Heyo
Veteran Member
For your information:
Development of the human body - Wikipedia
Calling a fetus a baby is a tactic of emotional manipulation frequently used by "pro-lifers". I don't like to be manipulated
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Trump makes conflicting comments, both of them ominous and disturbing
- Thread starter It Aint Necessarily So
- Start date
Development of the human body - Wikipedia
Calling a fetus a baby is a tactic of emotional manipulation frequently used by "pro-lifers". I don't like to be manipulated
So? The qualification is “dependent"
On your part.
So when in doubt… kill it? I am pro-life and not pro-death. They have established a different heart-beat from the mom at 5 - 6 weeks.
I disagree with your opinion.
I believe in science… not opinions. And I trust my wife who did carry.
I find it the other way around. Calling it a “fetus” is a tactic to dehumanize the baby that is in the womb and I don’t like to be manipulated.
fetus (n.)
late 14c., "the young while in the womb or egg" (tending to mean vaguely the embryo in the later stage of development), from Latin fetus (often, incorrectly, foetus) "the bearing or hatching of young, a bringing forth, pregnancy, childbearing, offspring," from suffixed form of PIE root *dhe(i)- "to suck."
fetus | Etymology of fetus by etymonline
"the young while in the womb or egg" (tending to mean vaguely the embryo in the later… See origin and meaning of fetus.
www.etymonline.com
If you look at the entomology, you will see that the modern version of today is simply a twisted view from its original intent for it included even the hatching of the young who exercise the capacity “to suck”. It was also used for the “later stage of development” which today we understand that it is a baby but simply in the womb still.
It was equally understood as ’the newborn creature itself”.
In Latin, fetus sometimes was transferred figuratively to the newborn creature itself, or used in a sense of "offspring, brood" (as in Horace's Germania quos horrida parturit Fetus), but this was not the usual meaning. It also was used of plants, in the sense of "fruit, produce, shoot," and figuratively as "growth, production." The spelling foetus is sometimes attempted as a learned Latinism, but it is unetymological (see oe).
also from late 14c.
The science is conclusive: That fetus is a baby
"In other words, you and I begin our lives not when we're born, but when we're conceived."
www.desmoinesregister.com
It’s a baby…. but why don’t you want it to be a baby?
Either you didn’t finish reading further down the line or you simply don’t want to believe what I wrote.
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
Oh, for goodness sake .. why does it have to be a federal issue?
Why not leave it up to individual states to decide for themselves?
Of course, we all know the answer to that .. 'populist' candidates, who change color
as they please for political reasons.
"Well they all lie, don't they" is not acceptable. It's sinister what goes on in "the greatest nation on earth".
Pogo
Well-Known Member
Why leave it to the states or the federal gov't? It and decisions about it belong to the person whose body it is a part of.
Heyo
Veteran Member
We aren't talking about the etymology, but the current nomenclature.I find it the other way around. Calling it a “fetus” is a tactic to dehumanize the baby that is in the womb and I don’t like to be manipulated.
fetus (n.)
late 14c., "the young while in the womb or egg" (tending to mean vaguely the embryo in the later stage of development), from Latin fetus (often, incorrectly, foetus) "the bearing or hatching of young, a bringing forth, pregnancy, childbearing, offspring," from suffixed form of PIE root *dhe(i)- "to suck."
fetus | Etymology of fetus by etymonline
"the young while in the womb or egg" (tending to mean vaguely the embryo in the later… See origin and meaning of fetus.
If you look at the entomology, you will see that the modern version of today is simply a twisted view from its original intent for it included even the hatching of the young who exercise the capacity “to suck”. It was also used for the “later stage of development” which today we understand that it is a baby but simply in the womb still.
It was equally understood as ’the newborn creature itself”.
In Latin, fetus sometimes was transferred figuratively to the newborn creature itself, or used in a sense of "offspring, brood" (as in Horace's Germania quos horrida parturit Fetus), but this was not the usual meaning. It also was used of plants, in the sense of "fruit, produce, shoot," and figuratively as "growth, production." The spelling foetus is sometimes attempted as a learned Latinism, but it is unetymological (see oe).
(And the etymology of "fetus" is completely irrelevant, as you want to use "baby". What's the etymology of that? (Rhetorical question, don't answer.))
Have you read that text? It's an opinion piece, and no-one cited uses "baby" for "fetus" - except the author.also from late 14c.
The science is conclusive: That fetus is a baby
"In other words, you and I begin our lives not when we're born, but when we're conceived."www.desmoinesregister.com
I want to use the correct nomenclature, so that we all are talking about the same thing. You (or at least some Christians) don't like it when I use "sky daddy" or "zombie Jesus" - same thing.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Given Trump's record we should probably assume he means a Putin-style rigging of the elections.
Or it could mean he intends to wreck things so bad his supporters won't see a reason to vote because it's going to take decades and generations to fix the damage.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Because healthcare access should absolutely NEVER be at the whims of the state of uneducated voters. It must be a federal issue to ensure equal access to healthcare in all 50 states, lest you get some states that won't allow minors to get treated without parental permission.
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
There are several reasons .. one being that it is obviously causing division.
If it is left to the individual state, it is more appropriate imo, as the demographics vary
across the nation.
There is "no size fits all" on many issues. For example, some states decriminalize cannabis,
and others don't. Whatever.
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
Really? You have equal access to healthcare across all regions?
I find that VERY hard to believe.
Copernicus
Industrial Strength Linguist
I find it the other way around. Calling it a “fetus” is a tactic to dehumanize the baby that is in the womb and I don’t like to be manipulated.
fetus (n.)
late 14c., "the young while in the womb or egg" (tending to mean vaguely the embryo in the later stage of development), from Latin fetus (often, incorrectly, foetus) "the bearing or hatching of young, a bringing forth, pregnancy, childbearing, offspring," from suffixed form of PIE root *dhe(i)- "to suck."
fetus | Etymology of fetus by etymonline
"the young while in the womb or egg" (tending to mean vaguely the embryo in the later… See origin and meaning of fetus.
If you look at the entomology, you will see that the modern version of today is simply a twisted view from its original intent for it included even the hatching of the young who exercise the capacity “to suck”. It was also used for the “later stage of development” which today we understand that it is a baby but simply in the womb still.
It was equally understood as ’the newborn creature itself”.
In Latin, fetus sometimes was transferred figuratively to the newborn creature itself, or used in a sense of "offspring, brood" (as in Horace's Germania quos horrida parturit Fetus), but this was not the usual meaning. It also was used of plants, in the sense of "fruit, produce, shoot," and figuratively as "growth, production." The spelling foetus is sometimes attempted as a learned Latinism, but it is unetymological (see oe).
also from late 14c.
First of all, "entomology" is the study of insects; "etymology" is the study of the history of words. You have fallen victim to what is called an etymological fallacy--basing your usage on what you think its historical meaning was, not current usage. In modern English, a fetus refers to a developmental stage "while in the womb". Baby means "newborn or very young child". Everyone knows that. You are using the word "baby" to describe a fetus in order to evoke an emotional response. When called on that tactic, you simply accuse the other person of trying to evoke an emotional response out of you, because you insist that others adopt your abnormal usage of the word.
The science is conclusive: That fetus is a baby
"In other words, you and I begin our lives not when we're born, but when we're conceived."www.desmoinesregister.com
The above is just a sloppy Gish gallop written by an antiabortion activist who is not a scientist, but slapped together a lot of pseudoscientific material to make it sound like science could somehow prove the rhetorical tactic of using the word "baby" for a fetus or, in fact, just a fertilized egg.
The original point still stands. Calling a fetus a "baby" is a rhetorical tactic that is linguistically and logically inaccurate. You may disagree strongly with those who believe that women should make their own choices about whether to bring a pregnancy to term, but you really have no standing to make that decision for them. Laws need to have a civic purpose--to be necessary and applicable to everyone regardless of their religion or deeply held opinions.
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Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
We don't and that's very problematic, especially in rural places which are broadly under served.
As for procedures, which is what I was getting at, it is simply unethical to put people's healthcare to a vote, thus this is properly a federal issue to ensure people have equal access to the needed procedures.
But is it needed? Is it elective? That's none of our business.
Spice
StewardshipPeaceIntergityCommunityEquality
Leaving it up to the states to decide also endangers the mother's life, and sometimes the child's. Not all can travel when and where they would like. If they can't get services they desire "legally" then many will go for desperate measures. I know one who intentionally threw herself down the stairs. What else she attempted, I don't know. They'll try herbal remedies, street drugs, and back alley surgeons. This is FACT, because this is history.
This is a situation, IMO, that should be federal. Why should there be a medical discrepancy based on locale that can be turned into blackmarket businesses?
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NO! It should not be a state issue, a county, city, district or federal issue! It is, like whether or not you want to eat broccoli, an issue for the individual concerned.
Do you want the state to tell you what art you like? What sports you should watch? Or would that be a job for the feds? NO! It's up to you, because it concerns you and you alone.
Shall we try abolition again? Didn't work all that well the first time -- and came and went with 2 Constitutional amendments, the only time that has happened. Let people know the dangers of alcohol -- but in the end, let them choose what to do with that substance for themselves.
There are simply things that no government -- national, state, municipal or any other level -- has anything to say about, because they are deeply, and solely, personal.
Spice
StewardshipPeaceIntergityCommunityEquality
The government will make the decision. They have in the past, and everything moved along in relative peace until the USSC overturned that decision.
And that was prohibition that outlawed alcohol, but abolition wasn't all that successful either. It didn't stop the Jim Crow laws.
And, yes, the US government does have some say in what we eat. Quite a lot of say, actually. Part of Project 2025 proposes lifting bans on GMOs and it's required labeling for consumer awareness. And, BTW, clotted cream is illegal in the US because the milk is not pasteurized.
Government regulations are a necessity. The difficulty is in finding the correct balance for ALL the people.
I’m not bringing up the issue… I’ve already said it is up to the states...
It sounds like you are upset… why?
Maybe your nomenclature is wrong? After all, a baby that is in the womb is still a baby. A 6 month old that is taken out of the womb isn’t experiencing a sudden “transformation” from a fetus to a baby. It was a baby in the womb and it was a baby outside the womb even if you want to call it within your definition of “fetus".
It’s logical as well as scientific.
So what is the issue you have?
source?