the right religion

[Shuttlecraft]

Archaeology can not confirm the existence of the town during the time of Jesus...

For the sake of argument let's suppose Nazareth never existed in his time, can you explain to us why on earth the gospel-writers said it did?
Why didn't they say he came from Jerusalem which definitely did exist?

 

[Ingledsva]

There are books and articles saying false, 2nd century..

And there are books and articles saying 900 BC..
"The excavations by Bagati from 1955 onwards showed that the site of Nazareth had been occupied from 600-900 BC and that there was then a break until 200 BC. It's been continuously inhabited since then"
https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080205114927AAF7N47

But let's just suppose there was no Nazareth in Jesus's time, why on earth would the people who (according to atheists) "made Jesus up", write that he came from a non-existent place?
After the gospels were written, NOBODY ever came forward to say "Rubbish! Nazareth never existed", so the atheist argument doesn't hold water and falls flat..

Not the Nazareth "town site." And by "Pagans."




*

 

[Ingledsva]

For the sake of argument let's suppose Nazareth never existed in his time, can you explain to us why on earth the gospel-writers said it did?
Why didn't they say he came from Jerusalem which definitely did exist?

One idea is that later Christian writers - as usual - didn't understand Tanakh on Messiah prophecy.


Isa 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch (NZR, NetZeR) shall grow out of his roots:


Whoever wrote Matt 2:23 - apparently misunderstood that NZR in Isaiah means netzer = BRANCH. A BRANCH out of the STEM of Jesse.


Mat 2:23 And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, He shall be called a NaZaRene.


They apparently erroneously decided if he was a NaZaRene, He must be from a place called NaZaReth.




*

 

[Shad]

For the sake of argument let's suppose Nazareth never existed in his time, can you explain to us why on earth the gospel-writers said it did?
Why didn't they say he came from Jerusalem which definitely did exist?

Since none of the Gospel writers were in fact their name sakes it is an assumption on their part. The place could be complete mythology like Atlantis in Homer's work. It could be a name for a place in one language, Rum, which has another name in the native language, Roma. The place could be believed to be real when in fact it was not. The same with Arthur's Avalon. We could be superimposing the name of the place after the fact on to the place we associate it with the Gospels. Like calling the city around Thera Atlantis. They could just be repeating what they were told despite any evidence supporting what they were told.

As Ingledsva pointed out it could be the error between associating a group with a place. For example Canada in one of the First Nation People's language means village. However Canada now is a country rather than a village. Canada as a nation does not mean village nor does Canadian mean villager these day. Any example is Wig, political. Yet there is a place called Wig. Wigs (political) must be from Wig (place).

 

[outhouse]

Many of the OT stories are just rewrites of much earlier Sumerian/Babylonian/Mesopotamian myth.

The Genesis creation myth has great similarities to the Babylonian creation myth, the Enuma Elish.

Humans are also formed out of dirt or clay in the Mesopotamian stories.

The Garden of Eden = Edin in a Sumerian creation myth. The Sumerian story also includes the eating of a forbidden plant which brings down a curse and a "rib woman", Ninti.

Wiki also says about the Epic of Gilgamesh: "The parallels between the stories of Enkidu/Shamhat and Adam/Eve have been long recognized by scholars.[20] In both, a man is created from the soil by a god, and lives in a natural setting amongst the animals. He is introduced to a woman who tempts him. In both stories the man accepts food from the woman, covers his nakedness, and must leave his former realm, unable to return. The presence of a snake that steals a plant of immortality from the hero later in the epic is another point of similarity."

Noah = Atra-Hasis in the Mesopotamian accounts. The rainbow is also given an explanation similar to the one in the Genesis account, where it's the necklace of the Goddess, Ishtar and serves as a reminder for her not to forget the Flood. There's a Greek story where Zeus floods the Earth, wiping out humanity due to our wicknessnes, but Prometheus saves a man and a woman by putting them on a boat.

Moses' childhood story is lifted from King Sargon of Akkad's story.

Moses being given the stone tablets from God is lifted from the story of the Sun God, Shamash, handing down the law to Hammurabi while atop a ziggurat. (Much of the Mosaic Law was based on or even lifted from the Code of Hammurabi.)

There's other stories that were taken from earlier Pagan myths, such as Samson, Abraham and Isaac and some of the Psalms were originally written for Baal. I could go on.

So Jews and Christians believe in Pagan myths and accept them as the word of their god. Go figure. It's really quite funny.

Yes true. But I can pick a few small errors. But great job.

Moses historicity is guessed and not know for certain.

10 commandments yes book of the dead Sumerians first


The flood go's back to Ziusudra first, before the Akkadians

 

[outhouse]

For the sake of argument let's suppose Nazareth never existed in his time, can you explain to us why on earth the gospel-writers said it did?
Why didn't they say he came from Jerusalem which definitely did exist?

It was most probably there.


I can tell you no credible scholar questions its existence.



But here is why. As Sepphoris was being rebuilt in Jesus time. many satellite villages popped up to take care of the huge agrarian needs placed on the people by Herods.

Nazareth was a perfect spot for a work camp for the rebuilding of Sepphoris, due to its well. It also would have been used for agriculture as feeding the newly arrived 10,000-20,000 people was no easy task. Wagon trains came from all over just to keep it fed.

With that many people coming into the area, you bet there would have been people living there as long as there was water. And there was.

 

[Shuttlecraft]

It [Nazareth] was most probably there.
I can tell you no credible scholar questions its existence.
As Sepphoris was being rebuilt in Jesus time. many satellite villages popped up...
Nazareth was a perfect spot for a work camp for the rebuilding of Sepphoris, due to its well..

Yes, nobody in their right mind doubts Nazareth existed in Jesus's time..
It was just a few houses at first and virtually unheard of, but became a big "work camp" suburb of Sepphoris when Herod decided to renovate Sepphoris just 4 miles away, and no doubt Jesus as a carpenter commuted there regularly.
The Hebrew name of Sepphoris was 'Zippori" (bird) reflecting its lofty location on a four hundred-foot hill overlooking the Bet Netofa Valley, which ties in to this verse-
"They got up, drove him [Jesus] out of the town, and took him to the brow of the hill on which the town was built, in order to throw him down the cliff. But he walked right through the crowd and went on his way" (Luke 4:29)

Part of Sepphoris-

 

[outhouse]

no doubt Jesus as a carpenter commuted there regularly.

We don't know that for certain, but it is possible.


The thing is the Hellenist there, and it was a Hellenist capitol, would have amounted to jesus enemy. The Hellenist perverted Judaism and they not only extorted the poor, they made their lives a living hell.

The burden placed on the peasants by Herods was immense, and the socioeconomic divide was night and day difference from peasants.

It seems by our best accounts Jesus stayed in peasant villages teaching to Aramaic Jews. Pious Jews and Galilean Aramaic Jews were, would not have taken kindly to their oppressors.

John the Baptist Jesus teacher was living outdoors and said to eat bugs all though that could be translation errors, either way it is night and day different then the straight cut finished and polished stones these lavish opulent houses were in Sepphoris, with tiled floors and painted and mosaics on the walls.


Nazareth, had crude fieldstones stacked up that were known to fall in on people killing them. They were packed with mud and feces with no windows and one oil lamp. They also lived with animals in the house.


Due to the socioeconomic divide, and the major differences in Judaism and working hand in hand with Romans as client kings, and the the lack of any mention of Jesus teaching in these big cities in scripture. He may have never worked there. We don't know.



It was also laid out in a military fashion to be a Roman stronghold if needed.

 

[psychoslice]

I feel there is no such thing as a right religion, true religion is only found within each one of us. If there was such thing as a right religion, then who's religion is right, and why, can anyone prove that their religion is the right one beyond all doubt, of course not, each one of us must find our own inner religion, our own inn being, anything else is second hand knowledge, and always objective, this is not religion.

 

[Shad]

It was most probably there.


I can tell you no credible scholar questions its existence.

There are number that question it in fact. However artifacts dating to a few decades before and after Jesus are close enough to reasonable conclude it was in fact there and inhabited. The variant in dating methods have a margin of error in both late and early artifacts. This range falls into the life-span of Jesus. However it is this variant which is the cause of questioning when it was rebuilt.

Yardenna Alexandre released a book on the 98/99 dig in 2012. It can be found online. Also look up IAA report 49

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

There is a important fact absent from interlocutors here
The tarihalansanet in two stages
Before the invention of writing
This history is missing, don't know anything about him
But after the invention of writing
Humanity has entered a new stage
This stage is that we are talking about
After the Sumerians
The Sumerians emerged in Mesopotamia and disappeared
From history
And inheriting them the Akkadian and Chaldeans and Assyrians
These civilizations had important weight in the construction of human thought
Particular religious
But these civilizations cat looking for the creator or the engine and also were looking for the idea of human destiny after death
This is the focus of the epic of Gilgamesh historical
So who wants to search for the origins of religion, it must return to the civilizations of Mesopotamia and Egypt
In religious thought
At the point that the human being is the representative of God on Earth
And have not developed
But the shift in religious thought with Ibrahim
You get out of ur of the Chaldeans land
It advocates a new idea
The avkrh developed by the Hebrews
Any sons of Israel in
This religious thought also carried the aspirations of the people of
And also the history of humanity
Therefore when we consider the audit last patches of previous religions
This is not a flaw in the Jewish religion and the Christian
Because religion is the synthesis of human experience
And not only the revelation of heaven
Christianity and Judaism have past and look forward to being
Through the values and concepts common to all Nations and peoples
The proof and evidence
The Assyrian people rejects the Biblical God walkeldni
But who converted to Christianity
They were in their conscience that Christianity consistent with principles classy they aspire to achieve
They were the Nations athkoltha wars and victories
But with Jesus thought they would find immortality
Yes the idea of eternity of the beginning of humanity and humanitarian focus day
I've got some sort of historical reconciliation between peoples after Christ
Yes-es of the message of Christ to all Nations
Sustainability concepts are abstract human experience
In terms of the concepts of goodness and peace
base and the Jews
And the top of Christ
Complete religious thought with Christ
Easy terms
Human concepts
Jesus did not say the words out on human reason and logic
I came to Islam and destruction of this humanitarian accord
And to present date
I've come back to back when they embraced religious Islamic thought
It is not thought the human experience
It erases all human experience and take away its right through the lie and God saved louh House
This put himself in the position of hostility to Christianity and Judaism
So who wants to demolish the religious thought of humanitarian
Is Islam
To search you must read the Qur'an
Permission
We believe that human thought will not return to the era of serenity and harmony only after we disclose the fact Islam
Here's an example of realistic
Any talk about the violation of religious thought in Islamic countries, all
That take away human intellectual freedom
While in other countries where Christianity or Paganism are the majority we find large areas of intellectual freedom of religion
The pagan meets Christian in the area of intellectual freedom
While Islam abolished this freedom also human is a difficult word, oops will not flaunt it
Here you must put this important issue when talking about religion
The ymengk freedom of thought
Is the best humane
Because freedom of thought means always search for God, and God in the Bible and Christianity is a compendium of human experience

 

[Shuttlecraft]

..each one of us must find our own inner religion...

Over 2 billion people have plumped for Christianity, making it the biggest game on the park by far, I wonder why?

Here's a little clue..-

Christianity has Jesus the Son of God himself in it.
Islam - doesn't
Judaism - doesn't
Sikhism - doesn't
Buddhism - doesn't
Hinduism - doesn't
Spiritism - doesn't
Bahai - doesn't
Jainism - doesn't
Shinto - doesn't
Taoism - doesn't
Zoroastanism - doesn't
Paganism - doesn't
Rastafarianism - doesn't
Scientology - doesn't
Chinese traditional - doesn't
African tribal - doesn't
Cao Dai - doesn't
Tenrikyo - doesn't
New Age - doesn't
Unitarian - doesn't
Native American - doesn't
Fairy-worshipping cults etc - don't

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Over 2 billion people have plumped for Christianity, making it the biggest game on the park by far, I wonder why?

Here's a little clue..-

Christianity has Jesus the Son of God himself in it.
Islam - doesn't
Judaism - doesn't
Sikhism - doesn't
Buddhism - doesn't
Hinduism - doesn't
Spiritism - doesn't
Bahai - doesn't
Jainism - doesn't
Shinto - doesn't
Taoism - doesn't
Zoroastanism - doesn't
Paganism - doesn't
Rastafarianism - doesn't
Scientology - doesn't
Chinese traditional - doesn't
African tribal - doesn't
Cao Dai - doesn't
Tenrikyo - doesn't
New Age - doesn't
Unitarian - doesn't
Native American - doesn't
Fairy-worshipping cults etc - don't

Wow! That was a load of nonsense. Most people are Christians because they were born into Christian cultures and raised Christian. That number is also probably inflated to a great extent because many people, especially in the West, are "nominal Christians" in that they identify as Christians culturally and because it's a part of their family tradition, but don't really practice it as a religion. So they'll identify themselves as Christians in polls. Some churches, like the Catholic Church, go by how many are baptized Catholics, so you'll always be counted as a Catholic even if you don't practice it anymore. There's no real way to "unjoin" the Catholic Church and no real way to remove yourself from "the rolls".

We know that church attendance is plummeting in the West and many formally Christian European countries have irreligious majorities ("the nones").

 

[Shuttlecraft]

Wow! That was a load of nonsense. Most people are Christians because they were born into Christian cultures and raised Christian..

Not me, my parents weren't the least bit religious; I knew my dad secretly respected Jesus because I saw him watching 'Jesus of Nazareth' on TV from behind his newspaper.
As for my mother, when our cat asked for a morsel of food from my her dinner plate she yelled "Get down" and made as if to kick him but he ran off, so I said "Jesus won't like you doing that", and she replied "I don't care about bleddy Jesus!"

From the religious lessons at school me and my mates gathered that Jesus was basically a nice guy but felt sorry for him because he never seemed to have much fun.
Later I realised he was a very tough cookie and changed my opinion of him..

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Not me, my parents weren't the least bit religious; I knew my dad secretly respected Jesus because I saw him watching 'Jesus of Nazareth' on TV from behind his newspaper.
As for my mother, when our cat asked for a morsel of food from my her dinner plate she yelled "Get down" and made as if to kick him but he ran off, so I said "Jesus won't like you doing that", and she replied "I don't care about bleddy Jesus!"

At school me and my mates thought Jesus was basically a nice guy but felt sorry for him because he never seemed to have much fun.
Later I realised he was a very tough cookie and changed my opinion of him..

That's nice, but irrelevant to my post.

 

[Shuttlecraft]

That's nice, but irrelevant to my post.

Catholics, Protestants, Mormons, Jehovahs, Pentecostals, Rapturists, Adventists, Quakers, Calvinists etc all have different styles of play, but so what?
At least they've got Jesus in there somewhere as their team captain..

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Catholics, Protestants, Mormons, Jehovahs, Pentecostals, Rapturists, Adventists, Quakers, Calvinists etc all have different styles of play, but so what?
At least they've got Jesus in there somewhere as their team captain..

That's not relevant to my post, either.

 

[Shuttlecraft]

That's not relevant to my post, either.

Sure, there are many different branches of the main religions but so what?
Even atheists are divided, for example some say Jesus never existed but some say he did..
Incidentally as a matter of interest, what do atheists tell their kids when they ask- "mummy and daddy, is there a god?"
If the parents say "No", isn't that brainwashing their kids?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Sure, there are many different branches of the main religions but so what?
Even atheists are divided, for example some say Jesus never existed but some say he did..
Incidentally as a matter of interest, what do atheists tell their kids when they ask- "mummy and daddy, is there a god?"
If the parents say "No", isn't that brainwashing their kids?

Obviously, you're just talking to yourself at this point.

 

[1robin]

Wow! That was a load of nonsense. Most people are Christians because they were born into Christian cultures and raised Christian. That number is also probably inflated to a great extent because many people, especially in the West, are "nominal Christians" in that they identify as Christians culturally and because it's a part of their family tradition, but don't really practice it as a religion. So they'll identify themselves as Christians in polls. Some churches, like the Catholic Church, go by how many are baptized Catholics, so you'll always be counted as a Catholic even if you don't practice it anymore. There's no real way to "unjoin" the Catholic Church and no real way to remove yourself from "the rolls".

We know that church attendance is plummeting in the West and many formally Christian European countries have irreligious majorities ("the nones").

Most people born to MIT graduates know the quadratic equation. Most born in Zimbabwe do not. Is the quadratic any less true? Not to mention Christianity's explosion in a nation hostile to it and conquering a powerful empire by conversion not the sword that was intent on destroying it. Is any truth that convinces a majority of those exposed to it, wrong?

You are right that church attendance is down in Europe which says more about the corporatization of religion than faith, since Christian faith adds the equivalent of the population of Nevada per year. Doing so even without Islam's mandating it in the crib or punishing leaving it by death.