Was Muhammad a good man?

[arthra]

I entered "God" in the search engine at this site and see the Aramaic word for God that was in the language Jesus spoke...

[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Lexicon[/FONT]Word:[FONT=Estrangelo (V1.1)]hl0[/FONT]Lexeme:[FONT=Estrangelo (V1.1)]0hl0[/FONT]Root:[FONT=Estrangelo (V1.1)]hl0[/FONT]Word Number:904Meaning:GodPronunciation:(Eastern) AaLaH
(Western) AaLoHPart of Speech:NounGender:MasculinePerson:
Number:SingularState:AbsoluteTense:
Form:
Suffix Gender:
Suffix Person:
Suffix Number:Singular
From:

http://www.pe****ta.org/cgi-bin/lexicon.cgi

 

[1robin]

I entered "God" in the search engine at this site and see the Aramaic word for God that was in the language Jesus spoke...

[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Lexicon[/FONT]Word:[FONT=Estrangelo (V1.1)]hl0[/FONT]Lexeme:[FONT=Estrangelo (V1.1)]0hl0[/FONT]Root:[FONT=Estrangelo (V1.1)]hl0[/FONT]Word Number:904Meaning:GodPronunciation:(Eastern) AaLaH
(Western) AaLoHPart of Speech:NounGender:MasculinePerson:
Number:SingularState:AbsoluteTense:
Form:
Suffix Gender:
Suffix Person:
Suffix Number:Singular
From:

http://www.pe****ta.org/cgi-bin/lexicon.cgi

Let me ask you something. Even if the generic term Allah was used in the Bible. Would that automatically make it's use by anyone necessarily mean the same being. If I formed a new religion and described Allah as a sloth would because I had used Allah mean that what I described the same being as the Bible describes. Give me a verse and we will get into what word was originally used but I do not see the point in doing so.

 

[1robin]

who said that the arabic is the origne of hebrew or aramaic ? {/quote] Not me. I said they are both derived from Semitic.

how you explian that the arabs christians used the word ALLAH in their arabic bible ?

What? Because that is the word in their native tongue closest to the concept of God. Does anything a non-Biblical author say have anything thing to do with what words were used in the Bible. Shiva is a word used to describe a supreme being in India. However Shiva has little resemblance to either Allah or Yahweh. Hebrew, Aramaic, and Arabic have the same root language so words are similar but what they describe many times is not.

and how about Jesus (pbuh) who called his God (Elahi) exactly as we used in arabic ?

The words have similar meanings but describe two very different beings claiming opposite things, getting names a families different, and behaving differently.

 

[arthra]

Let me ask you something. Even if the generic term Allah was used in the Bible. Would that automatically make it's use by anyone necessarily mean the same being. If I formed a new religion and described Allah as a sloth would because I had used Allah mean that what I described the same being as the Bible describes. Give me a verse and we will get into what word was originally used but I do not see the point in doing so.

Yes I think it's a good start to recognizing the etymology of the words for God

If you're familiar with Gesenius he seems to connect Hebrew, Aramic and Arabic.. name of God

Hebrew Lexicon :: H430 (KJV)

 

[Godobeyer]

Yes I think it's a good start to recognizing the etymology of the words for God

If you're familiar with Gesenius he seems to connect Hebrew, Aramic and Arabic.. name of God

Hebrew Lexicon :: H430 (KJV)

very good sources

 

[Lady_Bugg]

He was good.

 

[1robin]

Yes I think it's a good start to recognizing the etymology of the words for God

If you're familiar with Gesenius he seems to connect Hebrew, Aramic and Arabic.. name of God

Hebrew Lexicon :: H430 (KJV)

I don't. I have little use for what very fallible men invent about God. Arabic is derived from the same Semitic source as Hebrew is, so they will have many similar words in them. What is far more important is the characteristics of the God they are used to describe. The Bible never uses Allah but even if it did it would be describing a being far different that the Quran's "Allah" describes. The same God will not have Christ dying on the cross in one book and not in the other. They are not the same being even if they used the same word to describe him (which they don't).

 

[ImprobableBeing]

Mohammad was a conniving warlord who interpreted gods word as it would most benefit himself at any given moment.

Not to mention he was a pedophile who raped a 9 year old girl who played with dolls.

Narrated Aisha tells the story pretty bluntly and Muslims generally don't even disagree with this, they are just saying "oh well it was a different time and God obviously didn't know about raping little girls being wrong back then but now he's changed his mind so now it's forbidden... most of the time.

So no, a good man he was not. Not in any way shape or form no matter who objectively looks at his actions.

 

[ImprobableBeing]

I am aware that Arabians long after the Bible was written have called Elohim Allah and that Bibles translated into Arabic have used Allah. My claim was that Allah is not the original Hebrew, Aramaic, or Greek word for God and the two words describe two mutually exclusive beings claims opposite things. Neither is Muhammad mentioned in the Bible in any of it's original forms. The names for God in the bible are:


There are no Muslims in the Bible, no Allah, and no Muhammad in the original bible.
I have little interest in what people may call God outside the Bible. I can call God a blue unicorn but that does not make him one. The Islamic Allah and Biblical Yahweh are irreconcilable. Most of the latter religions try their best to gain credibility by associating with the Biblical God but have nothing to do with him.

Yeah, Jews and Muslims both disagree with you, what you have is an abomination that neither of those faiths acknowledge as related to theirs.

However, al-lah literally means "the god" so...

There are also no Christians in the Torah, that must mean that Christianity is a heretic faith?

BTW, if you are ever wondering about Hebrew scripture or language, i speak it and i know the scripture. I'm an agnostic atheist Jew.

 

[ImprobableBeing]

I don't. I have little use for what very fallible men invent about God. Arabic is derived from the same Semitic source as Hebrew is, so they will have many similar words in them. What is far more important is the characteristics of the God they are used to describe. The Bible never uses Allah but even if it did it would be describing a being far different that the Quran's "Allah" describes. The same God will not have Christ dying on the cross in one book and not in the other. They are not the same being even if they used the same word to describe him (which they don't).

Have you read the OT? Do you honestly come to the conclusion that the OT vengeful, murderous, genocidal god of the OT is closer to the NT god than to the Islamic god?

Not to mention, both the OT and the Quaran acknowledge that as Jesus didn't fulfill the prophesies he could not have been the messiah.

 

[1robin]

Yeah, Jews and Muslims both disagree with you, what you have is an abomination that neither of those faiths acknowledge as related to theirs.

What are you talking about? The Bible, God, Christ? What is it that is abominable? Jews and Muslims do not agree with what?

However, al-lah literally means "the god" so...

I know very well what that word means and I also know very well the being it describes in the Quran is incompatible with God in the Bible.

There are also no Christians in the Torah, that must mean that Christianity is a heretic faith?

When I claim there were or that there should have been then that might be relevant. I do not care if Jews call Christians heretics, I think history demonstrates their lack of apprehension regarding God rendering their condemnations less than meaningful anyway, but I was not discussing Jews, Muslims, or the Torah. I said the concept of Allah in the Quran is incompatible with Yahweh of the Bible.

BTW, if you are ever wondering about Hebrew scripture or language, i speak it and i know the scripture. I'm an agnostic atheist Jew.

I have more than one professional concordance available at a click of the mouse. However I was not debating the meaning of the words, only the characteristics of what they describe. The Islamic Allah and Christian God are not even remotely the same description.

 

[1robin]

Have you read the OT? Do you honestly come to the conclusion that the OT vengeful, murderous, genocidal god of the OT is closer to the NT god than to the Islamic god?

Yep. He was setting up a political system in order to inaugurate the NT spiritual system. One had to account for the violent nature of Israel's inhabitants and their enemies, the other did not. As the OT claims there is a time for war and a time for peace. A time to sow and a time to reap.

Not to mention, both the OT and the Quaran acknowledge that as Jesus didn't fulfill the prophesies he could not have been the messiah.

No the OT does allow that Jesus met the prophecies only some that read the OT do not. Let's pretend for a minute that there are quite a few in the OT that he did not meet. There are about 350 prophecies about the messiah in the Bible. Let's pretend he did not meet 100 of the OT prophecies. Are you claiming that a man just happened to come along and meet the other 250 who was not the messiah. The probabilities of that are inherently absurd. I claim he met them all but even if he did not the position that he got lucky for the rest of them is just silly.

What the heck is an agnostic atheist? That is like being a neutral antagonist.

 

[Monotheist 101]

However I was not debating the meaning of the words, only the characteristics of what they describe. The Islamic Allah and Christian God are not even remotely the same description.

Allah is described as omnipotent. Is the Christian God not described as being the same?

 

[1robin]

Allah is described as omnipotent. Is the Christian God not described as being the same?

DidI say every single characteristic was different. They are both describing the same type of being so they will have similarities. However the same God would not have Christ die on the cross and not die on the cross nor give dozens of detailed stories in one book and then get them all mixed up in time, names, and events in a second book. Things are not equal because they have a few similarities, they are equal only if they have all identical traits and details. Have you never argued against ridiculous parallelism arguments from an atheist before? Allah and Thor or Zeus have similarities are they the same being? A and not A can never be equal or even true at the same time.

 

[ImprobableBeing]

No the OT does allow that Jesus met the prophecies only some that read the OT do not.

And by that you mean that there is peace in the world and the third temple was built? That christians had to make up a second coming to fulfill the prophecies should tell you something.

He did NOT fulfill the prophecies, he was not the messiah and since there is no discussion to be had, i end it here.

What the heck is an agnostic atheist? That is like being a neutral antagonist.

atheistm=without a belief in god/s
agnosticism=without a knowledge about the existence of god/s

I don't believe in a god but i also don't proclaim to know that i'm right.

This is usually very hard for theists to grasp.

 

[illykitty]

Allah and Thor or Zeus have similarities are they the same being?

Actually some people, me included, would consider them as the same beings, interpreted differently. Two people read a text and have different conclusions, doesn't make the text different.

 

[ImprobableBeing]

Actually some people, me included, would consider them as the same beings, interpreted differently. Two people read a text and have different conclusions, doesn't make the text different.

Then you know nothing of Tor (the real name for Thor).

You should put Oden in his place, king of all gods, slayer of ice giants... all that.

You know, the messiah would bring peace to earth...

Oden promised an end to all ice giants...

It's not very peaceful but i sure as heck don't see any ice giants around.

 

[1robin]

Actually some people, me included, would consider them as the same beings, interpreted differently. Two people read a text and have different conclusions, doesn't make the text different.

First the text is objectively different no matter what standard you use. Second a person may consider true anything they wish including things that are not true. Third in what way does interpretation reconcile these two statement?

Jesus died on the cross.
They did not crucify nor kill him.

How can the same God claim mutually exclusive things? You are welcome to believe what you wish but given that everything we have or will have is in the balance I would hope you would be more careful about why you believe what you do. Allah in the Quran and Yahweh in the Bible are irreconcilable unless scriptures of both books are tortured and mangled so badly they no longer mean anything.

 

[1robin]

And by that you mean that there is peace in the world and the third temple was built? That christians had to make up a second coming to fulfill the prophecies should tell you something.

The second coming is predicted by Christ. Unless you can show that claim was falsely inserted into the Bible then we have only your assertions where evidence should be.

He did NOT fulfill the prophecies, he was not the messiah and since there is no discussion to be had, i end it here.

Then why are you here? But I suppose that is one way out I guess.
http://www.accordingtothescriptures.org/prophecy/353prophecies.html

 

[1robin]

Then you know nothing of Tor (the real name for Thor).

Of course I don't because he does not exist.

You should put Oden in his place, king of all gods, slayer of ice giants... all that.

You know, the messiah would bring peace to earth...

Oden promised an end to all ice giants...

It's not very peaceful but i sure as heck don't see any ice giants around.

I have heard that several times. It would be meaningful only if you found that ice giants had ever existed in the first place. I will take a future universal peace over the elimination of ice giants that never existed to begin with any day. However if Oden can get rid of taxes it may change things a little.