To What Extent, if ever, are Religions Escapes from Reality?

[Windwalker]

After satori, the laundry.

That's right. Real laundry.

 

[Sha'irullah]

I might misunderstand. Yet, what makes religion even close to the truth of mathematics?

Both are non-materialistic concepts that are used to understand that which is material. 2 can never stop being 2 and god can never stop being a sustainer. The issue though is the definitio and quality of god due to the subjectivity. This is why I recommend working backwards when it comes to metaphysical concepts and their need of existence

 

[Sha'irullah]

It just occured to me. If one wants to escape reality isnt that what drugs are for?

 

[Valjean]

It's what the entheogens are for, and many religions use them as a short cut to a mystical state, ie: a quick wake-up.

 

[Windwalker]

It's what the entheogens are for, and many religions use them as a short cut to a mystical state, ie: a quick wake-up.

The funny thing is, I've seen some who do this for a recreational high, and it changes them to pursue a more grounded path to awakening. Deeper states of meditation actually goes considerably beyond what these take one to. But with meditation, you're very actively participating in it, as opposed to just going for a ride. It's through the practice of entering these states of consciousness, that one grows into them as a permanent condition of awareness.

 

[Valjean]

The potential of many of these drugs is wasted in recreational use, I'd agree. But the degree to which some of these drugs can collapse your world might surprise you.

 

[Badran]

How important, if ever, is a religion's ability to provide an escape from reality? Does escapism ever account for a religion's appeal to at least some people? Do various religions differ in how easily they lend themselves to escapism?

For the purposes of this thread, "escapism" can be defined as anything that someone might use to avoid facing or dealing with their circumstances. And "reality" might be defined as a person's circumstances.

First i think there's a bit of variance within that definition that might be worth pointing out, in regards to how is the person avoiding facing their circumstances, and to what extent. They could be doing it by pretending it doesn't exist, or by ignoring it while acknowledging it's existence, or by mitigating/reinterpreting their meaning/perceived effects and consequences (and in some cases, the reinterpretation can be equally valid as any other interpretation). Further that could apply to all or most aspects of someone's circumstances, or it could be more specific in regards to only certain aspects of someone's life. In other words, i think the escapism practiced can take many different forms and have different levels as well as different goals to begin with, some of which may be negative, some of which may be positive, and some of which i think might possible be even necessary.

In that sense, i think all religions provide means for escapism, and that's not always a negative thing. In many cases it is, and in my view, particularly when it's done in the sense of attempting to avoid reality altogether, or many/most aspects of it (but i also think sometimes people might not really have any better option or choice - i at least allow for that possibility).

BONUS QUESTION: If someone were using his or her religion as an escape from reality -- that is, from their circumstances -- then do you think they would be more or less open-minded about the meaning and importance of their religion's scriptures or teachings? Or would it make any difference at all?

I think it depends on how aware they are of what they're doing.

 

[Penumbra]

I think that most religions as practiced by most people, are a form of escapism.

But so is much else. Movies, books, shows- one gets to escape reality for a little while and enjoy something different, and generally more exciting.

 

[Penumbra]

The potential of many of these drugs is wasted in recreational use, I'd agree. But the degree to which some of these drugs can collapse your world might surprise you.

Is that any really different than recreation, in the end though?

 

[Windwalker]

Is that any really different than recreation, in the end though?

I'm interested in hearing his response, but to offer my own, when one's worldview is undone, it is life-altering, not recreational. Altered states of conscious can change the entire direction of ones life, and it is typically in the direction of hard-fought-for growth. Not escape.

 

[Penumbra]

I'm interested in hearing his response, but to offer my own, when one's worldview is undone, it is life-altering, not recreational. Altered states of conscious can change the entire direction of ones life, and it is typically in the direction of hard-fought-for growth. Not escape.

Steve Jobs claimed that doing LSD was one of the most defining parts of his life and led to a lot of inspiration for Apple (there's a joke in there somewhere).

Ultimately isn't it all about hedonism in the end?

 

[Thief]

I don't see how religion provides any means of escape from reality or the consequences of one's actions. At least not in this life. What they can provide, or more correctly what spirituality can provide, is a means to deal with reality and the consequences of one's actions by changing one's perspective.

Ok....and does this transcend dying?

(supposedly religion is aimed at an afterlife)

 

[Sunstone]

In that sense, i think all religions provide means for escapism, and that's not always a negative thing.

Agreed.

 

[Sunstone]

(supposedly religion is aimed at an afterlife)

Depends on which branch of which religion you're talking about, doesn't it? Not all religions, or branches of religions, aim at an afterlife.

 

[Sunstone]

Ultimately isn't it all about hedonism in the end?

I'm of the opinion that most of the folks seeking a "higher reality", so to speak, are trying to escape from suffering and conflict. But that's just an impression. I could be wrong.

 

[Thief]

Depends on which branch of which religion you're talking about, doesn't it? Not all religions, or branches of religions, aim at an afterlife.

Perhaps my belief in Something Greater is in the way?

A religion not aimed at an after life?.....

 

[Windwalker]

Steve Jobs claimed that doing LSD was one of the most defining parts of his life and led to a lot of inspiration for Apple (there's a joke in there somewhere).

Ultimately isn't it all about hedonism in the end?

It depends on what you mean by hedonism. I would say no, since hedonism is general about self-pleasure and the exclusion of pain. I would say it is more about Satcitananda - being, consciousness, bliss. That's different than hedonism in practice. Ultimately it's about awakening to ourselves and living life fully as That, experiencing life in all its pleasure and pain.

State experiences give us a glimpse into that. It blows the ceiling off the little box-worlds our minds in all their constructed realities of mental objects define for us. It's like living in bubble your whole life to suddenly be transported via a wormhole to another universe and realizing the reality of existence is infinitely beyond your illusion. And then we work hard to realize that Reality within ourselves.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

How important, if ever, is a religion's ability to provide an escape from reality? Does escapism ever account for a religion's appeal to at least some people? Do various religions differ in how easily they lend themselves to escapism?

For the purposes of this thread, "escapism" can be defined as anything that someone might use to avoid facing or dealing with their circumstances. And "reality" might be defined as a person's circumstances.

My own notion is that escapism can and sometimes does play a large role in what an individual might get out of some religion -- in the religion's appeal to them. But that some religions more readily lend themselves to escapism than other religions, and some individuals use their religions for escapism more than other individuals.

For instance, I'm under the impression that people who think truth is little more than what feels true to them are more inclined to use their religions to escape reality than people who use much more rigorous means to establish truth.

But what do you think?

BONUS QUESTION: If someone were using his or her religion as an escape from reality -- that is, from their circumstances -- then do you think they would be more or less open-minded about the meaning and importance of their religion's scriptures or teachings? Or would it make any difference at all?

In times of great pain, fear or confusion people like to loose themselves in the hope of religion.
Can't get over the fact your child is dead? Its okay because they are alive in heaven. You can't go on without believing that.

Scared for your life because your dying of cancer? That's okay b/c god is with you and you will go to heaven. That can be an escape from reality.

Religion is very good at helping people hide from their pain. In some ways I think that is good. I know my grandmother used it as a crutch when her husband of nearly 70 years died. She broke so badly from it and it seemed the only thing to keep her holding on was her belief he was in heaven and she would see him again. Though consequently it seemed that she might have been slightly suicidal but I don't think that can be blamed on the religious appeal.

 

[HexBomb]

I think degrees of escapism can vary. Someone who believes God will not let them die, or that they are immortal. or can handle poisonous snakes without harm, or that disabilities can be solved by praying are very escapist.

I think faiths that recognise that people live and die and get sick and fight and learn and are not necessarily the apex of life, or even that good aren't by necessity escapist.

I've been called escapist for believing in the fair folk, that I must want to live in some Disney-themed world of pixie dust and happily ever afters. I don't. I realize I'm disabled, I know I'm going to have fight to get even the slightest bit better, I realise I have to make changes in my life and I realise that I am mortal, and no offering to the fair ones will make me better, no amount of praying will put on muscle tone. I have to do that myself. I have to work at it. I don't consider a faith like that (or something like Buddhism, as another example) to be escapist, not really. I don't even think a belief in an afterlife or a better plane of existence is necessarily escapist, though it can be.

 

[illykitty]

I've been called escapist for believing in the fair folk, that I must want to live in some Disney-themed world of pixie dust and happily ever afters.

I know how that feels. My mother in law didn't want to get me some pagan related books for Yule/Xmas because she thought I was being unrealistic, delusional and so on... That I needed to be down to Earth!

I feel my beliefs are perfectly grounded (in nature) and no more ridiculous than hers. I don't make fun of her beliefs in superstitions like "everyone has to eat birthday cake otherwise it's unlucky". And that's being down to Earth, according to her?

People who say such things probably have no idea of the actual beliefs and base their judgement on misconceptions or their initial thought. I mean mention magick and suddenly a person will think you're crazy or spawn of Satan without letting you even explain your definition of the concept (like if you take it as manipulating energy or just a psychological tool, etc.)