Please remember it because I’m sure I’m going to say something that will set someone off.
I agree that truth is one but there are many perceptions of that One truth.
This is similar to what I said in post #415,
“Each of us can have our own preferences and perceptions of what is truth, but those preferences and perceptions do not make or change reality.”
Its a little like the parable of the elephant where each has a part of the elephant and makes his conclusions accordingly, The blind man holding the tail believes it to be a snake. The man with his arms around a leg belives it to be the trunk of a tree.
I am fond of this parable, but I think it ignores something crucial - The existence of prophets.
A true prophet is not “blind” like the other men in this parable. Through the lens of revelation, he can see what the others cannot.
A true prophet, when likened to this parable, would be able to see the part of the elephant before him and recognize that it is indeed an elephant’s tail or leg.
He would not be able to see the entire elephant. Just like no man can know everything about God. However, he will be able to see what the Lord decides to show him.
I believe the Lord has revealed many truths through His prophets, both ancient and modern, and these truths can be found today in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. It is the Kingdom of God upon the Earth.
Just as the parable teaches, “blind men” cannot lead anyone to truth. It will take a true prophet.
Jesus is the 'Son of God' but not in the manner that you and I would have a child.
I disagree and believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is God the Father’s literal son, both spiritually and physically.
Before His birth in mortality the Lord Jesus Christ was a spirit child of God known as Jehovah (Yahweh) and He, under the direction of Our Heavenly Father, was the God of Israel who created the physical universe.
When the time came for Jehovah to dwell with Man, according to the covenant He made with Abraham, Mary was chosen to be His mortal mother, and with some process involving the Holy Spirit, God the Father implanted His genetic material into Mary thus making the Lord Jesus Christ the Son of God, both spiritually and physically.
He was as much Man as He was God.
Muslims believe in the virgin birgin birth and see Mary the mother of Jesus as the greatest woman of her time. A whole chapter of the Quran is dedicated to her.
That’s right. I think they also claim that Mary was only a little girl at the time.
Even though I believe that Muhammad is not a true prophet and that the teachings of Islam are not completely true, I never meant to claim that everything that Islam believes and teaches is wrong or incorrect.
As the old adage goes, “A broken clock is still right twice a day.”
Some Muslim scholars argue that Jesus was not physically the 'son of God' but spiritually the 'Son of God'. Muslims are obliged to believe in the all the prophets that have gone before with special emphasis on Moses and Jesus.
That’s the problem with following after “blind men” that do not have the spirit of revelation.
I believe He is a true prophet for the same reason I believe Moses and Jesus to be true prophets. Each brought a Revelation from God that utterly transformed the lives of their followers for many generations. Each revelation is recorded in a book for us to study. That is the Torah, Gospel, and Quran. Each though born at very different times in remarkably different civilisations, were nonetheless outstanding in the manner they lived their lives. Because of all of this, they are more than mere prophets. They are Manifestations of God Himself, each with a designated title to highlight their uniqueness and specialness. Moses was the friend of God, Jesus the Son of God, and Muhammad the Messenger of God.
That is interesting, yet something I can never wholly agree with.
Moses and Muhammad were just men. I believe that Moses was a true prophet while Muhammad was not.
My opinion about Muhammad as a man is a mixed bag, and ultimately unimportant. I’ve heard good and bad about him.
I cannot accept him as a true prophet because he denies the divinity of Christ, His role as the Savior, Redeemer and Mediator for all Creation and Mankind’s reliance on Him for existence, salvation, exaltation or any good thing.
Agreed. That is what the parable of the elephant is about.
Ok good. I thought you missed that.
Some of us have a mixture of true and false beliefs. We are human are we not? I think you are being too black and white.
Of course! I did not say that “
everything we believe in is either right or wrong” I said, “Either what we believe in is right or it is wrong”.
I know that there are some things I believe in that are not true. I know that to be fact because I am not yet perfect.
However, that does not change the fact that whatever is true is true and everything else is false.
Believing that an elephant’s leg is a tree is false. It will never be true. It does not matter how much you want it to be a tree. It is not and will never become a tree.
Both Christans and Muslims have had major disagreements and even schisms over differences of belief. It is our perception that differs, not the fundamental underlying truths.
True and completely irrelevant. Our perception does not affect what is truth.
Believing Muhammad is a prophet does not make him so, just as believing that Jesus Christ is the literal Son of God does not make Him so.
According to my perception (which I believe to be the truth) Jesus Christ is divine, therefore Muhammad cannot be a true prophet.
God in His love for the whole of humanity has guided different peoples at different times.
Correct. The Book of Mormon is a clear example of that and actually mentions how God gives to His children only what they can handle.
Some can handle more than others. Those who take and accept what has been revealed can eventually come to receive more.
That’s another reason I cannot believe that Muhammad was a true prophet because he claimed that he was the last.
God’s work is not finished as long as mortal Man is upon the Earth. Therefore, He would not stop calling prophets to guide His children.
We would agree on Moses and Jesus being examples of His guidance. We disagree on Muhammad. You believe Jesus visited America and the claims of Joseph Smith. Baha'is believe in Baha'u'llah. The Baha'i Faith and Mormonism are not the main point of disussion here. We are talking about Muhammad and Islam.
It is because of my LDS beliefs that I cannot believe that Muhammad is a true prophet.
So, if you're talking to me, they are going to come up.
Baha'is are good with Jesus the Jewish Messiah, Saviour, Son of God, Lordship of Christ, and purity of Christ.
I have only talked with a handful of those of the Baha’i faith and they seem to try to be “good” with everyone, which reminds me of the saying, “If you stand for everything, you stand for nothing.”
Let's focus on Muhammad and the Quran and why He is or isn't the Messenger of God whom He claimed to be.
I honestly do not think there is anything more to say.
I’m willing to discuss these things and learn, but there are some things he denies that I have come to believe are absolute truths.
And I cannot be swayed.
