"THE LORD'S DAY IS THE SABBATH DAY NOT SUNDAY ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURES

[IndigoChild5559]

You and 2.2 Billion of Christians in Christendom can continue to believe and follow the teachings of the Church Fathers and Ignatius. I'm not trying to convince you, @IndigoChild5559, otherwise. What We Know with Absolute Certainty By Revelation that the Lord's Day is the Sabbath Day is Extra-Biblical from your perspective.

ROFL That's too funny. Just because I know a thing or two about the Church Fathers, doesn't mean I share their beliefs. I'm about as far away from being a Christian as the North Pole is from the South Pole. I'm simply using Ignatius letter as a historical source, just as I might use a letter from George Washington.

 

[wellwisher]

SUNDAY WORSHIP IS NOT THE LORD'S DAY

The term "the Lord's day" was used by some in the early Church as a reference to Sunday worship in celebration of the resurrection of Jesus. It comes from a scripture in the bible found in Revelation 1

• REVELATION 1:10 10, I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet

The Greek words used for the day that JOHN was in the Spirit of is the for Lord's day are

• REVELATION 1:10 εγενομην εν πνευματι εν τη κυριακη ημερα και ηκουσα οπισω μου φωνην μεγαλην ως σαλπιγγος

The word "κυριακη" (translit. "kuriake") is an Adjective - Dative - Singular - Feminine. This means it is being used as a 'possessive' as ownership or belonging to ("of", see 1 Corinthians 11:20, "the Lord's supper"), which means the "day" in context belongs to "the Lord". It is literally "the Lord's (belonging to) day". This means, that the "day" in context is uniquely "the Lord's" out of all the 7 days of the week, for the day under consideration is that which exists within the week, as a day which repeats weekly. This is extremely important, as those who incorrectly assume it to mean "the first [day] of the week" in lieu of Jesus' resurrection, cannot get a weekly occurrence out of a one-time event, in fulfillment of typology of the Firstfruit/Wavesheaf in Leviticus 23:9-14, as made known in 1 Corinthians 15:20,23

The problem here however is that there is not a single scripture that references Sunday or the first day of the week (bible names for the days of the week) to being "the Lords day" in scripture.

According to the scripture "the Lords day" however can be referenced to "the Sabbath day" of Gods' 4th commandment found in Exodus 20:8-11.

Letting the scriptures answer this question

• WHAT DAY IS THE LORD'S DAY ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURES?
• MATTHEW 12:8 FOR THE SON OF MAN IS LORD EVEN OF THE SABBATH DAY

This then promotes a bit of a dilemma for the Church as there is not a single scripture in all of the bible that days "the Lords day" from Revelation 1:10 is Sunday. Yet there is many scriptures referencing "the Lords day" or Gods' specific claims to ownership of any particular day to the Sabbath day that he blessed and set aside as a holy day of rest for a memorial of creation (see Genesis 2:1-3) and made one of Gods' 10 commandments (Exodus 20:8-11).

God's "ownership" of the Sabbath day or "Lord's day is also repeated elsewhere as "MY" (ownership of the day as in the Greek used in REVELATION 1:10 κυριακη). Other scriptures in the bible pointing to "the Lords day" as being the Sabbath day...

• MATTHEW 12:8 FOR THE SON OF MAN IS LORD EVEN OF THE SABBATH DAY. (the Sabbath day is Lord's day)
• ISAIAH 58:13-14 [13], If you turn away your foot from the SABBATH, from doing your pleasure on MY HOLY DAY (God's claim to ownership of the Sabbath day); and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honorable; and shall honor him, not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor speaking your own words: [14], Then shall you delight yourself in the LORD; and I will cause you to ride on the high places of the earth, and feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father: for the mouth of the LORD has spoken it.
• LEVITICUS 19:30 You shall keep MY SABBATHS, (God's claim to ownership of the Sabbath day)and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.
• EZEKIEL 20:12 Moreover also I gave them MY SABBATHS, (God's claim to ownership of the Sabbath day) to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.

κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ used in Revelations 1:10 is in reference to the Lord's ownership of the day. It does not say that this day is in reference to μιά των σαββάτων which means the FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK.

............................

Your challenge here in this OP is to prove from the scriptures alone that the Lord's DAY is in reference to the First day of the week. If you cannot all you have is a teaching and tradition of men that is not supported in the scriptures. There is not a single scripture in all the bible that refers to Sunday as being "the Lords day".

May God bless you as you seek Him through His Word.

The Sabbath is the seventh day, which is a day of rest. The first day is the day of creation; Let there be light. Sunday or the eighth day, symbolizes the start of a new cycle of creation; new day one, or a new dispensation, where God updates creation.

In Revelation, the old heaven and earth are no longer found and a new heavens and earth appear; Creation 2.0. In Creation 2.0 there is no tree of knowledge of good and evil; law and Satan, just the tree of life with its twelve kinds of fruits and its leaves for healing the nations. Also God is lives among his people; Sabbath 2.0.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Also God is lives among his people; Sabbath 2.0.

First of all, there is no need for a Sabbath 2.0. The original Sabbath works quite well.

Second, since Shabbat means rest, I don't see where you can build a case that "God living among his people" is a Sabbath.

 

[Elihoenai]

ROFL That's too funny. Just because I know a thing or two about the Church Fathers, doesn't mean I share their beliefs. I'm about as far away from being a Christian as the North Pole is from the South Pole. I'm simply using Ignatius letter as a historical source, just as I might use a letter from George Washington.

Matthew 5:17-18

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.


This is a serious discussion with no jokes being made. I know you practice Judaism.

You agree with the Church Fathers and Ignatius about Lord's Day being not the Sabbath Day. The 2.2 Billion Christians in Christendom follow the teachings of the Church Fathers and Ignatius. You and 2.2 Billion of Christians share a common belief that the Lord's Days is not the Sabbath Day.



Epistle of Ignatius to the Magnesians

The Epistle of Ignatius to the Magnesians (often abbreviated Magnesians or Ign. Mag.) is an epistle attributed to Ignatius of Antioch, a second-century bishop of Antioch, and addressed to the church in Magnesia on the Maeander. It was written during Ignatius' transport from Antioch to his execution in Rome.

Epistle of Ignatius to the Magnesians - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Reply to Ignatius Letter: You Cannot Attain Grace Without Practising the Law of Moses. You Must Practice the Law of Moses to Attain Grace.

 

[3rdAngel]

Matthew 5:17-18

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.


This is a serious discussion with no jokes being made. I know you practice Judaism.

You agree with the Church Fathers and Ignatius about Lord's Day being not the Sabbath Day. The 2.2 Billion Christians in Christendom follow the teachings of the Church Fathers and Ignatius. You and 2.2 Billion of Christians share a common belief that the Lord's Days is not the Sabbath Day.



Epistle of Ignatius to the Magnesians

The Epistle of Ignatius to the Magnesians (often abbreviated Magnesians or Ign. Mag.) is an epistle attributed to Ignatius of Antioch, a second-century bishop of Antioch, and addressed to the church in Magnesia on the Maeander. It was written during Ignatius' transport from Antioch to his execution in Rome.

Epistle of Ignatius to the Magnesians - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Reply to Ignatius Letter: You Cannot Attain Grace Without Practising the Law of Moses. You Must Practice the Law of Moses to Attain Grace.

Agreed. Some here do not want too much similarity between Gods Sabbath, Christianity and Judaism and you can understand why. Some know that there is no scripture that supports the idea that Gods seventh day Sabbath commandment has been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest in honor of the resurrection of Jesus just the same as there is not a single scripture that supports the view that Sunday is "the Lords day" of Revelation 1:10. Then you would have to come to the question, what is the main difference then, between Sabbath keeping Christians and the true understanding of the old covenant laws of atonement and Sabbath keeping Jews born in of the flesh? Well you guessed it. It is the coming of the promised Messiah in Jesus and Gods sacrifice for the sins of the world once and for all and an acknowledgement that true Christianity is now Gods true Israel born not after the flesh but after the Spirit.

God bless.

 

[3rdAngel]

The Sabbath is the seventh day, which is a day of rest. The first day is the day of creation; Let there be light. Sunday or the eighth day, symbolizes the start of a new cycle of creation; new day one, or a new dispensation, where God updates creation.

In Revelation, the old heaven and earth are no longer found and a new heavens and earth appear; Creation 2.0. In Creation 2.0 there is no tree of knowledge of good and evil; law and Satan, just the tree of life with its twelve kinds of fruits and its leaves for healing the nations. Also God is lives among his people; Sabbath 2.0.

You have no scripture in support of your opinion and viewpoint you posted above therefore it is not biblical. All days of Genesis 1 were days of creation. The Sabbath is as you stated according to the scriptures, simply the seventh day of the creation week that God blessed and set aside as a holy day of rest as a memorial of creation and and that God is our creator of heaven and earth and a sign to His people that our God is the only true God of heaven and earth (see Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11 and Ezekiel 20:12; 20). There is no such thing in scripture as a Sabbath 2.0. According to the scriptures, the Sabbath will be continued in the new heavens and new earth as a holy day of rest after the second coming *see Isaiah 66:22-23.

Take care.

 

[3rdAngel]

ROFL That's too funny. Just because I know a thing or two about the Church Fathers, doesn't mean I share their beliefs. I'm about as far away from being a Christian as the North Pole is from the South Pole. I'm simply using Ignatius letter as a historical source, just as I might use a letter from George Washington.

Yet you post the early Church fathers as if they have authority over the scriptures? Not sure how you did not see that coming.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Yet you post the early Church fathers as if they have authority over the scriptures? Not sure how you did not see that coming.

I don't think either the New Testament or the Church Fathers has "authority." I'm simply quoting a historical document.

 

[3rdAngel]

I don't think either the New Testament or the Church Fathers has "authority." I'm simply quoting a historical document.

Agreed because like many Jews born of the flesh and not of the Spirit Gods promised Messiah is rejected and crucified. You quote the opinion of men in historical documents over the holy scriptures you choose to reject.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Agreed because like many Jews born of the flesh and not of the Spirit Gods promised Messiah is rejected and crucified. You quote the opinion of men in historical documents over the holy scriptures you choose to reject.

sacred texts are not evidence.

 

[3rdAngel]

sacred texts are not evidence.

The sacred texts are not evidence? Sure they are... they are Gods standard of what truth is (Romans 3:4) and the only standard of what is true and evidence for those who believe what God says.

 

[Ebionite]

The sacred texts are not evidence? Sure they are... they are Gods standard of what truth is truth is (Romans 3:4) and the only standard of what is true and evidence for those who believe what God says.

Circular reasoning.

 

[Ebionite]

sacred texts are not evidence.

Sacred texts may contain prophetic insight, which is evidence of divine inspiration.

 

[metis]

Some Christians seemingly forget this:

Matthew 22:36-40 NIV​

“Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

Notice it says "All the Law...". Thus, for some to insist that Christians supposedly must adhere to the Sabbath Laws is not what Jesus commanded.

 

[Ebionite]

Notice it says "All the Law...". Thus, for some to insist that Christians supposedly must adhere to the Sabbath Laws is not what Jesus commanded.

No sequitur. Keeping the sabbath derives from the first commandment of Matthew 22:36-40.

For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Matthew 5:18

 

[metis]

No sequitur. Keeping the sabbath derives from the first commandment of Matthew 22:36-40.

For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Matthew 5:18

Again, let me repeat, Jesus mandated Two Commandments that we are to follow, not 613 Commandments that halacha [Jewish Law] mandates. If you're Jewish, yes, the 613 are to be observed; but if you're not...

 

[Ebionite]

Again, let me repeat, Jesus mandated Two Commandments that we are to follow, not 613 Commandments that halacha [Jewish Law] mandates. If you're Jewish, yes, the 613 are to be observed; but if you're not...

You're cherry picking. There's no reason to ignore Matthew 5:18, and the two commandments can be interpreted as a summary, not a replacement.

 

[Elihoenai]

Agreed. Some here do not want too much similarity between Gods Sabbath, Christianity and Judaism and you can understand why. Some know that there is no scripture that supports the idea that Gods seventh day Sabbath commandment has been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest in honor of the resurrection of Jesus just the same as there is not a single scripture that supports the view that Sunday is "the Lords day" of Revelation 1:10. Then you would have to come to the question, what is the main difference then, between Sabbath keeping Christians and the true understanding of the old covenant laws of atonement and Sabbath keeping Jews born in of the flesh? Well you guessed it. It is the coming of the promised Messiah in Jesus and Gods sacrifice for the sins of the world once and for all and an acknowledgement that true Christianity is now Gods true Israel born not after the flesh but after the Spirit.

God bless.

Romans 8:13

13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.


1) Agreed about the part there is No Scriptural support that Sabbath has been changed to Sunday and that Sunday is the Lord's Day. This teaching has come from the Church Fathers with No Scriptural Bases.

2) There is No Real Difference between Sabbath Keeping Christians and Jews according to the Flesh if Sabbath Keeping Christians Walk according to the Flesh. I have said many times before on these forums, that Christianity, Islam and Judaism are Really Left-Hand Path Religions. The Left-Hand Path Religions Created by Elohim/God is for Elohim's/God's Earthly Kingdom.

 

[3rdAngel]

Circular reasoning.

What are you referring to here?

 

[Ebionite]

What are you referring to here?

Your reference to Romans chapter 3 as the basis of the standard of truth about sacred texts.