What does God want from you?

[InChrist]

When a child develops cancer and the parents don't want their kid to have it, couldn't a God have prevented it? Or eliminate it? It's a God after all, if it's worth its weight in salt it should use its power for good, and for the sake of the innocent, yes?

I think you are missing the point or the larger bigger, eternal picture. According to the scriptures, this is a fallen world and I think it is very obvious to see that. Jesus demonstrated His love for humanity by willingly entering into human suffering Himself, to bring deliverance. God has no plans to fix things in this world; it and the sin which has caused the damage will be destroyed and eliminated forever. A new heaven and earth is the plan.
If you are truly concerned about the tragic, yet temporary suffering going on here now, what about eternal suffering and separation from the only Source of life? God considers a person’s eternal state more important. Time is brief, eternity is forever. Any innocent child that dies in this broken world is delivered into the presence of their Creator and will live forever in His love and joy; no more tears, pain, or death.

 

[InChrist]

How can you know who has submitted their lives to Christ, or if they truly care about others?
All Christians 'say' they know Christ personally, so how do you know that they don't know Christ personally?

There are scriptures which indicate that Christ will return again in glory of the Father, but there are no scriptures that say that Jesus will return to earth.
When Daniel referred to the end times messiah and it does not say that the Son of man will come, it says one like the son of man will come.

Daniel 7:13-14 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.​

Three years ago, I started a thread on the Son of man in the clouds.

Who is the Son of man who will come in the clouds of heaven?

Jesus Christ knows those who have submitted their lives to Him, know Him personally, trust, and love Him, so I think that’s what matters.

You are free to your thoughts or the Baha’i interpretation about who the Son of man is or whether Jesus will return or not. I’ve shared my perspective and what I see in the scriptures, but don’t need to keep arguing about it. I’m at peace within myself knowing that Jesus promised He is coming again and I think the Apostles, including John who wrote Revelation also thought Jesus would return.

He He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming quickly.”

Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus!

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

 

[Bird123]

I don't think so, because @F1fan is an atheist.

Why do you think being an atheist matters?

 

[Bird123]

No, sometimes it adds up pretty well, sometimes it just is.

No. The only intelligence that we know of in the universe is possessed by living creatures on earth, and they didn't do it.

Good answer. Exactly the same with Superman.


I asked you before, what real entity do you intend to denote when you say "God"? If you can't tell me what real thing God is, then God remains simply an idea, a thing variously imagined in various brains, along with other imaginary beings.


You've asserted that, but my remarks on the matter are above.

That must start by identifying a real God clearly. It appears you can't do that, in which case it would be fair to say you don't know what you're talking about, no?

You already know God whether you realize this or not.
God is a High Intelligent Being. Yes, Intelligence exists far beyond that of mankind. God is not a what. God is actually Someone.

I know you like labels and titles. I use the name God as a point of reference for you. Language is a funny thing. Meanings can be vague and manipulated. An interaction with God uses no names, titles or labels. It is about what is. Everyone already knows who everyone is. Yes, It's communication at it's best.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[blü 2]

You already know God whether you realize this or not.

Well, it's clear to me that God, being imaginary, can be anything the individual would like God to be and have such qualities as the individual would like God to have.

It's equally clear to me that no real entity, no being existing out there in the world external to the self, is intended to be denoted by the word "God". Otherwise you could describe this being, and show me photos, videos, recorded interviews.

By the way, you already know Frxnqot whether you realize this or not.

 

[Bird123]

Im not religious.

But you are very much a believer.

You are begging others to agree with you because you think you have Truth. You claim to point the direction, but you do no such thing. You claim to have expalined what you think is Truth, but you have been superficial and vague. The problem is clearly in your lap, and you seem oddly oblivious to your flaws. It's almost cartoonish the gap between what you think you do and what you actually do.

Easy, I rely of facts and reason, and thus far I have never seen anyone present credible evidenc that any of the many gods exist outside of human imagination. You are no different. I'm sure you are very confident in what you believe, but you don't seem confident in explaining what you think God is.

If you read what critical thinkers write you will realize they are very open minded. What they aren't is naive and guilible. It is no surprize critial thinkers reject ideas that lack evidence, regardless how popular they are among the people.

I would say that wisdom requires a substantial knowledge base, but with so many things to learn a wise verson can keep learning all their life. Naive and ignorant people are seldom wise.

If you mean do I learn from exverts who have learned more than I know about subjects? Yes, we all rely on that system if we want to have competency about a subject. And knowledge isn't believed in the way you believe in Bigfoot, knowledge has an inherent credibility and reliability built into it through the ethics of academia.

You haven't offered one shred of evidence that any God exists. You mentioning a God as if it is celebrity does not prove anything.

Who are you talking about, the cousin of the Great and powerful Oz? Your code speak is irrelevant if you can't be accurate and factual.

You do not have to be religious to be influenced by religion.

Believer? I follow no religion. Knowing you and God exist has nothing to do with beliefs.

Do you really think I am begging anyone to believe anything? I point to Discovering the truth for yourself. It has never ever been about believing. Don't believe me if you choose. Great!! What each person chooses to do with truth is entirely up to them. Free choice is a part of the learning process.

Ah yes, those critical thinkers, what have they really Discovered? They are exactly like religious people. Hang on to your beliefs. Expect everything served up so you can accept or reject. If one points to where the answers are, why do they sit on their hands? Do they seek God and truth or do they just want their beliefs to be right? Religious people and atheists are the same only their beliefs are at different ends.

How do you define ignorant? Isn't everyone ignorant at something? Do you really think you know more than you don't know? Show me your Wisdom.

Open minded? By making judgment calls on those you judge naive or ignorant, you are walling yourself away from those things they might teach you. You never know what piece of wisdom could be hiding in one you least expect. Isn't this really an Ego problem?

I have given you evidence from my experiences. The truth is you not only do not want to hear what I am saying, you do not want what I say to be true. Say God and your walls go up and your mind is closed to all possibilities except those you want to be true. Truth will not always be an agreeable thing.

I think it cute you refer to such things as the wizard of oz, superman, Santa Claus and things a child values. Why do you think like a child? An interaction with God is going to be a mental stretch for you to even keep up. You are going to have to use advanced thinking rather than simple child thinking. Clearly, critical thinking or not, you are not ready. That's OK. You are going to bump into God in time. Do not feel badly or foolish when you do. It has never ever been about believing in God. You are really going to like God. You are going to want to be just like Him!!

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Trailblazer]

Has religion corrupted your mind so that you can see nothing else?

I said: I don't think so, because @F1fan is an atheist.

Why do you think being an atheist matters?

Why would religion corrupt the mind of an atheist? He doesn't believe any religion is true.

 

[Bird123]

This is what God wants most.

He Who is your Lord, the All-Merciful, cherisheth in His heart the desire of beholding the entire human race as one soul and one body. (Baha’u’llah)

Aren't they already? All Children of God and All in God's Image. Isn't it only Ego that decides God's children are only the human race?

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[CG Didymus]

Jesus Christ knows those who have submitted their lives to Him, know Him personally, trust, and love Him, so I think that’s what matters.

You are free to your thoughts or the Baha’i interpretation about who the Son of man is or whether Jesus will return or not. I’ve shared my perspective and what I see in the scriptures, but don’t need to keep arguing about it. I’m at peace within myself knowing that Jesus promised He is coming again and I think the Apostles, including John who wrote Revelation also thought Jesus would return.

He He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming quickly.”

Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus!

The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

I don't think there is an official Baha'i interpretation of who the lamb is. Some Baha'is say that their prophet the Bab is the lamb that was slain, but I haven't seen a quote in the Baha'i writings that says that.

Of course, their big claim is that it says lots of things about the Glory of God. But what does that prove when he took that title for himself. But they do take the Three Woes from Revelation and pretend that the Woes refer to Muhammad, the Bab and Baha'u'llah. But, if we carry the prophecies about who and when the Messiah is to come to Judaism, then I've asked Baha'is to show me where four Messiahs were predicted, Jesus, Muhammad, the Bab and Baha'u'llah. Or then with Christianity, other than their Three Woes, where do they have three returns of Christ happening, Muhammad, the Bab and Baha'u'llah.

But it's what Baha'is do with the resurrection of Jesus that bothers me the most. They are okay with what the gospels say about Jesus being crucified, but after that, they say the story suddenly went into an allegorical, symbolic story of Jesus coming back to life. So, to me, they're just another religion that thinks its guy is the return of Christ. They believe it, and they believe their interpretations of the Bible supports it.

 

[Bird123]

More of your vague claims. None of this suggests any God exists or acts. Academic knowledge is given by teachers and professors. But personal knowledge, like learning the lemons are sour by licking it. You learn the stove can be hot by experience. That's how wisdom is developed, trial and error. And if a person is intelligent and knowledgable they can develop better wisdom than the average person.

You never explained what "Discovered" means, and why you capitalize this. More vague code words that mean something to you, but not to anyone else (because you keep it your secret). You seem to have your own little assumption that you keep hidden.

You have it backwards. Brains evolved because the universe it how it is. So nothing about a God acting in any way.

What are you asking? Goal of what? Evolution follows how humans behave in the environments they create, for better or worse.

Another vague set of statements. What is your point?

Like a bunch of kids beating a pinata? What are you talking about? Nothing in these three items suggest a God exists and acts.

I asked you for three examples and you failed. Nothing you offer shows us that a God exists outside of your imagination.

Notice in all your claimed wisdom and answers you offer nothing. What does answer these questions? A natural world at work that has no moral guidelines. Belief is a God only makes a person confused, becvause they exvect specialt treatment, and we clearly see natural doesn't treat a baby any better than it does worms.

You make these claims without evidence, so we throw them out. We can't take you seriously.

I see that you ask questions that you can't answer.

One thing about being wise is not asking questions that can't be answered. I learned that many years ago.

If you were correct you would explain it. You claim to have special insights, but your posts suggest you don't. You seem to prefer being lost in a set of questions than working to understand what we humans can know about how things are. My guess is that you "wowed" yourself within your beliefs and thoughts and you think it is profound. This is common among the naive believers.

First one must crawl before one can learn to walk. How long did mankind watch birds fly before they figured out how? Choosing to be Blind? If God wanted mankind to fly, God would have given them wings.
See how hanging on to beliefs one wants to be true can limit one from moving forward.

Widen the view!! Look around you!! Put the Puzzle together!! See how it does add up and fit!! Behold the Masterpiece!!!

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Trailblazer]

So, to me, they're just another religion that thinks its guy is the return of Christ.

You can hope that is the case but I would not bank on it.

 

[F1fan]

I think you are missing the point or the larger bigger, eternal picture. According to the scriptures, this is a fallen world and I think it is very obvious to see that. Jesus demonstrated His love for humanity by willingly entering into human suffering Himself, to bring deliverance. God has no plans to fix things in this world; it and the sin which has caused the damage will be destroyed and eliminated forever. A new heaven and earth is the plan.
If you are truly concerned about the tragic, yet temporary suffering going on here now, what about eternal suffering and separation from the only Source of life? God considers a person’s eternal state more important. Time is brief, eternity is forever. Any innocent child that dies in this broken world is delivered into the presence of their Creator and will live forever in His love and joy; no more tears, pain, or death.

Are you being serious? Do you think a parent that has a child diagnosed with cancer, and is in emotional agony as their baby goes through chemo and radiaation not knowing if all this extra suffering will save its life is going to ignore the pain and think about what you post here? I have known parents with kids in treatment and they focus only on their baby surviving cancer. Your response illustrates the moral emptiness of conservative Christianity.

 

[F1fan]

You do not have to be religious to be influenced by religion.

True, conservative Christians are imposing their religious beliefs in legislation and court rulings, all against the Constitution. They don't care.

Believer? I follow no religion. Knowing you and God exist has nothing to do with beliefs.

Yet as you note you have been influenced by religion in thhat you have adoted the idea of God for your beliefs. I know betyter than to be influenced by religion in that way.

Do you really think I am begging anyone to believe anything? I point to Discovering the truth for yourself. It has never ever been about believing. Don't believe me if you choose. Great!! What each person chooses to do with truth is entirely up to them. Free choice is a part of the learning process.

You show desperation for others to agree with you. You also seem oblivious to how others percieve you.

Ah yes, those critical thinkers, what have they really Discovered?

They have discovered (no need to capitalize the word for dramatic effect) what is true about how things are. Your posts seldom overlap knowledge.

They are exactly like religious people. Hang on to your beliefs. Expect everything served up so you can accept or reject. If one points to where the answers are, why do they sit on their hands? Do they seek God and truth or do they just want their beliefs to be right? Religious people and atheists are the same only their beliefs are at different ends

You attack eveyone here to defend you own personal religious type of belief. You don't want friends, you want others to agree with you. Why do people with fringe ideas need followers? because they don't have a factual basis for their framework and think they can gain credibility with numbers who agree. That is how religion works.

How do you define ignorant?

The usual dictionary definition. It's not controversial.

Isn't everyone ignorant at something?

Yes, but wise people know how to look for valid answers if they are curious about something. Believers will seek answers they want from sources that are offering what they want.

Do you really think you know more than you don't know? Show me your Wisdom.

Just did.

Open minded? By making judgment calls on those you judge naive or ignorant, you are walling yourself away from those things they might teach you. You never know what piece of wisdom could be hiding in one you least expect. Isn't this really an Ego problem?

When others demonstrate naive and ignorant behavior it says nothing about me that I observe it and point it out. How would my observatives be an ego problem? Notice how you try to evade the criticam I made. You don't even deny it. That's a bit revealing.

I have given you evidence from my experiences.

Your experiences are yours, they aren't evidence.

The truth is you not only do not want to hear what I am saying, you do not want what I say to be true.

False, you don't say as much as you think you do. Other thinkers agree with me.

Say God and your walls go up and your mind is closed to all possibilities except those you want to be true.

False. Those who mention God are usually sharing their beliefs, and they never provide credible evidence that will convince a skilled thinker that their idea of God exists. You included. You have offered no evidence of the God you claim is real.

Truth will not always be an agreeable thing.

You illustrate this like many theists who believe in ideas that are not rooted in evidence or even plausible.

I think it cute you refer to such things as the wizard of oz, superman, Santa Claus and things a child values. Why do you think like a child? An interaction with God is going to be a mental stretch for you to even keep up. You are going to have to use advanced thinking rather than simple child thinking. Clearly, critical thinking or not, you are not ready. That's OK. You are going to bump into God in time. Do not feel badly or foolish when you do. It has never ever been about believing in God. You are really going to like God. You are going to want to be just like Him!!

Notice you offer no more evidence for your idea of God that shows it is any more real than Superman. That's why God is in the same category as other fictional characters.

 

[InChrist]

Are you being serious? Do you think a parent that has a child diagnosed with cancer, and is in emotional agony as their baby goes through chemo and radiaation not knowing if all this extra suffering will save its life is going to ignore the pain and think about what you post here? I have known parents with kids in treatment and they focus only on their baby surviving cancer. Your response illustrates the moral emptiness of conservative Christianity.

I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make or where your questions are supposed to lead, but I definitely consider the emotional agony of parents who have a child going through cancer treatments, or any other suffering that happens in this life to be very real, challenging, and heart wrenching.
I am trying to stress the point that God desires to eliminate such suffering and death from people’s lives and the sin which is the root cause…forever.


For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. Romans 8:18

 

[F1fan]

First one must crawl before one can learn to walk.

Where it comes to rational thinking you aren't even crawling.

How long did mankind watch birds fly before they figured out how? Choosing to be Blind? If God wanted mankind to fly, God would have given them wings.

Or humans don't need any gods and learned the science behind flight and designed and built airplanes. Man doesn't need a God, man made wings for himself.

See how hanging on to beliefs one wants to be true can limit one from moving forward.

Yes, you offer us an excellent example. Thanks.

Widen the view!! Look around you!! Put the Puzzle together!! See how it does add up and fit!! Behold the Masterpiece!!!

That's what science does. What you seem to want is some distorted belief that is built on assumptions that are at your whim.

 

[F1fan]

I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make or where your questions are supposed to lead, but I definitely consider the emotional agony of parents who have a child going through cancer treatments, or any other suffering that happens in this life to be very real, challenging, and heart wrenching.
I am trying to stress the point that God desires to eliminate such suffering and death from people’s lives and the sin which is the root cause…forever.

Our dialog began because you think a God exists that is the creator of all things, and that it is loving. I pointed out how cancer existing is inconsistent with what you claimed. If a God exists it is either a sociopath, or incompetent. It is certainly not loving. Nothing about the myth of Adam and Eve is valid, as the fall was not a real thing. You couldn't defend your belief so you went off on a tangent about the "bigger picture" which is both morally insensitive and irrelevant to the facts of real people facing life or death of their children. If children are sacred as many Christians claim, then your God does not agree with you.

For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. Romans 8:18

This is part of a sales pitch for Christianity, a promise that is highly questionable. Why not just make this life pleasant? Because life is hard, a God doesn't make sense, and they try to sell you on the afterlife. They prey on the gullible. Did you really buy this idea?

 

[ppp]

I am trying to stress the point that God desires to eliminate such suffering and death from people’s lives and the sin which is the root cause…forever.

You can stress that all you want, but the fact is that if your god exists, then the fact that sin is a root cause is that God has chosen sin to be a root cause. Every pain. Every fear. Every quanta of pain. Every cry has necessarily been specifically chosen by your god.

 

[InChrist]

Our dialog began because you think a God exists that is the creator of all things, and that it is loving. I pointed out how cancer existing is inconsistent with what you claimed. If a God exists it is either a sociopath, or incompetent. It is certainly not loving. Nothing about the myth of Adam and Eve is valid, as the fall was not a real thing. You couldn't defend your belief so you went off on a tangent about the "bigger picture" which is both morally insensitive and irrelevant to the facts of real people facing life or death of their children. If children are sacred as many Christians claim, then your God does not agree with you.

This is part of a sales pitch for Christianity, a promise that is highly questionable. Why not just make this life pleasant? Because life is hard, a God doesn't make sense, and they try to sell you on the afterlife. They prey on the gullible. Did you really buy this idea?

How do you think God should make this life pleasant when sin is here making it unpleasant and worse than unpleasant?

 

[InChrist]

You can stress that all you want, but the fact is that if your god exists, then the fact that sin is a root cause is that God has chosen sin to be a root cause. Every pain. Every fear. Every quanta of pain. Every cry has necessarily been specifically chosen by your god.

Can you explain how or why you think has God chosen sin ?

 

[ppp]

How do you think God should make this life pleasant when sin is here making it unpleasant and worse than unpleasant?

By having created a world without sin.