The Trinity

[outhouse]

I believe Jesus is God, a member of the Holy Trinity. One sin is infinitely offensive to an infinitely holy God, so one small sin is enough to eternally separate one from God. Only an infinite being (God) could pay for our infinitely offensive sins. No angel could get the job done. We, being finite could suffer an infinite amount of time to pay our sin debt or we could accept the free gift of God, being infinite, only needing to suffer a finite amount of time for our sins. Our own filthy rags righteousness won't do either. Its like washing your face with a dirty, oily rag, just makes things that much worse. We must trust alone in Christ alone, who is the infinite, eternal God.

LOL you used this same line in another thread.

and none of which has anything to do with the trinity other then,,,"you believe"

 

[javajo]

LOL you used this same line in another thread.

and none of which has anything to do with the trinity other then,,,"you believe"

I believe its true. No mere finite angel could pay for our infinitely offensive sins before an infinitely holy God. Only God himself could accomplish this. Thus the Trinity!

 

[icebuddy]

I am not anti-theist at all my friend.

its very valuable, when it does not place its dogma before valid known science and history.

i dont know what you are, but what you call valid history is just a guess. Ask yourself a question: If God exists and did create the world and all that is in it and everything has a devine creator and what you call a myth is actualy true, then how do you think science would explain it corectly if it can only use natural thinking?

That is why I mentioned Mount Rushmore. How would a Evolution Scientist explain Mt Rushmore if he could only use natural thinking and not provoke a inteligent designer? it would sound great but it would be totaly wrong...

In Love,
Tom

 

[icebuddy]

My friend Tom.
there is no debate in teh scientific community surrounding ToE and dating methods.
Only theist holding on to ancient dogma have a issue with this.
You should not discount science when you know so little about it.

For every 1 Dating system a Evolutionist uses to get old dates, there are 9 showing its in error. But they must explain things in a natural way and they have only 1 Model. Even if God did create everything, Evolution Science cant provoke the supernatural even if they wanted too, so they explain away with natural processes. But Even a Thiest would think Gods hand is upon some design in creation or Evolution at some point.


In Love,
Tom

 

[outhouse]

I believe its true. No mere finite angel could pay for our infinitely offensive sins before an infinitely holy God. Only God himself could accomplish this. Thus the Trinity!

Or we could follow ancient mans mythology and understand many deities were created in ancient times.

Or follow history and see how man has always defined its deities, when they defined jesus divinity the bishops were divided until a roman ruler put his hammer down and forced the decision.

 

[outhouse]

but what you call valid history is just a guess

false or you would refute it.

If God exists and did create the world and all that is in it and everything has a devine creator and what you call a myth is actualy true, then how do you think science would explain it corectly if it can only use natural thinking?

you mean if imagination was real how could science prove it??? well if it was real it would be testable and we could find a place besides gaps in our knowledge to place it.

Mount Rushmore.

was designed and it wasnt natural. unlike nature.



Your creating a problem where there is none. If you take what was written in the bible and apply a literal translation due to ignornace of how it was written in allegory, you are in fact turning ancient mythology into a personal reality.

Everyone knows it is not a valid history or science book and the pope himself will tell you not to use it as such.

The bible is a beautiful book, written in allegory, poems, songs some history and some literal sayings. To apply it all literally is a mistake man has made far to long

 

[outhouse]

For every 1 Dating system a Evolutionist uses to get old dates, there are 9 showing its in error. But they must explain things in a natural way and they have only 1 Model. Even if God did create everything, Evolution Science cant provoke the supernatural even if they wanted too, so they explain away with natural processes. But Even a Thiest would think Gods hand is upon some design in creation or Evolution at some point.


In Love,
Tom

Only problem Tom, is there is nowhere where one can see a sliver of help from a deities hand in nature.

some theist use gaps in our knowledge to place deities hand, in fact this is a position of ignorance and imagination. that same proccess has held man back for ceturies, we are just now starting rto break free of religions choke hold on society and making advancements never seen before.

If one looks at history one can see what the choke hold has done and how it has slowed progress.


Man has always created deities, and you yourself admit the thousand before your current god, were man made. BUT because of the geological place you were born, yours is magically valid.

 

[icebuddy]

false or you would refute it.
you mean if imagination was real how could science prove it??? well if it was real it would be testable and we could find a place besides gaps in our knowledge to place it.

Many Scientist believe in a God of somekind. Are you claiming some of the smartest minds both now and in history as ignorant?

was designed and it wasnt natural. unlike nature.

And how do you know Mt Rushmore was designed and not caused by nature?

Everyone knows it is not a valid history or science book and the pope himself will tell you not to use it as such.

The Bible is the most valid history book known today. You are speaking out of your back side on this one...

The bible is a beautiful book, written in allegory, poems, songs some history and some literal sayings. To apply it all literally is a mistake man has made far to long

Thats where you need to check your brain. It is either True & Gods word (Beatifull book agreed) or it is False and the most Evil book written, but then Evil wouldnt exist, nor morals, or what ever... For if we didnt have Gods rules as a guide, things would of never been good and pure. As you will see in your life, a world without God is a world of craziness with selfish desires on the prowl. Nothing moraly right nor wrong, just what ever ones desires take them...

In Love,
Tom

 

[icebuddy]

that same proccess has held man back for ceturies, we are just now starting rto break free of religions choke hold on society and making advancements never seen before.

Again with ignorance. You believe people in the past were held back by God? Did you know that they are finding out that man in the past had many techonogies that we didnt have for years? They had lenses better than ours up until the late 1900's, They had machines that could move twice the weight we still can today, they had so much techonogy that people are starting to credit aliens for giving it to them. Not that I agree, but you need to stop guessing and find out for yourself.

If one looks at history one can see what the choke hold has done and how it has slowed progress.

FYI - since God has been taken out of schools, many evils are on the rise. So much so, that they cannot figure out where they went wrong. We will see this so-called "Choke hold", but it wont be God, it will be mans own desires gone wild.

Man has always created deities, and you yourself admit the thousand before your current god, were man made. BUT because of the geological place you were born, yours is magically valid

i never said "Before My God". The Bible is the oldest book ever writen and it clearly is before all others. The God of the Jews is the First God ever reconized, wether you believe it or not to be a true God. All other gods where warned about in the tora. That The devil and men would try to lead many astray. How you look at that is between you and God or you and nothing. However, talk to some doctors and ask them if they believe in God. You will find out many do, for they see how our body functions and many will admit that its a fine tuned machine.

In Love,
Tom

 

[Pegg]

I believe its true. No mere finite angel could pay for our infinitely offensive sins before an infinitely holy God. Only God himself could accomplish this. Thus the Trinity!

The problem is that God said he would send someone 'in his name'... he didn't say that he would be the one who would come

Deuteronomy 18:18 A prophet I shall raise up for them from the midst of their brothers, like you; and I shall indeed put my words in his mouth, and he will certainly speak to them all that I shall command him. 19 And it must occur that the man who will not listen to my words that he will speak in my name, I shall myself require an account from him.

 

[outhouse]

Many Scientist believe in a God of somekind

yes they do. But they still dont believe in a young earth, or a literal reading of a bible that was ment to be read allegorically.

Are you claiming some of the smartest minds both now and in history as ignorant?

No im not, you cannot test imagination.

The Bible is the most valid history book known today. You are speaking out of your back side on this one...

the bible does have some good history in it. No one said it didnt. But much is not history and should not be taken as such

Thats where you need to check your brain. It is either True & Gods word (Beatifull book agreed) or it is False and the most Evil book written, but then Evil wouldnt exist, nor morals, or what ever... For if we didnt have Gods rules as a guide, things would of never been good and pure. As you will see in your life, a world without God is a world of craziness with selfish desires on the prowl. Nothing moraly right nor wrong, just what ever ones desires take them...

FLAT all wrong.

You have no clue of how the bible was written and by who my friend. I explained it very clear but you fail to grasp what is known.

I will have to say it again

The bible is a beautiful book, written in allegory, poems, songs some history and some literal sayings. To apply it all literally is a mistake man has made far to long.

Christians in the usa are the biggest offender of this globally. Elsewhere its not a issue.

If you ask any follower of judaism and they are the ones that wrote it, it is their book, they will tell you that much of the first five books were written as allegory

 

[outhouse]

The Bible is the oldest book ever writen

the oldest text in the bible are roughly 3000 year old.

Tom, writing has been around for 6000 years

The God of the Jews is the First God ever reconized

the word god started in the 6th century Tom


there have been many deities before him

 

[Jason]

1+1+1=1? or 1+1+1=3 or 1+1+1= something else?

What about 1/3+1/3+1/3=1?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

What about 1/3+1/3+1/3=1?

Isn't one third of one meaning equal ?

What is equal about Jesus being the beginning of the creation by God?
-Rev 3v14 B

What is equal about God's spirit being an 'it' or 'itself' ?
God nor Jesus are ever referred to as it's or itselves as God's spirit is an 'it'.
-Romans 8vs16,26; Numbers 11vs16,17,25

What is equal about 'only' God being called 'Almighty' not just Mighty as Jesus is called Mighty by Isaiah and not Almighty ?

 

[Mark2020]

What is equal about Jesus being the beginning of the creation by God?
-Rev 3v14 B

What is equal about God's spirit being an 'it' or 'itself' ?
God nor Jesus are ever referred to as it's or itselves as God's spirit is an 'it'.
-Romans 8vs16,26; Numbers 11vs16,17,25

What is equal about 'only' God being called 'Almighty' not just Mighty as Jesus is called Mighty by Isaiah and not Almighty ?

Are you a bot?____ (If so, you're a funny one)
Do you have to repeat the same questions in all the topics in the forum?_______

 

[Muffled]

which god has one personality?.

because Elohim has a very disticnt personality over Yahwey

This appears to be complete imagination on your part but I will listen
to evidence with criticality of course.

The one true God. De 6:4 Hear, O Israel: Jehovah our God is one Jehovah:
As I understand it the text reads Eloihim adonai Eloihim ehud.

 

[Muffled]

You know your taiking that out of context. It also in no way can be tied to the trinity as the comcept at that time didnt exist.

14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

here in a verse just before yours the contex becomes very clear, so now all men are one with godand the spirit is in them.

key word is "IN YOU" not am you

Saying something is clear is not proof, it is jumping to a conclusion.

This is false. All men are not one with God and have the Spirit in them. It says the "world" can't receive the Paraclete (Comforter).

The "in you" does not say that I am God however it is God that is in me. When God is in me, then you do not get to see me, but you only get to see God. At any rate God in me is a different concept from God everywhere and God in Jesus.

The Word was present. Whether people had a good concept of the Word is hard to say except in the case of Paul who understood it well.

I am not aware of the context adversely affecting the verse. It apears to me that the context coherently supports a trinitarian view.

 

[Muffled]

sources please, because you failed with the last one

John 10:30 I and the Father are one.

context: John 10:33 The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

 

[outhouse]

John 10:30 I and the Father are one.

context: John 10:33 The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

10;34 puts it into context better.

fact is the yeshua charactor talked in parables and metaphors but you choose to read this literally because it suits you.

the person who wrote that scripture never knew or met yeshua or heard a word pass the mans lips


.

 

[outhouse]

This appears to be complete imagination on your part but I will listen
to evidence with criticality of course.

Thast good you will listen. I quote nothing from imagination.



Both elohim and yahwey were written by two different groups of people and merged into one at a much later date then composition. they were originally collections of script heavily edited over many generations.

I have a link you should read, im at home and the link is stored at work. ill have it for you later. it gives detailed history of all we know regarding J and E