The suffering servant of isaiah 53

[Ben Masada]

Very gooood!! I have taught you something.


If you keep your responses short, its less things i have, to use your own words against you.

Good job:clap

As you can see, sometimes you can teach something too.

Ben

 

[gnostic]

Boy let me show you just a little of how blind i am--God gave the covenant of the seventh day in Genesis and then later restates it and in more detail when it was given to Moses---Is this two different covenants? Come now

As I said some covenant were confirmed or fulfil later, while others are new and separate covenant.

As to your question about Sabbath, he is restating the covenant (as you have stated), and cementing into law. I would agree with you that the covenant is the same one as the one in Genesis, but you must also considered other promises made to Noah, Abraham, Moses and David. Are all these promises/covenants different or the same.

There was covenant to Noah (Genesis 8:21-22) of not destroying mankind again. Read it. Does it have anything to do with Sabbath?

But God told Moses that he would provided them with laws (Torah), not just about the Sabbath.

Also in Exodus 3 (the burning bush incident), God told Moses that he would free Israelites from slavery. This was fulfilled later at Mount Horeb (Sinai) with the Ten Commandments. What does freeing the Israelites have to do with Sabbath? Nothing.

Again, are you blind and don't see it?

God promised Abraham land that his future descendants could call home - Canaan. God then refirmed this covenant to Isaac, Jacob, and later still with Moses. But this covenant wasn't fufilled until Joshua's time.

What does this covenant have to do with the seventh day in Genesis (Sabbath)? Absolutely nothing.

I don't remember which chapters or verses but I distinctly recall God promise David that his line would have kingship. Does this have anything to do with the Sabbath of Genesis? No.

Are you really that narrow-minded or blind to see any of that?

If you don't see, then please explain to me how this is all just one single covenant?

So far you offer no explanation to those I have mentioned. Refute them if you can.

 

[AK4]

As I said some covenant were confirmed or fulfil later, while others are new and separate covenant.

As to your question about Sabbath, he is restating the covenant (as you have stated), and cementing into law. I would agree with you that the covenant is the same one as the one in Genesis, but you must also considered other promises made to Noah, Abraham, Moses and David. Are all these promises/covenants different or the same.

There was covenant to Noah (Genesis 8:21-22) of not destroying mankind again. Read it. Does it have anything to do with Sabbath?

But God told Moses that he would provided them with laws (Torah), not just about the Sabbath.

Also in Exodus 3 (the burning bush incident), God told Moses that he would free Israelites from slavery. This was fulfilled later at Mount Horeb (Sinai) with the Ten Commandments. What does freeing the Israelites have to do with Sabbath? Nothing.

Again, are you blind and don't see it?

God promised Abraham land that his future descendants could call home - Canaan. God then refirmed this covenant to Isaac, Jacob, and later still with Moses. But this covenant wasn't fufilled until Joshua's time.

What does this covenant have to do with the seventh day in Genesis (Sabbath)? Absolutely nothing.

I don't remember which chapters or verses but I distinctly recall God promise David that his line would have kingship. Does this have anything to do with the Sabbath of Genesis? No.

Are you really that narrow-minded or blind to see any of that?

If you don't see, then please explain to me how this is all just one single covenant?

So far you offer no explanation to those I have mentioned. Refute them if you can.

To show you how narrow minded i am okay i will. All simple answers but really if i do it i know those of you who dont have the eyes to see spiritually will not agree but i will do it anyway for those who God may be opening up their eyes eventually
so i will-----tomorrow. I got to go to sleep for work tomorrow-- to be continued....

 

[AK4]

As I said some covenant were confirmed or fulfil later, while others are new and separate covenant.

As to your question about Sabbath, he is restating the covenant (as you have stated), and cementing into law. I would agree with you that the covenant is the same one as the one in Genesis, but you must also considered other promises made to Noah, Abraham, Moses and David. Are all these promises/covenants different or the same.

There was covenant to Noah (Genesis 8:21-22) of not destroying mankind again. Read it. Does it have anything to do with Sabbath?

Sabbath is rest right so Lets see if you can find rest in all these--Can Noah and his seed (he had 3 sons and they say that from his 3 sons the races of the world came--I dont totally believe this but lets go with this thought) REST because they know that God will not destroy the land with a flood?


But God told Moses that he would provided them with laws (Torah), not just about the Sabbath.

Heres REST again, BUT the REST of the Sabbath was already being commanded by God to keep before the Ten Commandments were given. Sooooooo.......

Also in Exodus 3 (the burning bush incident), God told Moses that he would free Israelites from slavery. This was fulfilled later at Mount Horeb (Sinai) with the Ten Commandments. What does freeing the Israelites have to do with Sabbath? Nothing.

Freedom from slavery. Sounds like rest to me. Or am i blind still?


Again, are you blind and don't see it?

God promised Abraham land that his future descendants could call home - Canaan. God then refirmed this covenant to Isaac, Jacob, and later still with Moses. But this covenant wasn't fufilled until Joshua's time.

What does this covenant have to do with the seventh day in Genesis (Sabbath)? Absolutely nothing.

Gee what could Jos 1:15 mean just for starters

I don't remember which chapters or verses but I distinctly recall God promise David that his line would have kingship. Does this have anything to do with the Sabbath of Genesis? No.

Rest in the kingship of Jesus. Mt 11:28

Are you really that narrow-minded or blind to see any of that?

I rephrase the question to you, but you dont have to answer i know the answer.

If you don't see, then please explain to me how this is all just one single covenant?

So far you offer no explanation to those I have mentioned. Refute them if you can.

Now i just gave you stuff you would understand. If i gave you the spiritual meanings you definitely wouldnt see.

 

[gnostic]

They are not good explanation, AK4.

Sabbath is only a fraction of the law that God gave to Moses, and only a tenth of the Ten Commandment, and the combined books make up the Torah. But you don't seem to see that. So it would be waste of my time to explain to you.

In any case, I will take your words for it that you believe what you say, because I've given up on trying to convince you that you points are sadly lacking in substances.

 

[Charity]

OMG Ben how long are you going to keep this poor servant suffering?

Can't you put him to rest and let him enjoy the peace....

 

[AK4]

They are not good explanation, AK4.

Sabbath is only a fraction of the law that God gave to Moses, and only a tenth of the Ten Commandment, and the combined books make up the Torah. But you don't seem to see that. So it would be waste of my time to explain to you.

In any case, I will take your words for it that you believe what you say, because I've given up on trying to convince you that you points are sadly lacking in substances.

The substance i could give you, you wont see anyway because you dont believe so like i said and i gave you the earthly because you if i gave you the heavenly you wouldnt understand anyway---to parrot Jesus

Joh 3:12 - If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

Sabbath is only a fraction of the law that God gave to Moses, and only a tenth of the Ten Commandment, and the combined books make up the Torah. But you don't seem to see that. So it would be waste of my time to explain to you.

And you know the sad thing about it is i gave you proof but you deny it. This comment shows your ignorance. "only a fraction" SO WHAT. If its a fraction or the whole i showed you that the Sabbath was in all of the so called covenants that you and ben want to make up. ITS ONE COVENANT:slap::thud:

 

[Ben Masada]

OMG Ben how long are you going to keep this poor servant suffering?

Can't you put him to rest and let him enjoy the peace....

One of the words of Jesus still on the cross was: "Father, fogive them for they don't know what they do."
I could very well say the same to you now, becuase indeed you don't know what you say.


The peace that "this poor Servant" is not allowed to enjoy, resides the peace that you are allowed to.
If you read Ezekiel 31:35-37, you will understand that there won't be Earth for the rest of Mankind to stay if "this poor Servant" is allowed to leave.
That's sad but "this poor Servant" must go on dying, so that you should go on living.

Ben :sad4:

 

[Charity]

One of the words of Jesus still on the cross was: "Father, fogive them for they don't know what they do."
I could very well say the same to you now, becuase indeed you don't know what you say.


The peace that "this poor Servant" is not allowed to enjoy, resides the peace that you are allowed to.
If you read Ezekiel 31:35-37, you will understand that there won't be Earth for the rest of Mankind to stay if "this poor Servant" is allowed to leave.
That's sad but "this poor Servant" must go on dying, so that you should go on living.

Ben :sad4:

Ya big cry baby.....*she lays in floor kicking and screaming* I do too, know what I say, I do too, know what I say....Waaaah....take it back Ben or I'll put a frog in your soup......Geez Ben if you want to play childish games..........

 

[Jeremy Mason]

Ya big cry baby.....*she lays in floor kicking and screaming* I do too, know what I say, I do too, know what I say....Waaaah....take it back Ben or I'll put a frog in your soup......Geez Ben if you want to play childish games..........

Did someone call me.

 

[AK4]

One of the words of Jesus still on the cross was: "Father, fogive them for they don't know what they do."
I could very well say the same to you now, becuase indeed you don't know what you say.


The peace that "this poor Servant" is not allowed to enjoy, resides the peace that you are allowed to.
If you read Ezekiel 31:35-37, you will understand that there won't be Earth for the rest of Mankind to stay if "this poor Servant" is allowed to leave.
That's sad but "this poor Servant" must go on dying, so that you should go on living.

Ben :sad4:

Just going out on a limb here, but SINCE WHEN DID THE 31ST CHAPTER OF EZEKIEL GO PAST THE 18TH VERSE!!

 

[Halcyon]

Just going out on a limb here, but SINCE WHEN DID THE 31ST CHAPTER OF EZEKIEL GO PAST THE 18TH VERSE!!

Perhaps he meant the 31st chapter plus the 35th through 37th?

 

[Ben Masada]

Just going out on a limb here, but SINCE WHEN DID THE 31ST CHAPTER OF EZEKIEL GO PAST THE 18TH VERSE!!

Oh! I am deeply sorry for that mistake. I meant Jeremiah. It was not even a lapse of the mind but of the finger.
Whatever, I apologize. Make it Jeremiah 31:35-37.

Thank you

Ben:bow:

 

[Ben Masada]

Ya big cry baby.....*she lays in floor kicking and screaming* I do too, know what I say, I do too, know what I say....Waaaah....take it back Ben or I'll put a frog in your soup......Geez Ben if you want to play childish games..........

It's okay if you can't beat him; but be sport and join him.
If Zechariah prophesied the truth, soon or later you will anyway.
Read what he says in Zechariah 8:23.

Ben :bow:

 

[Ben Masada]

Perhaps he meant the 31st chapter plus the 35th through 37th?

No, I meant Jeremiah 31:35-37. I apologize for the mistake.

Ben :sorry1:

 

[gnostic]

And you know the sad thing about it is i gave you proof but you deny it. This comment shows your ignorance. "only a fraction" SO WHAT. If its a fraction or the whole i showed you that the Sabbath was in all of the so called covenants that you and ben want to make up. ITS ONE COVENANT

Actually I admitted that the Sabbath was one of the many covenants. I am not ignoring the Sabbath at all. I am just saying that there were more than one covenant. There's difference from I am saying to what you're saying.

But you're reply in post #124 is rather disappointing.

I gave you points where there were different covenants for different people and at different time. So what did you give me?

Sabbath is rest right so Lets see if you can find rest in all these--Can Noah and his seed (he had 3 sons and they say that from his 3 sons the races of the world came--I dont totally believe this but lets go with this thought) REST because they know that God will not destroy the land with a flood?

Heres REST again, BUT the REST of the Sabbath was already being commanded by God to keep before the Ten Commandments were given. Sooooooo.......

Freedom from slavery. Sounds like rest to me. Or am i blind still?

If you call these "explanations", then I am afraid I should have not asked.

 

[AK4]

Actually I admitted that the Sabbath was one of the many covenants. I am not ignoring the Sabbath at all. I am just saying that there were more than one covenant. There's difference from I am saying to what you're saying.

But you're reply in post #124 is rather disappointing.

I gave you points where there were different covenants for different people and at different time. So what did you give me?



If you call these "explanations", then I am afraid I should have not asked.

See what you fail to understand it is the same way God describes the resurrection--He gives a detail here a detail there and detail here and a detail there in so many different verse and yet its still talking about one resurrection

 

[gnostic]

See what you fail to understand it is the same way God describes the resurrection--He gives a detail here a detail there and detail here and a detail there in so many different verse and yet its still talking about one resurrection

A pathetic explanation for a totally unrelated events.

I gave many examples of different covenants, but you're saying that they are just ONE covenant.

And since you can't see the difference, and worse you give me pointless explanations, there's really no of continuing, is there?

 

[AK4]

A pathetic explanation for a totally unrelated events.

I gave many examples of different covenants, but you're saying that they are just ONE covenant.

And since you can't see the difference, and worse you give me pointless explanations, there's really no of continuing, is there?

Oh this is an edit line here-- I mean do you lack common sense--you think you gave many examples of different covenants and then I show you just one example of how they are the same but you still dont believe. You and ben sit in the same boat because--

Luke 16:19-31 ....neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
What? You trying to bait me? Come now. Try harder. Do you think i would--

Mt 7:6 -Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you

You cant understand the earthly so why waste time with the heavenly. You wont be happy unless i explained word for word the whole Word of God and YET you still wouldnt believe.

Unbelievable

:thud::thud::thud::thud::thud::thud::thud::thud:

ps. Maybe you will learn like ben and learn not to reply to me because you may be roasted like it says in Revelations---

Rev 11:5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

But you wouldnt understand that verse either because you see it literally too!!!

 

[AK4]

Do you know why you attribute the requirements of Isaiah 53 to Jesus? Because of
Paul. If he had not come up with his Christology to hide his - Paul's - Messiahship,
you would never be able to think of Jesus when reading Isaiah 53.

Ben

Pauls messiahship? Read 1 corithians chapter 1 and tell me where you see him trying to call himself a messiah.