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The Prospect of Going to Hell

Balthazzar

Balthazzar

N. Germanic Descent
Trailblazer said:
Sorry, Hebrews 12 is just about as clear as mud. I tend to prefer clear communication, especially when my eternal destiny is at stake.
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It suggests that we live under the refining properties life and all it involves. All the messengers from past to present influence us and guide us, leading us into truth. Here, we go through many struggles, and in the struggles, we learn many things about life and how to navigate more effectively. This process leads us into greater understanding, greater more profound truths and realizations. Our fate on earth, collectively and individually (for better or worse), depends upon our contribution's present day as individuals.
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Balthazzar said:
I see a refinery, our place in the refinery, and our state of being as livings souls living within that sphere (womb) of life. The torments experienced while living, condition us to that end, whereby we become better equipped to produce that which is right from ourselves as gifts to that (womb) and also to the process itself in the present.

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Ok. The Bible presents something different in that there is told there will be a new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness will dwell. During that time many will be brought back to life and so without the current world we live in there will be different reactions to God's rulership.
 
Balthazzar

Balthazzar

N. Germanic Descent
YoursTrue said:
Ok. The Bible presents something different in that there is told there will be a new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness will dwell. During that time many will be brought back to life and so without the current world we live in there will be different reactions to God's rulership.
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I imagine the new to involve a shift in paradigm and what we contribute of ourselves while living here. God's rule is always present. We learn as we go, and the Lord is long suffering to us ward, not willing that any just perish but that all come to repentance. The refining elements of the furnace, life under the sun, leads us into truth when we honor in that spirit.
 
Balthazzar

Balthazzar

N. Germanic Descent
YoursTrue said:
My reaction: this ain't heaven that we live in...
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It's as a refinery where the Lord is with us always, even unto the end of the world (for better or worse). It's the marriage of the lamb and our conduct, as well as our spiritual practice, whether in truth or error, contributes to the condition of our environments and quality of life forevermore.

My reaction is of a similar note: It isn't not heaven, either. A war or disagreement must have happened somewhere along the timeline of our history. Reconciliation isn't always something people are so willing to submit to, so we end up with further disagreements between us.
 
Kathryn

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Balthazzar said:
I won't argue with that logic. The story of our lives, playing out daily as we patiently await the closing scene of a life lived. I agree, make it good or make it bad. I suppose we are responsible for that much, even in what we consider to be.
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As a Catholic, I believe in purgatory. But purgatory is not hell.
 
Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Balthazzar said:
It suggests that we live under the refining properties life and all it involves. All the messengers from past to present influence us and guide us, leading us into truth. Here, we go through many struggles, and in the struggles, we learn many things about life and how to navigate more effectively. This process leads us into greater understanding, greater more profound truths and realizations. Our fate on earth, collectively and individually (for better or worse), depends upon our contribution's present day as individuals.
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Thanks for explaining that. I agree with all those suggestions.
 
amatuerscholar

amatuerscholar

Member
Balthazzar said:
The prospect of going to hell, particularly from a perspective that I've been accustomed most my life is or can be a very difficult thing to acknowledge. I'm a Christian. I understand myself to be a guilty Christian. I understand myself to be guilty and required to give an account of my life and that every word spoken will determine my fate. I'm not unaccustomed to justification attempts. I'm not fond of lying, but I am guilty of it. I'm fairly sure I've lied about others, too. I'm an adulterer, a fornicator (I think) although I'm not certain about this one, I am guilty of dishonoring my parents, of greed, envy, and a host of other things, including drunkenness. Ok, so most of these behaviors have been altered since, but I may still be required to go to hell. I don't have a defense. I'm guilty. I don't think it's as easy as simply believing that Jesus died so I wouldn't go to hell. I'm pretty sure justice must be satisfied. We reap what we sow. I think this is karma. Ok, so this has me a little more at ease, but my past .... man!

I'm a sinner.

What can I do beyond accept that possible and make peace with it?
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I'd suggest reading Paul, specifically Romans. We've all sinned and have come short of the glory of God. The punishment for sin is death, yet the gift of God is eternal life.

Paul tells us time and time that we are all sinners. He's really just expanding on what Jesus was also saying. We all sin. But that doesn't mean we are going to hell. We are given a gift of eternal life.

Hell itself is never actually mentioned in the Bible. What we are told of death, is that it's the end. It's not really mentioned, because the focus shouldn't be death.
 
Balthazzar

Balthazzar

N. Germanic Descent
amatuerscholar said:
I'd suggest reading Paul, specifically Romans. We've all sinned and have come short of the glory of God. The punishment for sin is death, yet the gift of God is eternal life.

Paul tells us time and time that we are all sinners. He's really just expanding on what Jesus was also saying. We all sin. But that doesn't mean we are going to hell. We are given a gift of eternal life.

Hell itself is never actually mentioned in the Bible. What we are told of death, is that it's the end. It's not really mentioned, because the focus shouldn't be death.
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That's both true and untrue. Hell is certainly defined as the grave or sheol, but it is also applied to a burning trash heap in the valley of Hinnom, which coincides with many of Jesus' parables concerning unfruitful branches and chaff, etc. Either way, hell is never spoken of to be anywhere but where we are presently, which is to suggest on earth.

Edit: We're also taught about much more than death. We're taught about two deaths and the resurrection of life as something new. It may be a first is last and last first, rebirth dynamic as a cyclic reality, a pendulum effect or ebb and flow, tide like ongoing sowing and reaping and harvest as it pertains to life.

We're either going to make this something better from here or we're not, and it may end up being destroyed by fire sooner than 5 billion years from now when the sun is due to engulf us into herself or itself, however you wish to identify the sun. Maybe a new birth of a little one after the red giant white dwarfs itself after.

How do those without any religious leanings understand life and our place in it?
 
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Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
amatuerscholar said:
I'd suggest reading Paul, specifically Romans. We've all sinned and have come short of the glory of God. The punishment for sin is death, yet the gift of God is eternal life.

Paul tells us time and time that we are all sinners. He's really just expanding on what Jesus was also saying. We all sin. But that doesn't mean we are going to hell. We are given a gift of eternal life.
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I believe that sin is disobedience to God and that sinning separates a person from God, and since no one is perfectly obedient to God we are all sinners.

I agree that doesn't mean we are going to hell, since we are given a gift of eternal life.

Jesus defined eternal life, and according to his definition we can have eternal life both in this world and in the hereafter.

John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
amatuerscholar said:
Hell itself is never actually mentioned in the Bible. What we are told of death, is that it's the end. It's not really mentioned, because the focus shouldn't be death.
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Do you mean that death is the end of life? Where in the Bible say that death is the end of life?

Surely we do not need the Bible in order to know that death is the end of physical life, but what reason is there to believe that there is nothing beyond physical life?
 
YoursTrue

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Spice said:
Not until you've learned how to view all through your soul.
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Not sure what that means. But if I'm on the right track I'll say we really don't know everything about ourselves. However, there are some things that are more or less clear. Such as thievery, rape, murder. We may have done things that don't even come to light in our own minds as to what we've done wrong.
 
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