Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I disagree. Unless an example of, lets say a trans man finishing as top dog in a professional men's league can be provided.
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UPenn transgender swimmer continues dominant season with more record-breaking wins
- Thread starter We Never Know
- Start date
You missed my point. The top athletes would simply be competing as top athletes. If it falls on gender lines, it does so based on skill and not because we have separate leagues.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Some sports can accommodate that, but not all.
Golf is a good example of gender equal sports.
Football isn't.
Aštra’el
Aštara, Blade of Aštoreth
It is blatantly obvious that a great many people with strong opinions on this subject have little to no firsthand experience not just competing in sports but also putting in the serious time and hard work to strengthen one’s body into a formidable machine worthy of competing... because most of the people who do completely understand why separate divisions exist between males and females.
I mean, this isn’t even a debate. You either understand or you don’t.
I mean, this isn’t even a debate. You either understand or you don’t.
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Of course. But sometimes it can derail or interfere with solutions.Well, they are.
Like if a cis man went to a women’s shelter and started discussing abuse from a man’s perspective in group. Sure, such issues are indeed equally important. But sometimes that can do more harm than good. And vice versa. I liken it more to “a time and a place for everything.” Meaning that sometimes it’s more prudent to work together and sometimes it’s better to leave in the hands of those who are more directly affected. That doesn’t mean I’m in favour of not including everyone in discussions. Just that sometimes it’s better to hold one’s tongue. If that makes sense?
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How would you separate 2 swimmers (one trans,
& one cis) capable of different significantly different
times in a race? (The trans is faster.)
Next question...
What if 2 swimmers have nearly identical performance,
but the trans female swimmer wins repeatedly?
Do you think cis women would be satisfied with
their accomplishments under your system?
Finally, why not have totally separate events
for cis & trans women (as others have suggested)?
I don't think that man would be welcome at the women's shelter in the first place. Lol.
I don't need to understand that.
I accept the premise that cis women want to compete
with each other, without domination by trans women.
It's a compelling desire that won't go away (IMO).
The issue is how best to accommodate the desire
of trans women who want to compete with other
people of various types, eg, cis female, cis male,
trans male, other.
We Never Know
No Slack
We don't see a trans person going into male wrestling, weightlifting, football, etc.
All we see is a trans person going into female sports...I wonder why
They should. If I were athletic, I'd complete against other men.We don't see a trans person going into male wrestling, weightlifting, football, etc.
All we see is a trans person going into female sports...I wonder why
Things can exist that aren't readily seen.We don't see a trans person going into male wrestling, weightlifting, football, etc.
All we see is a trans person going into female sports...I wonder why
We see what is newsworthy.
I'm sure that trans men compete
in men's events, but don't dominate.
So minimal controversy.
We don't see a trans person going into male wrestling, weightlifting, football, etc.
All we see is a trans person going into female sports...I wonder why
What makes you think that trans persons do not participate in said male sports? Who is "we" in "we don't see"? A bunch of Helen Kellers?
This is a single instance Googling you can find many more: Schuyler Bailar - Wikipedia
We Never Know
No Slack
Exactly!
We Never Know
No Slack
My mistake...I should have added "dominate"
We Never Know
No Slack
But you wouldn't dominate male athletes
How do you know that? Oh, you don't.
We Never Know
No Slack
Im not taking anything away from you, but name one trans person who went into male sports and dominated male's
I don't follow sports, don't really care for them and there's hardly any trans men competing in men's sports or sports that I know of at all. I'd never heard of that trans man swimmer that Lain just mentioned above. It's also possible they may choose to keep their trans-ness private. Not everyone waves it around like a flag.
True lol. But you get my point though, right? I’m not for exclusion in discussions.
But there are situations that may call for exactly that
I observe asymmetry in transition....
Men tend to bring athletic advantage over women
with them when they transition to women.
Women bring disadvantage over men with them
when they transition to men.
Men tend to bring athletic advantage over women
with them when they transition to women.
Women bring disadvantage over men with them
when they transition to men.