UK PM Rishi Sunak: "A man is a man, and a woman is a woman, that's just common sense"

[SkepticThinker]

You mentioned I cited it once - as I also mentioned other reasons once. If we are articulating on one point it would be because people like you are talking about that one point. So... what is the point that you have an issue with? (other than I cited a position)

The point I responded to ...

"I think this goes a lot deeper that simply the biological truth of XX and XY. I believe it is basically the result of trauma that creates the dysphoria, not always but generally.

The mishandling of the positions or the absence of father and mother and/or abuse also feeds into it. Throw in culture, curiosity, peer pressure and abuse of positions of authority like teachers / misguided or "progressive" psychologist and other authority causes the problems of today."

You cited an article claiming that it showed that gender dysphoria results from trauma when in actuality the article demonstrated it was the other way around - that trauma results from the way the person is treated by those around them, in response to their transgenderism.

Peer pressure doesn't make any sense either. Do you really think people are pressured into being transgender, and all the negativity, abuse and marginalization that comes with it?

I don't know what you're trying to say about teachers and "misguided 'progressive' psychologists abusing their authority. It sounds like you're claiming that they're pushing people into transgenderism which also sounds absurd. What's the motivation there?

Your assertions about "absence of father and mother and/or abuse also feeds into it" is not in evidence either. This is a silly argument people used to try to use against gay people as well. (A lot of those seem to be getting recycled when it comes to transgenderism, not surprisingly.)

 

[icehorse]

Jumping in here...

In recent years there has been a HUGE spike in transgenderism. The reason I usually hear is "that's because it's safer now". I'm sure that accounts for some of the spike, but not all of it.

We also know that a lot of youth who identify as trans at an early age, evolve away from trans and end up happily gay.

Sadly, I think some parents are homophobic and think they can somehow direct their child towards being trans to avoid having them be gay.

 

[Kenny]

The point I responded to ...

"I think this goes a lot deeper that simply the biological truth of XX and XY. I believe it is basically the result of trauma that creates the dysphoria, not always but generally.

The mishandling of the positions or the absence of father and mother and/or abuse also feeds into it. Throw in culture, curiosity, peer pressure and abuse of positions of authority like teachers / misguided or "progressive" psychologist and other authority causes the problems of today."

You cited an article claiming that it showed that gender dysphoria results from trauma when in actuality the article demonstrated it was the other way around - that trauma results from the way the person is treated by those around them, in response to their transgenderism.

Peer pressure doesn't make any sense either. Do you really think people are pressured into being transgender, and all the negativity, abuse and marginalization that comes with it?

I don't know what you're trying to say about teachers and "misguided 'progressive' psychologists abusing their authority. It sounds like you're claiming that they're pushing people into transgenderism which also sounds absurd. What's the motivation there?

Your assertions about "absence of father and mother and/or abuse also feeds into it" is not in evidence either. This is a silly argument people used to try to use against gay people as well. (A lot of those seem to be getting recycled when it comes to transgenderism, not surprisingly.)

Ok... so we now realize that you were mistaken on the "one point only" - in the accentuated part. At least now you can recognize where you erred.

I noticed you didn't site the the article... if you had "quoted" it... I could refer to it and make amends if I misquoted it at the least, or at the most, give other articles.

Peer pressure not making any sense... it ignoring the effects of peer pressure - so you would be wrong there.

If a teacher promotes transgenderism, are you saying it has no effect? Obviously you are wrong there.

If you are saying that an absence of a mother or father makes no difference is to negate statistics... so you are obviously wrong there too.

So it appears that what you are trying to do is simply support a position of "normality of transgenderism" because of your personal viewpoint. IMV.

 

[Little Dragon]

It is simple imo,a biological man cannot conceive or gestate a child because a man doesn’t have the necessary equipment for the prossess apart from the fun part,that’s just reality.

It wont be too long before science can give biologically born males, the capacity, to conceive and give birth. This would naturally involve some fair amount of surgical augmentation, and possibly stem cell technology to grow the necessary organs and structures. However there is no physical reason why not.

 

[Little Dragon]

Which of course a majority vote.

48.5% voted remain 51.5% voted leave. The slenderest of majorities really...

 

[England my lionheart]

It wont be too long before science can give biologically born males, the capacity, to conceive and give birth. This would naturally involve some fair amount of surgical augmentation, and possibly stem cell technology to grow the necessary organs and structures. However there is no physical reason why not.

It’s a bit of a stretch,before giving birth a woman’s body changes to accommodate carrying a child,it’s not just “surgical augmentation”,a biological woman requires none of those,if it’s not broke why try to screw it up imo.

 

[England my lionheart]

48.5% voted remain 51.5% voted leave. The slenderest of majorities really...

But still a majority and democratic.

 

[Little Dragon]

But still a majority and democratic.

A democratic mistake. Not that they'd have us back now, if they had any sense.

 

[Little Dragon]

It’s a bit of a stretch,before giving birth a woman’s body changes to accommodate carrying a child,it’s not just “surgical augmentation”,a biological woman requires none of those,if it’s not broke why try to screw it up imo.

Well, I do wince at the thought.
It might be easy peasy in 100 years time, as simple as getting a tooth extracted.

 

[England my lionheart]

Well, I do wince at the thought.
It might be easy peasy in 100 years time, as simple as getting a tooth extracted.

Lol,I doubt it but glad I won’t have to be there to even contemplate it.

 

[England my lionheart]

A democratic mistake. Not that they'd have us back now, if they had any sense.

No chance unless we adopt the Euro and free movement,besides Germany wants to trade with us now which has ****** off the other members but Germany and France are the EU so the states of no significance are screwed and reaping the rewards of Merkel allowing a million plus of unchecked migrants ***STAFF EDIT*** to Europe,it was never going to work.

 

[icehorse]

It wont be too long before science can give biologically born males, the capacity, to conceive and give birth. This would naturally involve some fair amount of surgical augmentation, and possibly stem cell technology to grow the necessary organs and structures. However there is no physical reason why not.

There are something on the order of 10,000 biological differences between men and women. It's baked into every cell of our bodies. These differences impact healthcare in many ways.

So even when we frankenstein a way for men to make babies, they will still be men.

 

[Little Dragon]

So even when we frankenstein a way for men to make babies, they will still be men.

In name only. Really. Functionally, female.

I gather you do not approve, judging by your use of the emotionally loaded word Frankenstein?

 

[Little Dragon]

No chance unless we adopt the Euro and free movement

No problem for me. I'd adopt it tomorrow, the Euro, if we could meet the fiscal requirements. As for free movement, I take no issue with it. Might help get our farming and other foreign worker dependent industries off their knees.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Ok... so we now realize that you were mistaken on the "one point only" - in the accentuated part. At least now you can recognize where you erred.

This is how this conversation began ...

You: "I think this goes a lot deeper that simply the biological truth of XX and XY. I believe it is basically the result of trauma that creates the dysphoria, not always but generally.

The mishandling of the positions or the absence of father and mother and/or abuse also feeds into it. Throw in culture, curiosity, peer pressure and abuse of positions of authority like teachers / misguided or "progressive" psychologist and other authority causes the problems of today."

Me: "I have no idea why you still hold that position when there's no evidence supporting it.
The single article you posted last time didn't back up your claim either.
So why are you still making it?"

I noticed you didn't site the the article... if you had "quoted" it... I could refer to it and make amends if I misquoted it at the least, or at the most, give other articles.

I'm sorry you can't remember that we've already had this exact same conversation before.

Peer pressure not making any sense... it ignoring the effects of peer pressure - so you would be wrong there.

Can you point out how you think I'm wrong?
Just saying "you're wrong" doesn't tell us much.

If a teacher promotes transgenderism, are you saying it has no effect? Obviously you are wrong there.

This was in response to, "I don't know what you're trying to say about teachers and "misguided 'progressive' psychologists abusing their authority. It sounds like you're claiming that they're pushing people into transgenderism which also sounds absurd. What's the motivation there?"

Notice you didn't answer the question or address the point.

If you are saying that an absence of a mother or father makes no difference is to negate statistics... so you are obviously wrong there too.

This was in response to, "Your assertions about "absence of father and mother and/or abuse also feeds into it" is not in evidence either. This is a silly argument people used to try to use against gay people as well. (A lot of those seem to be getting recycled when it comes to transgenderism, not surprisingly.)"

Notice you didn't address the point. We're discussing your claims and you keep try to put words into my mouth instead of just responding to my points and questions.

So it appears that what you are trying to do is simply support a position of "normality of transgenderism" because of your personal viewpoint. IMV.

This discussion is about your position. And you've offered nothing to back it up or to address my counterpoints.

 

[England my lionheart]

No problem for me. I'd adopt it tomorrow, the Euro, if we could meet the fiscal requirements. As for free movement, I take no issue with it. Might help get our farming and other foreign worker dependent industries off their

This is off tooic so maybe open a thread about it,maybe “cheap labour” maybe a good title ;-).

 

[Little Dragon]

This is off tooic so maybe open a thread about it,maybe “cheap labour” maybe a good title ;-).

I know, cheap euro labour v cheap non euro labour?

 

[England my lionheart]

I know, cheap euro labour v cheap non euro labour?

Not bad,open a thread.

 

[Little Dragon]

Not bad,open a thread.

Meh...

I give up on trying to argue for more open borders and less island mentality. It's like I am dealing with a nation of islanders.
Wait...

 

[England my lionheart]

Meh...

I give up on trying to argue for more open borders and less island mentality. It's like I am dealing with a nation of islanders.
Wait...

I’m waiting for you to open a thread for that topic,this topic is a different topic,UK

PM Rishi Sunak: "A man is a man, and a woman is a woman, that's just common sense"​