The latest from the Religion of Peace- Muslim College Students

[Perfect Circle]

Posting pictures is fun..

 

[Mister_T]

Let the pictures speak for themselves :areyoucra

I'm wondering exactly how "latest" these pictures are, because they look an awful lot like pictures of Muslim protests in the UK in 2006:

snopes.com: Muslim Demonstration

:areyoucra

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I'm wondering exactly how "latest" these pictures are, because they look an awful lot like pictures of Muslim protests in the UK in 2006:

snopes.com: Muslim Demonstration

:areyoucra

Details, details. What's a little misrepresentation in the name of promoting harmful stereotypes? As long as we come away hating and fearing Muslims, isn't it for the best?

[/sarcasm]

 

[Perfect Circle]

I think that your threads Yosef, doesn't leave much room for any Muslim to take you as a well intentioned person, who is just trying to criticize.

If you are criticizing, and just trying to point out some negatives associated with Muslims, then i just hope you'll be able to make threads with better names in the future, so that instead of being busy getting angry about the title, i can actually try to respond easily and comfortably to your criticism.

The sad truth is that this, and most threads started by Yosef, amount to little more than sophomoric attempts to stir up some low level of controversial "dialogue" on an issue that has been absolutely beaten to death.

Starting another, obviously, Islam bashing thread where he attempts to pigeon hole a massive and diverse group of people into a single monolithic archetype is seriously getting old.

If he wants to address the issue of muslim extremism, that's fine... but how about doing it in a slightly more tactful manner. Starting the thread off with incendiary photos is obviously not an attempt to start a meaningful conversation with any muslims. It's just childish muck-raking...

 

[Badran]

The sad truth is that this, and most threads started by Yosef, amount to little more than sophomoric attempts attempts to stir up some low level of controversial "dialogue" on an issue that has been absolutely beaten to death.

Starting another, obviously, Islam bashing thread where he attempts to pigeon hole a massive and diverse group of people into a single monolithic archetype is seriously getting old.

I couldn't agree more. The generalizing always gets me. It is so unfair, and everybody agrees on that, yet you still see threads with such titles. This kind of threads like you said always turn out badly.

If he wants to address the issue of muslim extremism, that's fine... but how about doing it in a slightly more tactful manner. Starting the thread off with incendiary photos is obviously not an attempt to start a meaningful conversation with any muslims. It's just childish muck-raking...

That's all i'm hoping for. A thread, talking about any aspect of Islam, no matter how sensitive or important it is, but just done with consideration, so there could be room for a discussion.

 

[McBell]

What adherents though? Should be base the religion of the minority, or the majority?.

Both.
But mostly on how the majority reacts to the minority.

 

[McBell]

What would necessarily be wrong with radical maniacs pushing peace?

What radical maniacs are pushing peace?
And what does that have to do with the thread?

If the world must suffer maniacs, then why do religions claiming to be peaceful attract violent practioners?

All religions have violent practitioners.
The more a religion claims it is peaceful, the more people will bring attention to the violent practitioners.

 

[McBell]

Well to be fair, if you look at the numbers of Islamic murders compared to Christian murders... Plus abortion is murder silly.

Well to be fair, wold you please present a link to these numbers or tell me wher I may find them?
Thank you.

Abortion is an off topic subject.
If you want to have a discussion about how abortion is, in fact, not murder in the USA, start a thread.

 

[Eliot Wild]

What radical maniacs are pushing peace?
And what does that have to do with the thread?


All religions have violent practitioners.
The more a religion claims it is peaceful, the more people will bring attention to the violent practitioners.

1. I was speaking hypothetically in responding to another post. The post to which I was a respondent said that under certain conditions any and all religions could be portrayed as radical maniacs. My question was what would be wrong with being maniacal if one was a peace maniac or a love maniac?

2. I would need to see proof of that. I believe there might exist somewhere a religion without violent practitioners. And even if such a religion doesn't exist, I believe it to be theoretically possible.


What does that have to with this thread? Good question; I'm not really sure if it does. I apologize, but I am more than capable of getting off-topic, but if so, it is purely accidental, I assure you.

Finally, I am not looking to offend or ridicule anyone. I realize the photo's in the OP are not reflective of all Muslims. However, the post of mine which you have questioned, as well as a few others I have written, was an attempt to sincerely ask some questions of Muslims or anyone who might have an answer.

If these photo's represent those who have taken Islam "to the extreme", as somebody else put it, then why are we seeing extremist Muslims engaged in such behavior? I was sincerely wondering if there is some quality of Islam that make it more attractive to radicals looking for a violent outlet?

If one is an extremist and they adhere to a religion of peace, then wouldn't they be radical pacifists?

 

[Perfect Circle]

<snip>
If these photo's represent those who have taken Islam "to the extreme", as somebody else put it, then why are we seeing extremist Muslims engaged in such behavior? I was sincerely wondering if there is some quality of Islam that make it more attractive to radicals looking for a violent outlet?

If one is an extremist and they adhere to a religion of peace, then wouldn't they be radical pacifists?

Maybe it has more to do with the area of the Earth in which Islam is most prevalent, like... the middle east. Maybe that region has a lot of economic and foreign intrusion problems due to it's large wealth of oil...? All I know is that people tend to be a lot happier when they've got money. How many extremists come out of Jordan or Kuwait in comparison to Afghanistan and Pakistan?

 

[Badran]

That's a great point. Most Muslims are in countries that have so much problems. Economically, politically, socially,...

Our leaders are oppressive, and some countries in the middle east are at war with the United States.

All the best circumstances for a delusional maniac to think that blowing himself up to fight the power makes him some kind of hero. Also, best circumstances for less severe reactions, like wishing the death of the enemy and speaking up about that for example, you know stuff like that. It always works that way, when people are in so much distress, the worst in them blows up.

 

[DeitySlayer]

All the best circumstances for a delusional maniac to think that blowing himself up to fight the power makes him some kind of hero.

Technically by Qu'ranic teachings and the hadith, shouldn't this send him to Hell? I vaguely recall a narrative where the Prophet refused to bless the body of a person who had committed suicide. And elsewhere, does the Qu'ran not say that a person should not know the time and place of his death? Both of which are violated by suicide bombing.

 

[Eliot Wild]

Maybe it has more to do with the area of the Earth in which Islam is most prevalent, like... the middle east. Maybe that region has a lot of economic and foreign intrusion problems due to it's large wealth of oil...? All I know is that people tend to be a lot happier when they've got money. How many extremists come out of Jordan or Kuwait in comparison to Afghanistan and Pakistan?

Yes, I think you might be right. I also think undue/unbalanced media attention, as some others have noted, skews worldwide perception, especially Western perceptions, and that in turn presents an artificially high indication of radicalism and violence with Islam.

But I am not going to just let Islam off the hook either. I recognize there are probably outside factors culminating to paint an unfair picture of Islam. But I believe it is fair for me to try and distinguish any principles and practices that are germain to Islam that make it more easily exploited by radicals. Of course, now I could just be showing my undue western bias and defensiveness.

 

[Badran]

Technically by Qu'ranic teachings and the hadith, shouldn't this send him to Hell? I vaguely recall a narrative where the Prophet refused to bless the body of a person who had committed suicide. And elsewhere, does the Qu'ran not say that a person should not know the time and place of his death? Both of which are violated by suicide bombing.

That's exactly the case.

You see, that is also one of the problems with being stupid and in distress, the leaders of such groups, and some ignorant scholars, have actually given opinions that in this case, it is not considered suicide.

Some people bought it. That's what i was trying to explain. Due to the distress of the situation for some, and their ignorance (with regards to their religion and in general), they actually believed that it would be a heroic act to serve a better purpose. The best thing to show you that they are mistaken, is the fact that some of them blows themselves up killing civilians, which is also clearly a wrong act in Islam.

 

[Perfect Circle]

Yes, I think you might be right. I also think undue/unbalanced media attention, as some others have noted, skews worldwide perception, especially Western perceptions, and that in turn presents an artificially high indication of radicalism and violence with Islam.

But I am not going to just let Islam off the hook either. I recognize there are probably outside factors culminating to paint an unfair picture of Islam. But I believe it is fair for me to try and distinguish any principles and practices that are germain to Islam that make it more easily exploited by radicals. Of course, now I could just be showing my undue western bias and defensiveness.

While I think that the main adherents of these extreme forms of Islam tend to be from economically down-trodden areas, I do think the religion itself can easily be interpreted to allow for violence. Of course.. I think this is true of all the abrahamic religions.

Personally, I find it a lot harder for a Christian to rationalize violent acts, but thousands of them do it each day. They may not do so in the name of Christianity, but they still perpetrate the act while calling themselves Christians.

 

[Eliot Wild]

While I think that the main adherents of these extreme forms of Islam tend to be from economically down-trodden areas, I do think the religion itself can easily be interpreted to allow for violence. Of course.. I think this is true of all the abrahamic religions.

Personally, I find it a lot harder for a Christian to rationalize violent acts, but thousands of them do it each day. They may not do so in the name of Christianity, but they still perpetrate the act while calling themselves Christians.

Excellent point about the ease of rationalizing violent actions. That's the dang word I have been looking for since my very first post on this subject -- "Rationalization".

Are there certain religions that make it easier for their more radical elements to "rationalize" violent behavior?

Thanks. I've been needing that word and it just wouldn't come to me.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Badran so when is the Middle East's reformation coming? That's the only thing I want to know. When is the Middle East going to come out of the dark ages like Christian Europe did 500 years ago?

 

[Perfect Circle]

Excellent point about the ease of rationalizing violent actions. That's the dang word I have been looking for since my very first post on this subject -- "Rationalization".

Are there certain religions that make it easier for their more radical elements to "rationalize" violent behavior?

Thanks. I've been needing that word and it just wouldn't come to me.

I think, in general, if someone is extremely upset with their lot in life, and see some outside force as the reason for their problems, they're going to latch on to whichever element of their current belief system allows for resistance. In the same way that Islam can be used to justify attacks on civilians.. so can Christianity in the form of the Crusades, Judaism in the form of radical Zionism, and atheism in the form of totalitarian states.

 

[Perfect Circle]

Badran so when is the Middle East's reformation coming? That's the only thing I want to know. When is the Middle East going to come out of the dark ages like Christian Europe did 500 years ago?

Man... you just keep heaping on the condescending remarks, don't you.

 

[Tanuki]

Badran so when is the Middle East's reformation coming? That's the only thing I want to know. When is the Middle East going to come out of the dark ages like Christian Europe did 500 years ago?

You're at it again! Do you simply say things to cause animosity with Muslims?

Anyway, who says the modernity you espouse is a good thing? Just because it may work for one group of people doesn't mean it will work for another!

This is the great arrogance of the West: 'our way is best'! Absolute twaddle!