Utah counts down to firing squad execution

[Poisonshady313]

Because the alternative turns us into murderers ourselves.

No, it doesn't.

 

[MissAlice]

The main thing among others that scares me about these executions is the question of their innocence.

While I believe DNA is in no doubt an indicator, I still question evidence that may get manipulated or "accidentally tampered with. There have been many cases of wrongful execution in the U.S. mostly and still is to a degree based on racism.

 

[KatNotKathy]

The main thing among others that scares me about these executions is the question of their innocence.

While I believe DNA is in no doubt an indicator, I still question evidence that may get manipulated or "accidentally tampered with. There have been many cases of wrongful execution in the U.S. mostly and still is to a degree based on racism.

If a cop told me it was daytime I'd check my watch. Never trust a cop if you have any sense of self-preservation.

 

[MissAlice]

If a cop told me it was daytime I'd check my watch. Never trust a cop if you have any sense of self-preservation.

This is so true. :yes:

And remember their faces, names, badges and carefully listen to what they say. Cops can be just as crooked as the crooks they go after. My mom had a run-in with one who was sexually harassing her. To make a long story short, he accused of having possession with weed when really it was her friends. Then said she was armed, indeed but not with a big knife or gun only a pocket knife. She told use how awful it was and the way they treated her in court. Luckily HIS evidence didn't amount to squat and she wrote down everything and told the court the problems she had with this particular cop. She had written down his license plate, dates of the events these took place, his name and everything. Needless to say she won her case and he was fired. Still I think something more severe should have happened to him since he abused his power in authority. Who knows how many countless things he got away with from other unsuspecting victims.

 

[KatNotKathy]

Maybe I'm overly cautious since I'm Trans and cops don't exactly have a good record with...not killing us.

That and a few personal experiences, but not gonna derail this with my whining.

 

[Sententia]

No, it doesn't.

I disagree.

I do not feel or think that killing a known murderer is moral to begin with. I can see where people may take life as moral... self defense, defense of others etc but you are not arguing that point.

The argument is if someone kills another person and is proven beyond a reasonable doubt in the court of law as guilty then they should be put to death.

No one is about to die and there is no justification for more killing.

Vengence? Revenge? Fear?

Take the death penalty off the table and make them actually repay their debt to society if their guilty. There is no need for blood lust.

 

[Sententia]

Just as an update. A group of police who volunteered shot him dead. Their identities are secret and one had a blank so no one has to feel guilty because you never know.

The man had no last words.

 

[KatNotKathy]

Just as an update. A group of police who volunteered shot him dead. Their identities are secret and one had a blank so no one has to feel guilty because you never know.

The man had no last words.

And now every single on of them has to live with the fact that they killed a sentient human being. Justice huh?

 

[Herr Heinrich]

I just think people shouldn't kill other people, even if they really do deserve it. It just cheapens the value of human life.

edit: I'd take the life in prison myself. Not a big fan of non-existence. Oblivion is scary enough that even a crappy life in prison is preferable.

I have a question for you. Why does human life have value in your eyes?

 

[Poisonshady313]

I disagree.

I do not feel or think that killing a known murderer is moral to begin with. I can see where people may take life as moral... self defense, defense of others etc but you are not arguing that point.

The argument is if someone kills another person and is proven beyond a reasonable doubt in the court of law as guilty then they should be put to death.

No one is about to die and there is no justification for more killing.

Vengence? Revenge? Fear?

Take the death penalty off the table and make them actually repay their debt to society if their guilty. There is no need for blood lust.

They can never repay their debt to society. They have stolen from it one of its law abiding members, and they can't give it back. A murderer has forfeited his rights by his violation of the social contract. He cannot be trusted to be free, and the money taken out of my paycheck should not house him, feed him, clothe him, medicate him, or protect him.

There is nothing noble or civilized about letting a murderer live. It shows a level of tolerance for his actions that I cannot tolerate. And to suggest that the same sentence for grand larceny (life imprisonment in some cases, perhaps because of multiple counts or a third strike) is sufficient for murder is simply unjust.

 

[Poisonshady313]

And now every single on of them has to live with the fact that they killed a sentient human being. Justice huh?

Actually, none of them do... because nobody knows who had the blank.

But since they all volunteered, something tells me they won't be losing sleep over it.

 

[dogsgod]

They can never repay their debt to society. They have stolen from it one of its law abiding members, and they can't give it back. A murderer has forfeited his rights by his violation of the social contract. He cannot be trusted to be free, and the money taken out of my paycheck should not house him, feed him, clothe him, medicate him, or protect him.

There is nothing noble or civilized about letting a murderer live. It shows a level of tolerance for his actions that I cannot tolerate. And to suggest that the same sentence for grand larceny (life imprisonment in some cases, perhaps because of multiple counts or a third strike) is sufficient for murder is simply unjust.

So it's wrong to kill people unless we agree to it.

 

[MissAlice]

Wow volunteered? I wonder what kind of person it would take to actually want to volunteer in such an action.

I guess I'll have to read more about this incident.

 

[dogsgod]

Wow volunteered? I wonder what kind of person it would take to actually want to volunteer in such an action.

I guess I'll have to read more about this incident.

A neo Nazi perhaps.

 

[Sententia]

They can never repay their debt to society. They have stolen from it one of its law abiding members, and they can't give it back. A murderer has forfeited his rights by his violation of the social contract. He cannot be trusted to be free, and the money taken out of my paycheck should not house him, feed him, clothe him, medicate him, or protect him.

There is nothing noble or civilized about letting a murderer live. It shows a level of tolerance for his actions that I cannot tolerate. And to suggest that the same sentence for grand larceny (life imprisonment in some cases, perhaps because of multiple counts or a third strike) is sufficient for murder is simply unjust.

It is divine to forgive. Something tells me you have never contrasted American Justice with other forms of justice that don't include the death penalty.

Perhaps we should examine what the goal of "the sentence" is. A man is convicted of stealing a car and he is let out on probabation and violates it by stealing a cop cruiser and is locked up. Eventually he is let out but develops a drug habit and ends up attempting to rob a 7-11 where he is shot and wounded. He ends up 3 strikes and imprisoned for the rest of his natural life.

What is the point of this sentence? Assuming he did all those things... Society is now safer? He will learn not to do those things? He will suffer for what he did?

What is the goal?

 

[Tiapan]

Wow volunteered? I wonder what kind of person it would take to actually want to volunteer in such an action.

I guess I'll have to read more about this incident.

I bet they all vote republican, and belong to the NRA. Bagging a human what a trophy!
Perhaps on the same basis we should compliment the Taliban who simply drag the accused out and hand the family of the victim an AK47 and blast away.

Cheers

 

[Father Heathen]

I'm against capital punishment on the grounds that an innocent person can be falsely convicted and executed by mistake. I'm sure it's happened before. With a life sentence you could at least release them and compensate them somehow, whereas you can't resurrect a dead man. Also I would imagine that being locked up for the rest of your life in the prison environment would be far more miserable than death, thus a better punishment and perhaps in time they would learn regret and remorse.
All that aside, I've yet to hear a solid argument why I should feel obliged to be sympathetic towards murderers, rapists, etc. facing their end. Oh noes! What a tragic loss... We don't consider euthanizing rabid animals as "uncivilized", do we?

 

[kai]

i think the death sentence kind of denegrates the society that uses it i disregard the killer completely in my argument and deal with the fact that in 2010 a free and democratic country that puts men on the moon splits the attom etc, etc ,still kills its criminals by firing squad its just wierd

 

[Father Heathen]

i think the death sentence kind of denegrates the society that uses it

Yes, we get it, but you still fail to explain why you think so. Why the teary-eyed appeals to emotion regarding the lives and well being of those who've preyed upon and did irrepairable damage to innocent people?

i disregard the killer completely in my argument and deal with the fact that in 2010 a free and democratic country that puts men on the moon splits the attom etc, etc ,still kills its criminals by firing squad its just wierd

Because you brought science and technology into this, I assume you're implying that they should be executing prisoners with lasers by now? Otherwise I fail to see this contrast you're trying to paint.

 

[kai]

Actually you dont get it at all i couldnt give a monkeys about the miscreants let them go to prison for the rest of their lives. I Think it damages society when that society thinks killing someone is right for killing someone.

what contrast ?i am just reminding people how advanced we are supposed to be .