the right religion

[jelly]

Because it's just as bad as joking about a person's weight, or just joking about fat people in general; it's just not decent. And especially when you're making fun of someone's deity, whom that person "worships" and may or may not believe is the Creator and Master of the Universe. And especially asking such a person if he knows jokes about his own God/Prophet right in front of him. I don't think that is right. Now, if you want to joke in private, that's your business (freedom of speech). But to do so in front of those who hold what you're making fun of as dear to them, that's just not right.

a joke about food is different than a joke about a person's weight.
people can be "fat" for other reasons.
using your logic there cannot be jokes about anything.
why is your opinion more valuable than mine when it comes to the nobility of telling jokes about deities?
AND, I think you argument so far to support your opinion is a joke and I think it was very rude for you to try to make it seem like I had committed a transgression of some type when nothing is wrong except your personal standards that are irrational.

 

[Riverwolf]

I am sorry, I am not really interested in discussing whether you like or don't like my questions. I'm interested in seeing any answers to them.

I have given the answers to the best of my knowledge, and you reject them as false.

BTW, I have read some of the interpretations for the contradictions I speak of. None of them are satisfactory.

 

[Mark2020]

First of all, there were many prophecies that were NOT fulfilled by Jesus. There is so much on this topic that I wouldn't be able to really address all of them here. However, there is a great book called 26 Reasons Why Jews Don't Believe in Jesus by Asher Norman, that addresses all (or most) of your questions. I highly recommend the book to those who want to understand "why Jews don't believe in Jesus." The link on Amazon is Amazon.com: Twenty-Six Reasons Why Jews Don't Believe In Jesus (9780977193707): Asher Norman: Books, and the link to his website is 26Reasons.com ~ 26 Reasons Why Jews Don't Believe In Jesus? By Asher Norman.
In Reason 13, he shows how the authors of the Christian Bible employed a number of deceptive techniques to shoehorn Jesus into the text. I will list those techniques in order (but I can't explain them here):
1) Messianic prophecies were invented and then attributed to Jesus;
2) Non-messianic prophecies were turned into messianic prophecies;
3) Versus in the Jewish Bible were taken out of context in the Christian Bible;
4) Verses in the Jewish Bible were mistranslated, words and phrases were invented and tenses were altered;
5) Verses in the Jewish Bible were misappropriated to support messianic claims about Jesus.

I'll just give you one example, something I think we discussed earlier:
The Christian Bible (NKJ) Matthew 1: 22-23: The Christian Bible says, "Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying: "Behold, a virgin shall be with child and will bear a son and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which translated means, God is with us." (Matthew 1:22-23, citing Isaiah 7:14).

The Jewish Bible (Stone Edition) Isaiah 7:14: Properly translated [as it has been understood by the Jewish nation ever since the prophecy was originally written], Isaiah said, "Behold, the [not "a"] young woman [not "virgin"] is [not "shall be"] with child and will bear a son and she [not "they"] will call his name Emmanuel." (Isaiah 7:14)

This is just one of many examples of how the original Hebrew text (which the Jews still use to this day written in their Torah scrolls, as it has been written on ever since the Torah was first given to the Jewish People) was twisted and changed to suit the early founders' of Christianity objectives.

OK. Thanks for the tip about the book.
I think you are refering to the prophecies that we Christians believe will be fulfilled in the second coming of Jesus.

I understand that the jewish point of view about such prophecies is that they don't apply to Christ. Of course there are a lot of Christian literature that support the contrary.

We've discussed 2 verses here, I checked grammar (from books about ancient hebbrew) and context and I have to say I didn't see what he claims about taking verses out of context and twisting meanings.

I've already given you my opinion about these two verses, and some points that support it.

 

[Mark2020]

I have given the answers to the best of my knowledge, and you reject them as false.

You gave your opinion without any proof and judged my questions to be meaningless.

BTW, I have read some of the interpretations for the contradictions I speak of. None of them are satisfactory.

Then read more and try to read without prejudice.

 

[PeaceLoveJoy]

I believe God is out there. I believe he spoke to us in a way that would make scene. Religion is largely based on culture, before telephones their was no way someone in London could get a message to someone in china so God did the next best thing. He gave everyone a path to him. Now I could be completely wrong. But really beside books on what to do and what to believe what do other religions have. All books are written by man, all prophecies delivered by man. And man is in no way perfect.

 

[Mark2020]

a joke about food is different than a joke about a person's weight.
people can be "fat" for other reasons.
using your logic there cannot be jokes about anything.
why is your opinion more valuable than mine when it comes to the nobility of telling jokes about deities?
AND, I think you argument so far to support your opinion is a joke and I think it was very rude for you to try to make it seem like I had committed a transgression of some type when nothing is wrong except your personal standards that are irrational.

That's definitely off-topic, and probably off-forum.
Maybe you could find other places where you find/discuss your jokes.

 

[jelly]

That's definitely off-topic, and probably off-forum.
Maybe you could find other places where you find/discuss your jokes.

and you have anything besides your opinion?

 

[Mark2020]

and you have anything besides your opinion?

Read the title of the topic and the banner of the forum.

 

[jelly]

Read the title of the topic and the banner of the forum.

I was having a conversation with islam abdullah, whats its face interrupted.
there is no need for you to continue the interruption, unless you want to.

 

[Mark2020]

I was having a conversation with islam abdullah, whats its face interrupted.
there is no need for you to continue the interruption, unless you want to.

I can't see a coversation going on right now.

Maybe this looks normal to you but others might not like it. So I hope if we are more considerate to each other's feelings, and stick to the topic.

 

[jelly]

I can't see a coversation going on right now.

Maybe this looks normal to you but others might not like it. So I hope if we are more considerate to each other's feelings, and stick to the topic.

since you are into the obvious.
check the time stamps of each post in this thread.
it will help with your understanding.

 

[Mark2020]

since you are into the obvious.
check the time stamps of each post in this thread.
it will help with your understanding.

Then please accept my applogies if I bothered you.
Hopefully you'll be more considerate of others' feelings in your posts here.

 

[jelly]

Then please accept my applogies if I bothered you.
Hopefully you'll be more considerate of others' feelings in your posts here.

I accept your apologies.

 

[Riverwolf]

You gave your opinion without any proof and judged my questions to be meaningless.

Only the first questions. Your second questions were valid, and I answered them as best as I could.

But regardless, considering the lack of certainty on this subject, you're only going to get opinions as answers. If that's not enough for you, too bad. Not all questions can be answered fully.

Then read more and try to read without prejudice.

I did. The only apparent contradiction that was satisfactorily compromised as not one at all was the apparent conflict of Matthew 5:16 and Matthew 6:1-6: the first one simply says not to try hiding good deeds, while the second serves as a good check on this by saying not to deliberately make a show of good deeds. The idea is to do good for God's sake and not one's own. Taking both teachings into account will allow someone to feel comfortable doing good deeds in public, with the idea of helping others watching reach closer to God, but without glorifying himself.

But, hey, it's not textual contradictions I'm talking about; those are EASILY compromised. It's the problem of inconsistent teachings.

Besides, I have my own Scriptures to read and study, and we Hindus have a TON of them.

 

[Yanni]

OK. Thanks for the tip about the book.
I think you are refering to the prophecies that we Christians believe will be fulfilled in the second coming of Jesus.

I understand that the jewish point of view about such prophecies is that they don't apply to Christ. Of course there are a lot of Christian literature that support the contrary.

We've discussed 2 verses here, I checked grammar (from books about ancient hebbrew) and context and I have to say I didn't see what he claims about taking verses out of context and twisting meanings.

I've already given you my opinion about these two verses, and some points that support it.

I should point out that the "second coming" theory has no scriptural basis in the Torah. In fact, scripture states that when a man dies, "on that day his plans all perish," (Psalms 146:4). In fact, the Messiah is not supposed to die before accomplishing his mission. Now, since Jesus dies without fulfilling any of the six primary messianic criteria, the authors and editors of the Christian Bible were forced to find a way to justify and give meaning to Jesus' death to deal with this major theological problem. They invented the non-Jewish idea that the Messiah ben David was supposed to die before fulfilling his mission and that his death redeemed the sins of the world. Christian missionaries use Christian mistranslations of Isaiah 53 and Daniel 9 in the "Old Testament" as their primary proof-texts to support the Christian theology that the Messiah ben David is supposed to die before he fulfills his mission. According to Mark, Luke, and Matthew, Jesus said that it was necessary for him to "die and rise again on the third day" to fulfill Jewish "prophecy." Unfortunately for Jesus' credibility, there is no such prophecy in the Jewish Bible. There just has never been, in the history of the Jewish People, long before Jesus ever arrived on the scene, a concept in Jewish doctrine that the Messiah will come a "second time."

 

[SuzyQ]

Hi,
I think G-d allows many religions for the different nations, He told Abraham (Avraham) that there's only One true G-d and to pass this along, this faith and that's what he taught his children. However, He didn't mean to pass it along by the sword he invited people to his tent by way of hospitality. Adam, the first man's first job was to tend to the garden and he was a vegetarian by the way.

 

[SuzyQ]

The Messiah is suppose to bring world peace and it hasn't happened yet. When Jesus died his followers invented a whole mythology and religion to explain the shock that their leader left them without fulfilling what he was suppose to do.

 

[otokage007]

the right religion? the DEAD religion!:yes:

 

[scottaleger]

Humanities is the right Religion

 

[Mark2020]

I should point out that the "second coming" theory has no scriptural basis in the Torah. In fact, scripture states that when a man dies, "on that day his plans all perish," (Psalms 146:4). In fact, the Messiah is not supposed to die before accomplishing his mission. Now, since Jesus dies without fulfilling any of the six primary messianic criteria, the authors and editors of the Christian Bible were forced to find a way to justify and give meaning to Jesus' death to deal with this major theological problem. They invented the non-Jewish idea that the Messiah ben David was supposed to die before fulfilling his mission and that his death redeemed the sins of the world. Christian missionaries use Christian mistranslations of Isaiah 53 and Daniel 9 in the "Old Testament" as their primary proof-texts to support the Christian theology that the Messiah ben David is supposed to die before he fulfills his mission. According to Mark, Luke, and Matthew, Jesus said that it was necessary for him to "die and rise again on the third day" to fulfill Jewish "prophecy." Unfortunately for Jesus' credibility, there is no such prophecy in the Jewish Bible. There just has never been, in the history of the Jewish People, long before Jesus ever arrived on the scene, a concept in Jewish doctrine that the Messiah will come a "second time."

OK, this verse applies to normal men, but when this man is God who appeared in flesh, then the case is different.
I checked the LXX and the JPS and both look like the English translations for Isaiah 53.
I'll have to disagree, I've read some prophecies about Jesus' suffering, death and rise from the dead in the Psalms, Isaiah, among others. There were even prophecies that He would be rejected by jews, for a while.