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Read John 3:16-18 that will clear alot of things up. Trinity teaches that they are all one being which the bible does not teach. Or some Trinitarians use John 1:1 which is classic however think of it this way the bible also states at Mark. 10: 7-9 " On this account a man will leave his father and mother and the two will become one flesh(speaking of a husband and wife) so that they are no longer two, but one flesh." Does this mean that The two are onje person? NO. It means they one in harmony with one another. So therefore God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit which is God active force are completely separate.
Read John 3:16-18 that will clear alot of things up. Trinity teaches that they are all one being which the bible does not teach. Or some Trinitarians use John 1:1 which is classic however think of it this way the bible also states at Mark. 10: 7-9 " On this account a man will leave his father and mother and the two will become one flesh(speaking of a husband and wife) so that they are no longer two, but one flesh." Does this mean that The two are onje person? NO. It means they one in harmony with one another. So therefore God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit which is God active force are completely separate.
Hello!
NONE! of the trinitarians can't seem to answer to DreGod07's scrictures.
Ahhhhhhh! Guess that means the trinity is fiction not fact.
Right back at ya.....
There is nothing mysterious about Jesus. Vague? I think not. He made it perfectly clear. What's attributed to Jesus as to what he said....clearly shows that he is not God....Not only was he seperate from God (in heaven) he is seperate on earth.
Jesus speaking of himself seperate from God when he was in heaven
Joh 6:38 "For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but
the will of Him who sent Me.
Joh 8:42 Jesus said to them, "If God were your Father, you would love me,
for I proceeded and came forth from God; I came not of my own accord,
but he sent me.
John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
Jesus on earth seperate from God
John 12:49 "For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who
sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.
John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee, the only true God, and Jesus the Messiah, whom thou hast sent.
John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
John 14:28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God
:sarcastic
Read John 3:16-18 that will clear alot of things up. Trinity teaches that they are all one being which the bible does not teach. Or some Trinitarians use John 1:1 which is classic however think of it this way the bible also states at Mark. 10: 7-9 " On this account a man will leave his father and mother and the two will become one flesh(speaking of a husband and wife) so that they are no longer two, but one flesh." Does this mean that The two are onje person? NO. It means they one in harmony with one another. So therefore God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit which is God active force are completely separate.
Just FYI, nowhere does Shaul mention Satan as god of this world, men outside of his time put that on the words. Paul/Shaul says flat out "God is one." If one, there is no other god besides Y H V H --!
It's not suprising. The question was "Trinity - Fact or Fiction?"
My original answer was it is fact to those who believe it.
When you actually get down to it you will discover that this is a man made concept.
Some one here told me that the Jews were aware of the trinity (triune God) but must not have thought that the question would be asked to a Jewish person and every Jewish person I have asked have flat out said NO.....they do not believe in a triune God nor does their scripture support such an idea.
I was in a long winded debate with a trinity toting christian who tried his hardest to "prove" the Quran supported the trinity. He went as far as writing and/or contributing to a whole area on this. He failed to read a little furthur to this quote from the Quran;
Quran (Arberry version from the Classical Arabic)
5:73
They are unbelievers who say, 'God is the Third of Three. No god is there but One God. If they refrain not from what they say, there shall afflict those of them that disbelieve a painful chastisement.
The only thing the OT can speak on is that God is one God. It does not speak on trinity or anything like it because the people of that time didn't worship God that way.
The three gospels don't attest to Jesus being God. What it shows is a oneness. At some point the letters and opinions of men made Jesus to be God in the flesh and was considered sripture by the christian church. As what we have read that is attributed to what Jesus said and how he described himeself and his many prayers to God, it is revealed to us that he is not God. He's not mysterious or complicated to understand.
Sorry but it is from the mouth of God that there are no other gods! And your two NT scriptures do not say what you say they say! Clearly Shaul is making the case that the "Word" was made flesh and dwelt among us and that the "word" was born as the son of God.Yəhoafat;881187 said:Actualy Moses put forward the idea that God is one (Duet 6:4). Paul though put forward the idea that Jesus was God manifest in the flesh ( Php 2:7, Col 2:9). It is true there is no god beside Y H V H, there is only one GOD, however he is made of three persons.
"And the LORD appeared unto Abraham in the plains of Mamre...And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground" Genesis 18:1,2
Sorry but it is from the mouth of God that there are no other gods! And your two NT scriptures do not say what you say they say! Clearly Shaul is making the case that the "Word" was made flesh and dwelt among us and that the "word" was born as the son of God.
If the Holy Spirit is a person. What is his name? Y H V H has a name, Yeshua the son has a name! How do you baptize in the "Name" of the Holy Spirit.
You are in danger of the Christian Hell Fire for teaching false teachings!
Shalom
It seems to me you said the scriptures said something! Cute remark, but phoney as a three dollar bill! Next time, if there is a next time, as I don't intend toActualy Moses put forward the idea that God is one (Duet 6:4). Paul though put forward the idea that Jesus was God manifest in the flesh ( Php 2:7, Col 2:9). It is true there is no god beside Y H V H, there is only one GOD, however he is made of three persons.
P.S.- I dont say that the scriptures say anything, all I need to do is paste them, they speak well enpough for themselves.
That is a title! In Hebrew Elohim said he is your Yeshua/salvation! Jesus is meaningless. Hebrew; Strongs #3444 is yesh oo aw/yeshua/salvation.
It seems to me you said the scriptures said something! Cute remark, but phoney as a three dollar bill! Next time, if there is a next time, as I don't intend to
strive for words with you, maybe you will need to cut and paste and leave off the commentary!
Shalom
Yəhoafat;881193 said:1) There are four Gospels, not three. Just becuase you don't beleive the trinity you cannot omit the fourth Gospel. All four reveal a truth about Jesus, each is meant for a different purpose, and John, was written to let men knw that Jesus was the real Son of God.
Yəhoafat;881193 said:1)2) Only someone who has a relationship with him will know who he really is.
Yəhoafat;881193 said:1)THe same is for Jesus, unless you have recieved the Holy SPirit you have yet to commune with Jesus, thus what you think you understand about him is only a taste of who he really is.
Yəhoafat;881177 said:First of all you must understand that first Jesus gave up all his power and his glory and was made into the likeness of a man that he himself had to pray for guidance (John 17:5,24, Php 2:7).
Yəhoafat;881713 said:1) Jesus didn't speak Hebrew he spoke Aramaic, so to say his name is Yeshua, is off the mark.
Yəhoafat;881713 said:2) Jesus comes from the greek ieosus, which comes from the Hebrew Yehoshua. Yehoshua would be Jesus' name not Yeshua.
Yəhoafat;881713 said:3) I am not arguing with you. If you dont want to accept the tirnity don't. However if you are ready to learn something, come back with a earnest spirit, and i will be willingly to speak with you.