Was Islam spread by the sword?

[Flankerl]

Who is narrating it? Please

I am not here to do your homework for you just so you can dismiss it.

In paarsurrey's defence, the Ahmadi Muslims were never in power to impose jizya non-Muslims. The Ahmadis are not like other Muslims...

In the defence of Ahmadiyya Islam, I had a somewhat positive attitude towards it before... well all of this.

 

[paarsurrey]

In paarsurrey's defence, the Ahmadi Muslims were never in power to impose jizya non-Muslims. The Ahmadis are not like other Muslims...
...

To impose Jizya is not a core teachings of Quran/Islam/Muhammad, it is for this that when Muhammad prophesied about the End-Times, he mentioned clearly that Messiah will abolish Jizya:

Please see the video-timer about Jizya question from 2:20 to 17:15.
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

I am not here to do your homework for you just so you can dismiss it.

My homework says that the narrators are the clergy the beneficiaries of this tithe. The words tell us that it cannot be G-d or Moses for sure, it is Jewish clergy. Right? Please
Regards

 

[Flankerl]

No. Try again.

 

[Shad]

Quran did impose Jizya, a little thought on the verse where it is mentioned and the verses in the context make it clear as to why it was imposed and why it was essential to be imposed in Muhammad's time, I therefore, give the verse with the verses in the context:

[9:24]Say, if your fathers, and your sons, and your brethren, and your wives, and your kinsfolk, and the wealth you have acquired, and the trade whose dullness you fear, and the dwellings which you love are dearer to you than Allah and His Messenger and striving in His cause, then wait until Allah comes with His judgment; and Allah guides not the disobedient people.
[9:25]Surely, Allah had helped you on many a battlefield, and on the Day of Hunain, when your great numbers made you proud, but they availed you nought; and the earth, withallits vastness, became straitened for you,andthen you turned your backs retreating.
[9:26]Then Allah sent down His peace upon His Messenger and upon the believers, and He sent down hosts which you did not see, and He punished those who disbelieved. And this is the reward of the disbelievers.
[9:27]Then will Allah, after that, turn with compassion to whomsoever He pleases; and Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful.
[9:28]O ye who believe! surely, the idolaters are unclean. So they shall not approach the Sacred Mosque after this year of theirs. And if you fear poverty, Allah will enrich you out of His bounty, if He pleases. Surely, Allah is All-Knowing, Wise.
[9:29]Fight those from among the People of the Book who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor hold as unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have declared to be unlawful, nor follow the true religion, until they pay the tax with their own hand and acknowledge their subjection.
Read: Detailed English Commentary
[9:30]And the Jews say, Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say, the Messiah is the son of Allah; that is what they say with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before them. Allah’s curse be on them! How are they turned away!
[9:31]They have taken their learned men and their monks for lords beside Allah. Andso have they takenthe Messiah, son of Mary. And they were not commanded but to worship the One God. There is no God but He. Too Holy is He for what they associatewith Him!
[9:32]They desire to extinguish the light of Allah with their mouths; but Allah will permit nothing except that He will perfect His light, though the disbelievers may dislikeit.
[9:33]He it is Who sent His Messenger with guidance and the religion of truth, that He may make it prevail over everyotherreligion, even though the idolaters may dislikeit.
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?submitCh=Read+from+verse:&ch=9&verse=24
Regards

You verse gives grounds for violence and a protection racket.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Quran did impose Jizya, a little thought on the verse where it is mentioned and the verses in the context make it clear as to why it was imposed and why it was essential to be imposed in Muhammad's time, I therefore, give the verse with the verses in the context:

[9:24]Say, if your fathers, and your sons, and your brethren, and your wives, and your kinsfolk, and the wealth you have acquired, and the trade whose dullness you fear, and the dwellings which you love are dearer to you than Allah and His Messenger and striving in His cause, then wait until Allah comes with His judgment; and Allah guides not the disobedient people.
[9:25]Surely, Allah had helped you on many a battlefield, and on the Day of Hunain, when your great numbers made you proud, but they availed you nought; and the earth, withallits vastness, became straitened for you,andthen you turned your backs retreating.
[9:26]Then Allah sent down His peace upon His Messenger and upon the believers, and He sent down hosts which you did not see, and He punished those who disbelieved. And this is the reward of the disbelievers.
[9:27]Then will Allah, after that, turn with compassion to whomsoever He pleases; and Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful.
[9:28]O ye who believe! surely, the idolaters are unclean. So they shall not approach the Sacred Mosque after this year of theirs. And if you fear poverty, Allah will enrich you out of His bounty, if He pleases. Surely, Allah is All-Knowing, Wise.
[9:29]Fight those from among the People of the Book who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor hold as unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have declared to be unlawful, nor follow the true religion, until they pay the tax with their own hand and acknowledge their subjection.
Read: Detailed English Commentary
[9:30]And the Jews say, Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say, the Messiah is the son of Allah; that is what they say with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before them. Allah’s curse be on them! How are they turned away!
[9:31]They have taken their learned men and their monks for lords beside Allah. Andso have they takenthe Messiah, son of Mary. And they were not commanded but to worship the One God. There is no God but He. Too Holy is He for what they associatewith Him!
[9:32]They desire to extinguish the light of Allah with their mouths; but Allah will permit nothing except that He will perfect His light, though the disbelievers may dislikeit.
[9:33]He it is Who sent His Messenger with guidance and the religion of truth, that He may make it prevail over everyotherreligion, even though the idolaters may dislikeit.
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?submitCh=Read+from+verse:&ch=9&verse=24
Regards

Wow. So you actually admitted it. I don't mind being proven wrong.

 

[paarsurrey]

Further to Posts #2717, #2720 , #2722, and #2942 in response to OP's Post #1 I have to add:
Those who doubt that Islam spread peacefully in times of Muhammad they should focus on spread of Ahmadiyya true Islam, If it has happened now peacefully, it should be a clear sign for the doubtful that Islam spread peacefully in times of Muhammad.
I gave how Ahmadiyya spread peacefully in Argentina post #2430, Australia Post #2460 , Austria Post #2489, Bangladesh Post #2513, Belarus Post #2535, Belgium Post#2556, Belize #2571, Bulgaria Post #2595, Cameroon Post #2619, Canada Post #2636,Chad Post #2651,Congo #2672, Denmark #2703, Egypt #2824, Fiji #2883, France #2942, Germany #3025, Ghana #3102 , Guatemala #3149,.

• Now I give peaceful spread of Ahmadiyya true Islam in
  
  Bangladesh [2]

Further to post #2513:
91st Annual Convention of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community in Bangladesh concludes
Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad delivers concluding address live from London highlighting Islam’s peaceful teachings

The World Head of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, the Fifth Khalifa, His Holiness, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad, concluded the 91st Annual Convention (Jalsa Salana) of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community in Bangladesh on 8 February 2015 with a faith-inspiring and emotional address.
His Holiness addressed the concluding session via satellite link from the Baitul Futuh Mosquein London. Over 4,000 people attended the 3-day Jalsa in Bangladesh, whilst more than 3,000 gathered in London for the concluding session.
During his address, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad spoke of the merciful and benevolent character of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) and said that the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community was constantly engaged in spreading Islam’s true and peaceful teachings.
His Holiness also noted the current political unrest and violence in Bangladesh and said that Ahmadi Muslims should pray for peace in the country.
Speaking about the need for Islam’s true teachings to be spread, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad said:
“It is the responsibility of all Ahmadi Muslims to spread the peaceful teachings of Islam at every level of society and in all parts of the world. It is our duty to enlighten others of the beautiful and noble character of the Holy Prophet of Islam (peace and blessings be upon him).”
Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad continued:
“The world should be informed that our beloved master, the Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) was sent as a ‘Mercy for all Mankind’. He did not come not to behead or to harm innocent people, rather he was sent to revive the spiritually dead and to give life to them. He came to inform mankind of that Gracious and Merciful God whose compassion encompasses all things.”
Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad said that any form of violence or compulsion was to be categorically condemned and that Ahmadi Muslims should utilise modern means of communication to spread Islam’s true teachings to the people of the world.

Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad said:
“The early Muslims were only ever permitted to raise their swords in a defensive war when the opponents themselves physically raised their swords in an effort to eliminate Islam. However, in this era religious wars are not being physically fought against Islam but rather the media is being used to attack Islam and to misrepresent it. Thus, we must ourselves use the media to counter these attacks and inform the world of the true teachings of Islam.”
Speaking about the objectives of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad said:
“The Ahmadiyya Muslim Community is not a political or worldly organisation and nor do we have any political or worldly objectives. Rather we are the spiritual community of that Promised Messiah (peace be upon him) who pledged to give precedence to faith over all worldly matters. Our objective is to spread love and mutual respect throughout the world in accordance with the teachings of our religion.”

Turning towards the current disorder and political instability in Bangladesh, Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad said:
“In recent weeks there have been various incidents of violence and disorder in Bangladesh. There have been attacks on buses in which innocent people lost their lives and were martyred. We are seeing people killing their fellow citizens. What kind of Islam is this? The truth is that all of this is being done contrary to Islam’s teachings and due only to a desire to unjustly fulfil personal and selfish interests.”
The Annual Convention concluded with a silent prayer led by Hazrat Mirza Masroor Ahmad in which he asked Ahmadi Muslims to pray for peace in Bangladesh and the wider world.
End
Further Information: [email protected]
https://www.alislam.org/egazette/pr...yya-muslim-community-in-bangladesh-concludes/

• Country:
  
  Bangladesh :Ahmadiyya population : 100,000 : *5:There is also an upper estimate of 200,000 Ahmadi Muslims in Bangladesh.

• Percentage (%) of Muslims : 0.1 % : Percentage (%) of population :0.1 % :Notes/Sources : Estimate Estimate[7][n 5]*

*[7]"Bangladesh bans Islam sect books". BBC News. January 9, 2004. Retrieved February 22,2014.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmadiyya_by_country

Does one see any sword used for spread of Ahmadiyya true Islam in

Bangladesh?
Isn't it a glorious sign for the wise? Please

Regards

 

[gnostic]

The tithe was for the Tribe of the Levites who did not own any Land.

And of course for the poor people who were poor and thus needed support.

Yes, I can understand that.

The tithe were given to, by those of Israelite's blood, hence the twelve tribes of Israel.

The Christians give tithe to the church.

What paarsurrey apparently don't see is that those tithes were never imposed on non-Israelites and non-Christians.

I think paarsurrey is trying redirect everyone away from the jizya, by saying the Jews is doing the same thing. But it is not the same.

If the jizya was the same as tithes from other religions, then only Muslims should be paying it, not (non-Muslims) by those who don't follow Islam.

 

[outhouse]

Those who doubt that Islam spread peacefully in times of Muhammad they should focus on spread of Ahmadiyya true Islam

Factually has NOTHING to do with islams origins BY the bloodshed of the so called prophet

 

[gnostic]

Quran did impose Jizya, a little thought on the verse where it is mentioned and the verses in the context make it clear as to why it was imposed and why it was essential to be imposed in Muhammad's time, I therefore, give the verse with the verses in the context:

[9:24]Say, if your fathers, and your sons, and your brethren, and your wives, and your kinsfolk, and the wealth you have acquired, and the trade whose dullness you fear, and the dwellings which you love are dearer to you than Allah and His Messenger and striving in His cause, then wait until Allah comes with His judgment; and Allah guides not the disobedient people.
[9:25]Surely, Allah had helped you on many a battlefield, and on the Day of Hunain, when your great numbers made you proud, but they availed you nought; and the earth, withallits vastness, became straitened for you,andthen you turned your backs retreating.
[9:26]Then Allah sent down His peace upon His Messenger and upon the believers, and He sent down hosts which you did not see, and He punished those who disbelieved. And this is the reward of the disbelievers.
[9:27]Then will Allah, after that, turn with compassion to whomsoever He pleases; and Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful.
[9:28]O ye who believe! surely, the idolaters are unclean. So they shall not approach the Sacred Mosque after this year of theirs. And if you fear poverty, Allah will enrich you out of His bounty, if He pleases. Surely, Allah is All-Knowing, Wise.
[9:29]Fight those from among the People of the Book who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor hold as unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have declared to be unlawful, nor follow the true religion, until they pay the tax with their own hand and acknowledge their subjection.
Read: Detailed English Commentary
[9:30]And the Jews say, Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say, the Messiah is the son of Allah; that is what they say with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before them. Allah’s curse be on them! How are they turned away!
[9:31]They have taken their learned men and their monks for lords beside Allah. Andso have they takenthe Messiah, son of Mary. And they were not commanded but to worship the One God. There is no God but He. Too Holy is He for what they associatewith Him!
[9:32]They desire to extinguish the light of Allah with their mouths; but Allah will permit nothing except that He will perfect His light, though the disbelievers may dislikeit.
[9:33]He it is Who sent His Messenger with guidance and the religion of truth, that He may make it prevail over everyotherreligion, even though the idolaters may dislikeit.
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?submitCh=Read+from+verse:&ch=9&verse=24

You quoted those verses yourself. And those verses clearly demonstrate that Islam is far from being a "peaceful" religion.

Ahmadiyya may be peaceful, but Islam isn't, and especially not in Muhammad's time.

 

[paarsurrey]

To impose Jizya is not a core teachings of Quran/Islam/Muhammad, it is for this that when Muhammad prophesied about the End-Times, he mentioned clearly that Messiah will abolish Jizya:

Muhammad prophesied:

Narrated Abu Huraira:Allah’s Messenger (ﷺ) said, “The Hour will not be established until the son of Mary descends amongst you as a just ruler, he will break the cross, kill the pigs, and abolish the Jizya tax. Money will be in abundance so that nobody will accept it (Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 43, Hadith #656)​

The Holy Prophet further stated in regards to this hadith:

“He would bring an end to the religious wars” (Fathull Bari)​

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad- the Promised Messiah, exactly did the same, I quote from him:

“‘As to the means and arrangements to be used, whether for physical warfare or spiritual warfare, whether the battle is by sword or by the pen, the following verse is sufficient for our guidance: ‘Make ready for them whatever force you can.’ In this verse God empowers us to employ against the enemy all suitable means and to use the method which we consider to be most effective.”(Ruhani Khazain Volume 14, Page 454, Haqeeqatul Mahdi page 28)​

He also states:

“I have come to you with an order: jihad with the sword has ended from this time forward, but the jihad of purifying your souls must continue. I do not say this of my own accord. This is indeed the will of God. Recall the hadith from Sahih al-Bukhari which honours the Promised Messiah by saying yada-‘ul-harb. That is to say, when the Messiah comes he will put an end to religious wars. Accordingly, I command those who have joined my ranks to refrain from all such thoughts, to purify their hearts, to foster sympathy, and to be compassionate towards the suffering. They should spread peace on earth, because that will cause their faith to spread in return. They should not entertain doubts about how this will transpire.” (British Government And Jihad, Page 17)​

And:

“The abolition of Jizyah is self-explanatory. It only means that Jizyah will no longer be required. Human hearts will spontaneously respond to the truth, rendering recourse to war unnecessary. Winds of change will blow and people will flock to enter the fold of Islam. The gates will be flung wide open; it will be an influx en masse. As a result, Jizyah will become obsolete, for no one will be left to pay it” (Elucidation of Objectives, Page 12)​

Regards

 

[outhouse]

Muhammad prophesied:

No he did not

 

[paarsurrey]

paarsurrey said: ↑
Muhammad prophesied:

No he did not

Please elaborate.
Regards

 

[gnostic]

Muhammad prophesied:

Narrated Abu Huraira:Allah’s Messenger (ﷺ) said, “The Hour will not be established until the son of Mary descends amongst you as a just ruler, he will break the cross, kill the pigs, and abolish the Jizya tax. Money will be in abundance so that nobody will accept it (Sahih Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 43, Hadith #656)​

The Holy Prophet further stated in regards to this hadith:

“He would bring an end to the religious wars” (Fathull Bari)​

Mirza Ghulam Ahmad- the Promised Messiah, exactly did the same, I quote from him:

“‘As to the means and arrangements to be used, whether for physical warfare or spiritual warfare, whether the battle is by sword or by the pen, the following verse is sufficient for our guidance: ‘Make ready for them whatever force you can.’ In this verse God empowers us to employ against the enemy all suitable means and to use the method which we consider to be most effective.”(Ruhani Khazain Volume 14, Page 454, Haqeeqatul Mahdi page 28)​

He also states:

“I have come to you with an order: jihad with the sword has ended from this time forward, but the jihad of purifying your souls must continue. I do not say this of my own accord. This is indeed the will of God. Recall the hadith from Sahih al-Bukhari which honours the Promised Messiah by saying yada-‘ul-harb. That is to say, when the Messiah comes he will put an end to religious wars. Accordingly, I command those who have joined my ranks to refrain from all such thoughts, to purify their hearts, to foster sympathy, and to be compassionate towards the suffering. They should spread peace on earth, because that will cause their faith to spread in return. They should not entertain doubts about how this will transpire.” (British Government And Jihad, Page 17)​

And:

“The abolition of Jizyah is self-explanatory. It only means that Jizyah will no longer be required. Human hearts will spontaneously respond to the truth, rendering recourse to war unnecessary. Winds of change will blow and people will flock to enter the fold of Islam. The gates will be flung wide open; it will be an influx en masse. As a result, Jizyah will become obsolete, for no one will be left to pay it” (Elucidation of Objectives, Page 12)​

It's funny how when certain Islamic practices have happened over the centuries that you disagree with, you would point out that if it isn't in the Qur'an, you would say it is not Islam.

But here, above you quoted from non-Qur'anic sources.

But your quotes speak volumes that you are not really reading and understanding the quotes that you yourself have provided.

So if Mirza's arrival as messiah abolished jizya and religious wars, then why is religious wars still happening. Muslims are still killing Muslims, because there are long tensions and deep-seated hatred between the Sunni and Shiite. And the Sunni still distrust the Ahmadis as being heretics.

Mirza have come and gone, little have changed, persecution and wars are still occurring, on and off.

Mirza is not much of a "reformer", if 99% of world population of Muslims don't follow Mirza's teaching.

 

[Flankerl]

I think paarsurrey is trying redirect everyone away from the jizya, by saying the Jews is doing the same thing. But it is not the same.

Well yes of course. Same thing as always.

 

[paarsurrey]

You quoted those verses yourself. And those verses clearly demonstrate that Islam is far from being a "peaceful" religion.
Ahmadiyya may be peaceful, but Islam isn't, and especially not in Muhammad's time.

What in those verses is not peaceful?
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

@ Flankerl #3195, @ gnostic #3190 and @ outhouse #3189
8Amalek came and fought with Israel in Rephidim.
9So Moses said to Joshua, Pick men for us, and go out and fight against Amalek. Tomorrow I will stand on top of the hill with the staff of God in my hand
http://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/9878/jewish/Chapter-17.htm

Is Moses' and Joshua's fighting with the Amalek as mentioned in the above Torah verses peaceful? Please
Regard

 

[Flankerl]

So after moving the goalpost repeatedly you are now changing the entire team.

Smart move if it weren't so obvious.

 

[paarsurrey]

So after moving the goalpost repeatedly you are now changing the entire team.
Smart move if it weren't so obvious.

What team? Please elaborate.
Regards

 

[Flankerl]

For what purpose? You ain't going to understand it either way.