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This might be stupid but...

waitasec

Veteran Member
i think the guy made a huge mistake and in being caught it's a mistake he is forced to reckon with.
as far as how lawrence is reacting to this situation, i think he's taking the high road. he's listening to his gut feeling and only he owns that gut feeling.
it is nice to have people play the devils advocate for the purpose of protecting lawrence or just to have him see a different POV...and just as lawrence has been offered free advice from co members of this forum i also think by his behavior is offering this person another POV and hopefully this guy will be a better person for it.
 

Mister_T

Forum Relic
Premium Member
Lawrence, first of all, I just wanted to say that I am very glad that you are ok. I think the fact that he didn't stop after he hit you speaks volumes about his character and what kind of person he is at heart. I could never leave someone I just hurt critically, lying in the street not knowing if they are dead or alive or if I still had a chance to save them by staying with that person and ensuring that they get help.....I don't think anyone who is half-way decent could. The guy saw an opportunity to get away scot-free and he jumped at it, leaving you for dead. He didn't call for help, he didn't turn himself in, he just left you bleeding in the street.

That being said, if I were a betting man, I would bet his "remorsefulness" is for himself getting caught and the trouble that he is in, rather than for hitting you with his car and just leaving you there. I would not put it past this guy to bring his kids in there just for the sake of saving his skin and garner sympathy for himself. Yes, his kids would be sad if he had to go to jail, I would have been sad as a kid if my dad went to jail....but we all must be accountable to ourselves and our horrible decisions that we make and how we treat others. "Do unto others as you would have done unto yourself" does not seem to be a virtue this guy gives any thought to. What if it were the other way around and somebody hit him and he died because he was just left for dead in the street and left his kids fatherless as a result? My best friend was hit by a car last year and had to have his his foot and ankle bolted back onto his leg. If the guy that hit him did not stay behind and call for help when he did, there is a good chance he would have lost that same foot and ankle. My best friend will have problems for the rest of his life and will never be 100% back to what he once was.

Just remember that actions speak louder than words.
 

dawny0826

Mother Heathen
As you all know, I am a hit and run victim, got hospitalized and the univ have to make me stop my studies in the middle of this sem (which makes me very sad). Anyway guys, the driver who hit me was now caught and jailed. I was able to meet him face to face and his 2 kids yesterday (he can't even dare to stare on my face). I was smiling alright because I wanted to lessen the tension between me and him. The first question that I was able to ask him is why did he ran away and just left me lying in the street. I'll just not put his answer here, but I can feel some sort of fear and sincerity in his answer. I've also seen his 2 kids (which I think are about 5-7 years old) crying from a distance while I was conversing with their dad. I was really moved (and I pity the kids) by that so I can't help but call them and say "Don't worry, I'm not going to do something wrong with daddy. Don't be afraid, I'm your bro"- something like that.


And as I've put in the title, this might be stupid, crazy or whatever, but I DON'T want to file any complaints against that driver. It's not like I'm making him not responsible for what happened to me or I don't feel any "bitterness" on him, but it's just that I pity his kids and I don't want to take their dad away from them because of being jailed for years (he's a single parent and I worry of who will take care of the kids when he's "in"). I have soft spot on kids and seeing them so concerned for their dad really breaks my heart.:( What I was thinking now (and what I've been suggesting to my attorney) is just to revoke his license, make him do some community service on our univ and make him pay expenses that my parents had spent when I was hospitalized (they're saving that money so that they have something to use when they are already old). Se Jin, my parents and my friends disapprove this of course, but I just said that they should just leave it to me...

Lawrence, you have a very kind heart and I think that you should follow that kind heart of yours, prayerfully. You've been given good advice from people, but ultimately, I'd pray on it and feel at peace with whatever decision you go with, as your heart is in the right place.

Continue to be well.
 

Quagmire

Imaginary talking monkey
Staff member
Premium Member
I only read the first page of this thread and I want to say that, while I admire you're inclination to forgive, I have to second everything that Kathryn said in her first post. http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/2794010-post6.html

Especially, I think you should consider that if this guy was drunk when he hit you (which is at least one possible explanation for why he took off), if you give him another chance, you may just be giving him a chance to get drunk and hit someone else.
 

Draka

Wonder Woman
Not to mention that if he loses his license it probably really won't mean anything. We're talking about someone who had such disregard for the law that he was driving recklessly (drunk or not), hit someone, and drove off. Not having a license is not likely going to stop such a person from driving and possibly repeating his actions. There are plenty of people on the roads driving without a license. Taking his away is certainly no guarantee of keeping him off the road. The only thing that guarantees that is if he is physically kept from driving altogether. Jail does that.
 

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
As you all know, I am a hit and run victim, got hospitalized and the univ have to make me stop my studies in the middle of this sem (which makes me very sad). Anyway guys, the driver who hit me was now caught and jailed. I was able to meet him face to face and his 2 kids yesterday (he can't even dare to stare on my face). I was smiling alright because I wanted to lessen the tension between me and him. The first question that I was able to ask him is why did he ran away and just left me lying in the street. I'll just not put his answer here, but I can feel some sort of fear and sincerity in his answer. I've also seen his 2 kids (which I think are about 5-7 years old) crying from a distance while I was conversing with their dad. I was really moved (and I pity the kids) by that so I can't help but call them and say "Don't worry, I'm not going to do something wrong with daddy. Don't be afraid, I'm your bro"- something like that.


And as I've put in the title, this might be stupid, crazy or whatever, but I DON'T want to file any complaints against that driver. It's not like I'm making him not responsible for what happened to me or I don't feel any "bitterness" on him, but it's just that I pity his kids and I don't want to take their dad away from them because of being jailed for years (he's a single parent and I worry of who will take care of the kids when he's "in"). I have soft spot on kids and seeing them so concerned for their dad really breaks my heart.:( What I was thinking now (and what I've been suggesting to my attorney) is just to revoke his license, make him do some community service on our univ and make him pay expenses that my parents had spent when I was hospitalized (they're saving that money so that they have something to use when they are already old). Se Jin, my parents and my friends disapprove this of course, but I just said that they should just leave it to me...
Wow, Lawrence. This is the first I knew about this. All I can say is that your reaction is a perfect example of how a Christian should respond. Unfortunately, very few professing Christians would behave in such a Christian way.
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
maybe you are right, i am looking at it from an islamic perspective to a degree.

but i have to ask the following, what do you think should happen to the driver if he did remain at the scene and called or took his victim to the hospital?

if it happened like above then and Lawrence wanted to forgive him then that should be fine, however since it didn't happen like that then i can understand the view about him getting punished for having fled the scene but not for the run over if Lawrence forgives him.

i hope that makes sense.

The only serious crime I think the man committed (unless drugs or alcohol were involved) is FLEEING THE SCENE and NOT RENDERING AID. I mean, I don't believe he meant to run Lawrence down in the street like a stray dog.

That being said, since he didn't bother stopping or even turning himself in, we will never know whether or not drugs or alcohol were involved or even what his state of mind was when he ran over Lawrence.
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
To give you dudes an idea, the car that hit me looks something like this, minus those twigs and perhaps it's really not that rusty (sorry, can't find any pic on the net that looks like it)

DSC_0647.jpg

So you can pretty much see his situation, it's not that nice. And if we put him "in", it will just be worse.

And by the way, the guy didn't beg for me like "please don't do *this* or *that*" nor he cried till his tears turned to blood or something like that. It's not easy to make such decision like what I did, but to make the innocent (the kids) suffer because of someone's recklessness, I don't think so.

There are many reasons why a man might be single with two kids and driving a POS car and fleeing the scene of an accident in which he knew he had run over another human being in the street.

Maybe his wife died of cancer and he sank into a depression, lost his job, lost his car and someone gave him this junker out of pity and he was rushing to his custody hearing, trying not to be late so that he would not have his kids taken from him by the state because they are all living out of that car.

Or maybe - just maybe - he's a jerk who mistreated his wife. Maybe she left him for good reason. Maybe he just had the kids for the weekend when you saw him. Maybe he's an irresponsible guy whose credit is shot because he drinks his paychecks, so he's reduced to driving that crap car because he can't qualify for a loan to get a decent car. Maybe he was drunk when he ran you down.

My point is - you don't know the whole story. But you should know one thing - YOU are not taking him from his kids if he goes to jail. If he goes to jail, he did it to his kids, not you.

When I gave someone another chance, he moved on and wrecked the lives of several women and children before he finally ended up in jail. I don't think I did anyone a favor by going easy on him. Not even him.
 

Viker

Your beloved eccentric Auntie Cristal
As you all know, I am a hit and run victim, got hospitalized and the univ have to make me stop my studies in the middle of this sem (which makes me very sad). Anyway guys, the driver who hit me was now caught and jailed. I was able to meet him face to face and his 2 kids yesterday (he can't even dare to stare on my face). I was smiling alright because I wanted to lessen the tension between me and him. The first question that I was able to ask him is why did he ran away and just left me lying in the street. I'll just not put his answer here, but I can feel some sort of fear and sincerity in his answer. I've also seen his 2 kids (which I think are about 5-7 years old) crying from a distance while I was conversing with their dad. I was really moved (and I pity the kids) by that so I can't help but call them and say "Don't worry, I'm not going to do something wrong with daddy. Don't be afraid, I'm your bro"- something like that.


And as I've put in the title, this might be stupid, crazy or whatever, but I DON'T want to file any complaints against that driver. It's not like I'm making him not responsible for what happened to me or I don't feel any "bitterness" on him, but it's just that I pity his kids and I don't want to take their dad away from them because of being jailed for years (he's a single parent and I worry of who will take care of the kids when he's "in"). I have soft spot on kids and seeing them so concerned for their dad really breaks my heart.:( What I was thinking now (and what I've been suggesting to my attorney) is just to revoke his license, make him do some community service on our univ and make him pay expenses that my parents had spent when I was hospitalized (they're saving that money so that they have something to use when they are already old). Se Jin, my parents and my friends disapprove this of course, but I just said that they should just leave it to me...

You are doing alright. If he is sincerely sorry than I feel enough is just about enough. Of course, if you live in a place like I do a judge may decide his fate for the both of you. I personally think he would still need to do community service, pay some restitution and maybe go back to pass driving school perfectly. Often times, jail is the wrong answer to these situations. I wish the best for both you and him.
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
No, but you can save someone else's future by controlling a person's recklessness.

we still can't change the past.
as much as would like to, we have no control over the past. as lawrence explained, he trusts his sense that the guy felt bad, yes he was caught, i wouldn't go as far as lawrence. personally, i would like to hurt the guy like he hurt me...but stepping back, since i'm not involved and we're talking about ideas, lawrence is sensitive to the guys kids...lawrence can't change the way he feels and if this is what he feels it's right for him...maybe he has a sense that this guy will change...i don't know, it doesn't matter. lawrence should follow his inner voice, otherwise he will regret that he didn't.
does that make sense?
 

Jeremy Mason

Well-Known Member
Lawrence, I hope you have a speedy recovery and am proud that you have forgiven this man. While forgiveness is about mercy for the guilty, it's also about letting go of events that are out of your control.

Now, I too have to agree with Kathryn's angle on this matter. You can forgive, but this guy, regardless of his record, has not only hurt you, he has hurt his community and yes, his kids. What kind of responsible father would do such a terrible thing and then think he should not face the consequences of his actions. What kind of example is he showing his children? What kind of life are they being subjected to by having a irresponsible father? I am sure his kids don't want him to go to jail, but that is not there decision, nor should it be your decision. In some states, in the US, if a women or a man is domestically abused, the abuser is charge regardless of the victims willingness to drop the charges. I hope for the sake of your community and his children that the courts take this man to jail and for a long time!
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
this isn't meant to offend you kathryn, because i am guilty of this:
but wouldn't that justify ones vengeance for being wronged?

It's not a matter of vengeance - for me, it wouldn't be, anyway. A criminal sentence is not simply to punish people - it's also to protect society.

I should have prosecuted someone a while back in my life, but I didn't because I felt pity for him. He went on to ruin the lives of several women and children. Perhaps I could have spared at least one of them some heartache and violence if I had allowed our legal system to work without my pity interfering.
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
It's not a matter of vengeance - for me, it wouldn't be, anyway. A criminal sentence is not simply to punish people - it's also to protect society.

I should have prosecuted someone a while back in my life, but I didn't because I felt pity for him. He went on to ruin the lives of several women and children. Perhaps I could have spared at least one of them some heartache and violence if I had allowed our legal system to work without my pity interfering.
i understand that...been there myself.

what i'm trying to get at is this, should lawrence ignore what he feels at peace with?
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
i understand that...been there myself.

what i'm trying to get at is this, should lawrence ignore what he feels at peace with?

No, but he also shouldn't ignore the possibility that what is easier for him may not be the best decision overall.

I'm not saying I'm right and he's wrong. I'm just saying there's more than one way to spin the facts, and more than one possible scenario.

A dose of skepticism can really come in handy sometime. Personally, I prefer skepticism to naivete but I'm sure there's lots of ground in between as well.
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
No, but he also shouldn't ignore the possibility that what is easier for him may not be the best decision overall.
easier for whom? the guy or lawrence?

I'm not saying I'm right and he's wrong. I'm just saying there's more than one way to spin the facts, and more than one possible scenario.
absolutely, but all we can go on is what lawrence told us.

the title of the thread pretty much sums it up...
why would lawrence already know that people would disagree with him by calling it stupid? my guess it's because it goes against the grain, and i admire that quality in a person.
A dose of skepticism can really come in handy sometime. Personally, I prefer skepticism to naivete but I'm sure there's lots of ground in between as well.

you're telling me about skepticism? ;)
i think it just boils down to lawrence standing with the courage of his convictions...by letting go of the past and moving on...

at the end of the day, no one has the power to change anyone or their actions. each person owns their culpability...and sometimes that sucks...but that is life showing us how powerless we all are...sometimes.
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.

easier for whom? the guy or lawrence?

Lawrence may be having his emotions manipulated. He also strikes me as being very trusting of others. Sometimes being firm or practicing "tough love" is very difficult.

absolutely, but all we can go on is what lawrence told us.

Judges usually aren't at the scene of the crime either. All they can do is go by what others tell them. We're just giving Lawrence advice and our opinions. He opened up the topic of conversation and we're discussing it.

the title of the thread pretty much sums it up...
why would lawrence already know that people would disagree with him by calling it stupid? my guess it's because it goes against the grain, and i admire that quality in a person.

Or maybe it's because other people (like his parents, for instance) have already told him they think he's being unwise. Maybe he IS being unwise.

Not everything that goes against the grain is admirable or wise. My issue is not with the fact that Lawrence is "going against the grain." My gosh, I've gone against the grain most of my life. Given the facts according to Lawrence, I am skeptical of the other guys' motivation and character.

you're telling me about skepticism? ;)
i think it just boils down to lawrence standing with the courage of his convictions...by letting go of the past and moving on...

Well, that's one way to look at it. I think it's great to stand by your convictions - if they're not misguided.
 
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