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The Trinity

Sonofason

Sonofason

Well-Known Member
Bible Student said:
You are incorrect.It is called "The Lords evening meal." This was done after the passover meal was observed.After Judas Iscariot was dismissed.Jesus broke the bread and passed the wine.This was the new covenant that Jesus established with his 11 disciples.This took place on Nissan 14th, in the Jewish calendar month of Abib, in 33 C.E. Jesus calls it his "evening meal" and states this is the new covenant.He never uses the word "Eucharist" or "Transubstantiation."

1 Corinthians 11:20 When you come together in one place, it is not really to eat the Lord’s Evening Meal. 21 For when you eat it, each one takes his own evening meal beforehand, so that one is hungry but another is intoxicated. 22 Do you not have houses for eating and drinking? Or do you despise the congregation of God and make those who have nothing feel ashamed? What can I say to you? Should I commend you? In this I do not commend you.


23 For I received from the Lord what I also handed on to you, that the Lord Jesus on the night on which he was going to be betrayed took a loaf, 24 and after giving thanks, he broke it and said: “This means my body, which is in your behalf. Keep doing this in remembrance of me.” 25 He did the same with the cup also, after they had the evening meal, saying: “This cup means the new covenant by virtue of my blood. Keep doing this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For whenever you eat this loaf and drink this cup, you keep proclaiming the death of the Lord, until he comes.

So we can see that this practice is called the "Lords evening meal" which established the "new covenant."


As for Transubstantiation[/U],this is totally wrong.Jesus never performed any miracles at this meal.When he passed the bread and the wine,these were symbolic emblems that represented his flesh and blood.They were not literal.He was still alive and intact when he established this new covenant.His literal offering would be done later that afternoon.

Another thing,God is against cannibalism.To eat the flesh and drink the blood of a person is considered cannibalism.This does not originate with God.It is of pagan origin.This is not what Jesus meant when he said eat the bread and drink the wine.Misconceptions on the part of those who have been mislead by false doctrines and beliefs of men have led them astray.
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That is why I did not dispute your rejection of the concept of transubstantiation.
 
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InChrist said:
Yes, reading the entire passage does make it clear as I have previously said that the seventy who were sent out were to stay in one house which welcomed them, as you have said yourself. The passage also clearly says they were not to go from house to house. The Watchtower places a burden upon its members requiring them to go from house to house, meeting quotas, doing preaching work, and distributing magazines, not merely to share the gospel, but more importantly with the ulterior motive of getting people to join the organization. I don't believe this is biblical preaching led by the Spirit of God about the good news of Jesus Christ at all, but rather a heavy burden placed on members in order to control them and benefit the the Watchtower organization.
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Well ,you have failed to understand what it really being said by becoming side tracked.Instead of reading and studying the Word of God,you are to preoccupied with the watchtower.The text is clear and very obvious.It speaks of Jesus instructions to his disciples.He tells them not to go house to house seeking more than the payment that has been given to them at the first house where they are being shown hospitality.Jesus by no means is saying for them not to go house to house to do preaching work.You misunderstand and interpret it according to your views and not that of Gods Word.

This view you have would contradict what is said in Acts 20:20.

First,Jesus instructs the disciples not to take with them money bags,food or sandals.This was to prove to them that God would provide for them by way of their faith and actions of serving God.

When they came to a house where they were accepted with love and hospitality,they were not to go out and seek more than what was required from other homes.They were to remain in that house and eat and drink.Thats why Jesus says this is their due wages for their preaching work.They were to be modest and receive only what is required and not to seek out further things from others.



4 Do not carry a money bag or a food pouch or sandals


7 So stay in that house, eating and drinking the things they provide, for the worker is worthy of his wages. Do not keep transferring from house to house.


All you are seeing is "Do not keep transferring from house to house." You are taking it out of context to serve your view instead of fully understanding what the passage is really meaning.When you try to prove others wrong instead of seeking out the truth,you come to this kind of conclusion.
 
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InChrist

InChrist

Free4ever
Bible Student said:
Well ,you have failed to understand what it really being said by becoming side tracked.Instead of reading and studying the Word of God,you are to preoccupied with the watchtower.The text is clear and very obvious.It speaks of Jesus instructions to his disciples.He tells them not to go house to house seeking more than the payment that has been given to them at the first house where they are being shown hospitality.Jesus by no means is saying for them not to go house to house to do preaching work.You misunderstand and interpret it according to your views and not that of Gods Word.

This view you have would contradict what is said in Acts 20:20.

First,Jesus instructs the disciples not to take with them money bags,food or sandals.This was to prove to them that God would provide for them by way of their faith and actions of serving God.

When they came to a house where they were accepted with love and hospitality,they were not to go out and seek more than what was required from other homes.They were to remain in that house and eat and drink.Thats why Jesus says this is their due wages for their preaching work.They were to be modest and receive only what is required and not to seek out further things from others.
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I've never heard of Jehovah's Witnesses staying in ONE house where they found hospitality. They always go from door to door visiting many houses in one day as they attempt to seek more and more converts...never remaining anywhere for more than a short time. This is so unlike what Paul and the apostles did.
 
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InChrist said:
I've never heard of Jehovah's Witnesses staying in ONE house where they found hospitality. They always go from door to door visiting many houses in one day as they attempt to seek more and more converts...never remaining anywhere for more than a short time. This is so unlike what Paul and the apostles did.
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What occurred in the 1st century with these disciples was something that took place in order to show these men that God would take care of them for their sacred service.Jesus instructed them to do what he said and to follow his instructions.The result was that they were payed their due wages.JW's today do not need to be fed by people.They, nor anyone else, does not have need of a money bag or not to wear sandals.This command by Jesus was done to prove a point to the disciples that their needs would be looked after.It was by faith.

Another thing,Paul spoke to these people in Acts 28:23 from night until morning by choice.And mind you there were many people in this place.There is no set time limit.

In Acts 20:20 it mentions Paul going house to house but it never says he needed to be in one place for a certain amount of time.Thats up to the person preaching, and the one receiving the Word.

Jehovahs Witnesses do not seek out people for the purpose of converting.They do it as commanded by God in Matthew 24:14.If that person wishes to accept the Word and convert,thats their decision.
 
Katzpur

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
Bible Student said:
It explains a lot. John13:35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”
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You ought to try practicing what you preach for a change. You've got some rude retort for everybody who disagrees with you. It doesn't matter how respectfully they want to debate something. Sooner or later it devolves into an insult coming from you. Why do you think that you're having so much trouble getting along with virtually everybody on this forum?
 
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Katzpur said:
You ought to try practicing what you preach for a change. You've got some rude retort for everybody who disagrees with you. It doesn't matter how respectfully they want to debate something. Sooner or later it devolves into an insult coming from you. Why do you think that you're having so much trouble getting along with virtually everybody on this forum?
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If a quote from the holy scriptures seems like an insult to you then you have a serious problem.It is God,not I,whom you must take this up with, for it is His Word that has offended you.Personally I think the truth hurt you and you are lashing out because of the sting.
 
Katzpur

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
Bible Student said:
If a quote from the holy scriptures seems like an insult to you then you have a serious problem.
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I have never in my life been insulted by a quote from the holy scriptures. I do find self-righteous, sanctimonious people to be offensive, though.

It is God,not I,whom you must take this up with, for it is His Word that has offended you.
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There is nothing for me to take up with Him. I'm fine with His Word. I'm just not fine with you. And from everything I can see, pretty much nobody else is fine with you either.

Personally I think the truth hurt you and you are lashing out because of the sting.
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Yeah, well personally, you don't know jack ****! The only thing I have ever lashed out at is self-righteous know-it-alls who have no desire to do anything but tell everybody else how deluded they are.
 
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Katzpur said:
You ought to try practicing what you preach for a change. You've got some rude retort for everybody who disagrees with you. It doesn't matter how respectfully they want to debate something. Sooner or later it devolves into an insult coming from you. Why do you think that you're having so much trouble getting along with virtually everybody on this forum?
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I just noticed that the message was not even for you.Wow! Why are you talking? You should just mind your business, and do not engage me anymore in conversation, if you are hurt by words.I really don't want to speak to you anyway.You always approach me.Just carry on....
 
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Yes many think that Jehovahs Witnesses is a religion.Jehovahs Witnesses practice true Christianity, as did the 1st century Christians, who followed Christ.Thats what separates the JW's from all the other so called Christian groups.No trinity,no idols,no false holidays,no joining wars,no voting etc..

So JW's are Christians. They just call themselves Jehovahs Witnesses to separate themselves from the rest.They declare Gods name and are witnesses to His Word.Isaiah 43:10 “You are my witnesses,” declares Jehovah,
“Yes, my servant whom I have chosen,
So that you may know and have faith in me
And understand that I am the same One.
Before me no God was formed,
And after me there has been none.

Are Jehovah
 
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disciple said:
..........:franken:

Anyways, i'm not going to argue with people who declare me wrong regardless of Scripture, I've never done that.
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There is much you must still learn brother.You stated Eve was was not created on the sixth day when ,in fact, it states in the holy scriptures that both man and woman were created on the sixth day.
 
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