The Trinity

[outhouse]

At least be faithful when you copy from Wikipedia

I posted teh relevant information to the topic at hand.


my reply had to do with Constantines influence, not the origin of the creeds the bishops were not agreed upon

 

[Mark2020]

I posted teh relevant information to the topic at hand.


my reply had to do with Constantines influence, not the origin of the creeds the bishops were not agreed upon

You only took one half of the sentence and ignored the other. You should have given the full quote.
You ignored the part about 'Misconceptions'!

 

[outhouse]

And according to you.......
1 man influenced 1800 Bishops into error?

No the bishops were not in agreement.

Constantine forced a agreement for a unfied church

 

[outhouse]

You only took one half of the sentence and ignored the other. You should have given the full quote.
You ignored the part about 'Misconceptions'!

why ??


its off topic to my reply. I was only going after two points

#1 Constantine pulled all the bishops together

#2 that he influenced the decision



I never stated or implied anything under the misconceptions, nor was I trying to leed the topic in that direction

 

[Mark2020]

Constantine forced a agreement for a unfied church

Now quoted first from wikipedia?
And who ignored this:

Misconceptions

The Role of Constantine

While Constantine wanted a unified church after the council for political reasons, he did not force the Homoousian view of Christ's nature on the council, nor commission a Bible at the council that omitted books he did not approve of, although he did later commission Bibles. In fact, Constantine had little theological understanding of the issues at stake, and did not particularly care which view of Christ's nature prevailed so long as it resulted in a unified church. This can be seen in his initial acceptance of the Homoousian view of Christ's nature, only to abandon the belief several years later for political reasons, under the influence of Eusebius of Nicomedia and others.

 

[Mark2020]

why ??

lol...
Read it again and be faithful.

 

[outhouse]

Now quoted first from wikipedia?
And who ignored this:

thats states nothing to do with constantines role in for bringing the bishops together or his influence for a unified church.

if it does point it out

 

[outhouse]

lol...
Read it again and be faithful.

I think your the one having trouble with this.


does it state anywhere he did not bring the bishops together??? No

does it state he did not influence the bishops decision? No

it only deals with the theology ay hand that he did not have a part in. To take your unknown view you have to ignore the rest of the wiki article that states exactly what his role was.

 

[Mark2020]

I think your...

You be your own judge.

 

[outhouse]

You be your own judge.

im glad you conceded that you cannot show a mistake in my reply.


You cannot show Constantine did nit bring all the bishops in

you cannot show the Canstantine did not have a influence in the bishops decision.

because its all in black and white.







The First Council of Nicaea was a council of Christian bishops convened in Nicaea in Bithynia (present-day İznik in Turkey) by the Roman Emperor Constantine I in A.D. 325


it did settle to some degree the debate within the Early Christian communities regarding the divinity of Christ


The First Council of Nicea was convened by Constantine


Constantine had invited all 1800 bishops of the Christian church





Under Constantine's influence

 

[Mark2020]

im glad you conceded that you cannot show a mistake in my reply.


You cannot show Constantine did nit bring all the bishops in

you cannot show the Canstantine did not have a influence in the bishops decision.

because its all in black and white.







The First Council of Nicaea was a council of Christian bishops convened in Nicaea in Bithynia (present-day İznik in Turkey) by the Roman Emperor Constantine I in A.D. 325


it did settle to some degree the debate within the Early Christian communities regarding the divinity of Christ


The First Council of Nicea was convened by Constantine


Constantine had invited all 1800 bishops of the Christian church





Under Constantine's influence

I'll just put this again, and let people compare to see if your quoting is faithful or not

Result of the debate

The Council declared that the Father and the Son are of the same substance and are co-eternal, basing the declaration in the claim that this was a formulation of traditional Christian belief handed down from the Apostles. Under Constantine's influence, this belief was expressed by the bishops in what would be known thereafter as the Nicene Creed.

Misconceptions

The Role of Constantine

While Constantine wanted a unified church after the council for political reasons, he did not force the Homoousian view of Christ's nature on the council, nor commission a Bible at the council that omitted books he did not approve of, although he did later commission Bibles. In fact, Constantine had little theological understanding of the issues at stake, and did not particularly care which view of Christ's nature prevailed so long as it resulted in a unified church. This can be seen in his initial acceptance of the Homoousian view of Christ's nature, only to abandon the belief several years later for political reasons, under the influence of Eusebius of Nicomedia and others.

 

[outhouse]

I'll just put this again, and let people compare to see if your quoting is faithful or not

this isnt faithful, its history.


did Constantine bring the bishops to the council????????

Did Constantine influence the councils decision????

 

[outhouse]

heres more proof of "influence"

Nicene Creed and the Truth about the Trinity

The American Academic Encyclopedia states:

"Although this was not Constantine's first attempt to reconcile factions in Christianity, it was the first time he had used the imperial office to IMPOSE a settlement."

 

[outhouse]

of course with your limited view you ignored this little tidbit

First Council of Nicaea - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


The Emperor carried out his earlier statement: everybody who refused to endorse the Creed would be exiled.

that there my friend is "INFLUENCE"

 

[Pegg]

Constantine was a great emprorer for christians

BUT the bishops were not in agreement in any way shape or form and Constaintine forced a decision on one side, not all of the bishops. Constantine just wanted the bishops to be unified.

It was not the bishops choice at all

but it was the bishops who created the dogma, and then continued to perpetuate the myth even after constantines death, that still divides christians today

they could have refused constantine rather then let a pagan dictate doctrine...but they sided with the devil and for that reason, God disowned them.

 

[outhouse]

but it was the bishops who created the dogma, and then continued to perpetuate the myth even after constantines death, that still divides christians today

they could have refused constantine rather then let a pagan dictate doctrine...but they sided with the devil and for that reason, God disowned them.

Wow , im not even that harsh

Constantine was multi faceted when it came to his religion. After his winning battle and vision im not sure you could claim he was pagan with his new found love in jesus.

As far as refusal, a few did. But exile was not and would not have been pretty.


Of course there is still division, their trying to define something many people like me dont think exist at all. people that do believe can only imagine a definition as there is no clear cut answer for the faithful.

I only state the trinity is a man made contruct to try and keep the religion from being polytheistic with a creed that baffles reason and logic.

 

[Mark2020]

heres more proof of "influence"...

disrespectful, biased, useless...

this isnt faithful, its history.
...

that there my friend is "INFLUENCE"

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/2622327-post991.html

If you still can't see how unfaithfully you quoted from Wikipedia, I won't get that low.

 

[outhouse]

If you still can't see how unfaithfully you quoted from Wikipedia, I won't get that low.

The Emperor carried out his earlier statement: everybody who refused to endorse the Creed would be exiled.


can you spell " influence "



"Although this was not Constantine's first attempt to reconcile factions in Christianity, it was the first time he had used the imperial office to IMPOSE a settlement."




you can ignore real history all you want. truth hurts ???

atleast answer the questions.

did Constantine bring all the bishops together?

did Constantine influence their decision???

 

[Pegg]

The Emperor carried out his earlier statement: everybody who refused to endorse the Creed would be exiled.

Constantine was no Christian, he was a politcal mastermind who sought control of a church that covered a vast area of earth and a lot of people.

the church sold out.

 

[outhouse]

Constantine was no Christian, he was a politcal mastermind who sought control of a church that covered a vast area of earth and a lot of people.

the church sold out.

I really agree with the first part.

Not sure the church sold out as much as "were forced" I find the term influenced a little weak in this case.