I believe there's no way to know for sure either way.
 
Renji

Renji

Well-Known Member
I can't believe all the babbling here. I think the responses are becoming more and more irrelevant to the topic. :sw:
 
Bismillah

Bismillah

Submit
What is the purpose of this thread? The Qu'ran, just like any religious scripture, draws its allure through its text. If a nonbeliever is to read the Qu'ran and accept its teachings then it is the word of god. If he denies it then the Qu'ran is not the word of god. It's a matter of faith and the only answer is to wait for Judgment Day.

However, how do you expect an illiterate man, to compose a book of this quality?
 
kai

kai

ragamuffin
Abibi said:
What is the purpose of this thread? The Qu'ran, just like any religious scripture, draws its allure through its text. If a nonbeliever is to read the Qu'ran and accept its teachings then it is the word of god. If he denies it then the Qu'ran is not the word of god. It's a matter of faith and the only answer is to wait for Judgment Day.

However, how do you expect an illiterate man, to compose a book of this quality?
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sure why not? Arabs have a very deep oral tradition.
 
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