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Trump kicked off Colorado ballot
- Thread starter Viker
- Start date
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Trump isn't qualified as an insurrectionist because he wasn't formally charged as one so the amendment dosent even apply. Its as simple as it gets to which that distinction will be determined in March if he's an insurrectionist or not.
McBell
Unbound
Other than in this thread, I have not found anything anywhere that even implies that one has to be formally charged with insurrection to be be an insurrectionist.
What is your source for this bold claim?
Election interference is illegal, which is why Trump will be going to prison for engaging in it along with much of his orbit of lackeys from his consiglieres down to his low information army of soldiers that stormed the Capitol.
If that's all he had done, he wouldn't have been indicted. Trump went much further and committed crimes against the Constitution and the American people, who rejected Trump and chose Joe Biden instead.
I think you're conflating the 2020 election with the 2016 election, in which the Trump campaign successfully colluded with Putin to exploit social media on Trump's behalf. I know that you believe that that didn't happen, but you're wrong. Of course Putin assisted Trump covertly. There is no possibility that he didn't. I explained this to you in a post a few months ago, but you didn't respond. Remember the dog test? From that post:
"You defrosted a steak on a plate which you put on the table, but forgot to put it back into the refrigerator before you left for work. Your dog is home alone, loves steak, has never been trained, and can get to the steak. Question: did the dog eat the steak? Of course it did. If it had the will and the means to get to it, there is no other possible outcome unless the dog dies of a heart attack trying to get to the steak. Just ask yourself, would Putin help the Trump campaign if he thought he could? That's a no-brainer. Would Trump and his consiglieres accept that help were it offered? Still no brain required."
Wandering Monk
Well-Known Member
Donald Trump acknowledges Russia helped him get elected in 2016, then backtracks
President Donald Trump appeared to admit for the first time that Russia helped his election in 2016, before reversing himself minutes later.
www.usatoday.com
Wandering Monk
Well-Known Member
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
No formal declaration required? Thats really stupid.
You understand the Constitution is ambiguous and up to interpretation, right? You understand the decision will very likely be overturned, right?
Here’s an exercise: Name for me the elements required to prove “insurrection.”
I’ve explained ad nauseum. Merry Christmas!
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Yes, rather poorly. You put false demands on what it takes to be disqualified. Precedent shows that a conviction is not required.
McBell
Unbound
What is your source?
You completely forgot to present it in your haste to dismiss and insult.
Where are you getting this from?
It is not that ambiguous, certainly not the parts that are relevant to this issue. You can't just make it say whatever you want it to say.
It might be overturned, I am not sure what will happen but I do agree there is more than a 50% chance that this Supreme Court will side with Trump. The only prediction that I will make is that if they do overturn it they will not be able provide a logical coherent reason for doing so based on the Constitution.
What is clear according to the U.S. Constitution that it is up to the individual States to decide what constitutes an insurrection for the purposes the 14th amendment.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
He isn't formally charged in a criminal court of law yet. Where do you think this came from?
I meant where are you getting this "if he hasn't been convicted of insurrection in a criminal court, the 14th Amendment doesn't apply" stuff from?
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Um... you just can't just say a person's an insurrectionist outright and then conveniently kick them off the ballot on that alone.
I think you would need a Criminal Court to decide that first.
What are the elements of an “insurrection” under the 14th?
Up to the states to decide what an insurrection is? Where in the world do you get that???
Not according to at least one conservative judge, who's opinions have been used to vindicate Trump (During his impeachments) before.
'Masterful': Former conservative judge applauds decision to remove Donald Trump from Colorado ballot
Former federal judge J. Michael Luttig applauded the Colorado Supreme Court’s ruling to disqualify Donald Trump from the state’s presidential primary ballot.
www.usatoday.com