What does God want from you?

[TLK Valentine]

Only that which has been proven true or false as a fact is set in stone.
The opinion most atheists hold, that God does not exist, has not been proven true or false so it is not set in stone.

Careful now -- even the facts can change.

"Human beings are incapable of setting foot on the moon" was once as true a fact as you can get -- but setting that in stone would've been a terrible mistake.

A belief and an opinion are similar.

Belief is the state of mind in which a person thinks something to be the case, with or without there being empirical evidence to prove that something is the case with factual certainty.
Belief - Wikipedia

Opinion: a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge. opinion meaning - Google Search

Then I stand by my original statement -- Atheists do indeed have beliefs.

 

[Kathryn]

I personally don't believe that God cares all that much when it comes to what we consider to be "longevity." I don't think it matters to Him (or Her) whether we are alive six minutes or sixty years or 106 years. It's all going to be like nothing to us one day. Like no time ever passed (and time and age and all that are merely constructs of men).

 

[Trailblazer]

Perhaps there is a God, but it'd be beyond comprehension in many ways. Who knows?

Yes, that is what I believe. That way I don't have to put expectations on God.

 

[CG Didymus]

One would tink that God could talk to everyone simultaneously.

If god is omni, then they could carry on multiple conversations simultaneously; and each conversation in utter privacy.

And supposedly he is.

Or believers are imagining their God is talking to them. How does a believer test this objectively? How do they avoid confirmation bias? Do they even care about confirmation bias?

That's a strange belief that her God doesn't answer back. I know a lot of Christians and people in other religions that say they do hear back from God... including some Baha'is.

That's what it seems like. It's amazing, no matter what religion, God talks to them in exactly the way their beliefs say he will. Like those that believe their God needs an animal sacrifice. "The Gods have spoken. We must sacrifice a goat today. God said that is what it will take to make him happy."

It's very likely somebody is imagining things. Since, even the Baha'is believe in false prophets, then some of them are imagining that God is talking to them or worse, they know he isn't but say he is. And from a born-again Christian perspective, that is what Muhammad, the Bab and Baha'u'llah are doing?

And notice no matter what the social or political issue God always agrees with the mere mortal. God is mightily confused, or believers are wrong.

Which sure makes it seem like people are making up their own Gods.

?? I thought that the Baha'i believe that humans would explode into a fine red mist or something if their god spoke directly to them. That is why they claim the existence of messengers.

If the Baha'i God doesn't answer back, what good is he? But TB isn't a reliable authority on Baha'i beliefs. I don't see any problem for a God to send angels which I do believe means "messengers", to send his Holy Spirit, for he himself to whisper in the ear of a person what to do.

The problem I have with Baha'is is mainly their "progressive" revelation. If TB is right, then the only thing we know about God is from these messengers/manifestations and whoever else Baha'i want to add to the list. Baha'i tend to only list nine because that is a sacred number to them.

What message did we get from Abraham? From Krishna? And on down the list? What consistent message did we get from any of them? The new guy supposedly updated the previous guy? How did Moses update what was taught by Krishna? What did Buddha bring that changed what Moses had taught?

Then... who wrote the message? I don't think Baha'is believe that any of the messages were written by the manifestation until their guys, the Bab and Baha'u'llah. But they like the Quran, because it was supposedly dictated to the people that wrote it by Muhammad. So, Baha'is don't believe any of those Scriptures are 100% reliable and authoritative, yet, supposedly, that's all people had to "know" about God? And then, on top of that, to make it all make sense, Baha'is claim that the people interpreted those if'y Scriptures and came up with beliefs like reincarnation, resurrecting, Satan etc.

To me, I can find a way to make it all make sense too... people made it up and they believe it and in their heads that can feel and hear their God speaking to them.

The Progressive Revelation of God​

ABRAHAM-5000 B.C. KRISHNA-3200 B.C. MOSES-1330 B.C. ZOROASTER-700 B.C. BUDDHA-500 B.C. CHRIST1 B.C. MUHAMMAD 570 A.D. THE BÁB 1844 A.D. BAHÁ’U’LLÁH 1863 A.D.

 

[ppp]

Then I stand by my original statement -- Atheists do indeed have beliefs.

That is so trivially true as to be meaningless. I have the belief that if I do not drink water then I will die of dehydration.

 

[ppp]

Refer to the answer of a fellow atheist that Creation Ex Nihilo is a theistic belief. It makes no sense to ask an atheist if he affirms theism. That is a question for your fellow theists. Nothing to do with atheists.
This means it is a blind believe and atheists can not defend their faith. This is dogmatic ( a state of intellectual immobiliy in which a person is so fanatical about his own idea that he refuses to see contrary idea).

That paragraph was not a grammatically coherent construction.

 

[CG Didymus]

A few years later, Jesus Himself reached into my life right where I was and saved me. Not only me, both my husband and I were born again to new life in Christ on the same day at home.

Some of us here have experienced being "born-again" but had our reasons to stop believing. So, I don't doubt that everything you say, and experience is real... to you. But, as you know, people, even people with different religious beliefs, will tell you how wrong you are.

It's the inconsistency of religious beliefs, even within a religion, that doesn't help give people confidence that what anybody is saying is true.

 

[Bird123]

Having a reliable methodology for determining if one if justified in accepting a claim.

Never ever ACCEPT!!!!! If you seek to know, burden of proof rests on the one who does seek!! Each person decides for themselves what they choose to seek.

If one simply accepts, one is not seeking Truth. One is seeking Beliefs!!! As we all know, Beliefs are not always true!!

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[ppp]

Never ever ACCEPT!!!!! If you seek to know, burden of proof rests on the one who does seek!! Each person decides for themselves what they choose to seek.

If one simply accepts, one is not seeking Truth. One is seeking Beliefs!!! As we all know, Beliefs are not always true!!

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

I am tired of insensate babbling. Please put some thought into your words. Stop wasting my time with the knee jerk posts.

 

[Bird123]

Knowing.

Nobody is 'telling' anyone to practice our ways or our beliefs. That is a choice. They should look at all sides before making the choice that is best for them.

What is this thing you call Intelligence? How does it make the Best choices? What are the Best choices. How do you think you Know?

Are you telling me that your religion does not tell people to follow them?? Do they not tell people following them is the only way one can get close to God? The only way to know God is through their messengers? What about Hell? What about being flawed from birth? Do they tell people they aren't quite good for God or something of that nature? What about We against They? Is this why you deem this world a mess??

Does religion really just wait for people to Discover them? Isn't it part of the duty of followers to go out and acquire more followers?? Why are all these people from different religions knocking on my door trying to convert me to their religion?? You are going to have to clear that one up for me because I do not see it.

Intelligence by definition is the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills. When you make a bad choice, have you never said: I'll never do that again!! That is your intelligence telling you that a specific choice will not bring the best results. Each will decide for themselves what the best choices are. Having understood all sides, the knowledge acquired will point to the choice that will deliver the best results.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

But the real world is precisely where you can't find God ─ and that's assuming you had the vaguest clue what exactly you were looking for.

Which you certainly appear not to. Please show me I'm wrong by describing God to me such that if I find a real suspect I can determine whether it's God or not.

Actually, I've asked you that before. Why did you not answer? You silence indicates you don't know ─ is that correct?

God is a Spiritual Being just like you are in your true nature. God is High Intelligence.

Have you really not heard me say these things?

Worry not, when you bump into God, there is one thing you will realize. You will realize that you already know God.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

Well, I'm not a monotheist but I'll chime in.

I don't believe the Gods have wants or desires directed towards individual humans. From what I recall, the Norse creation myth, when it came to humans, says that we were not given a set fate by the Gods after they created the original man and woman and gifted them with spirit, will, intelligence and the senses, they're kind of left to make their own way.

This doesn't mean that the Gods don't care about humans, but it's certainly not the same as the Abramahic dynamic.

OK, Great!! a little diversity here.
God is at a Higher Level. A Higher Level would want the kiddies to reach that Higher Level for themselves. Look around you. Do you see such a system in place that results in just that in time?

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Bird123]

I am tired of insensate babbling. Please put some thought into your words. Stop wasting my time with the knee jerk posts.

Look deeper. The math does add up!!

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[CG Didymus]

Are you telling me that your religion does not tell people to follow them?? Do they not tell people following them is the only way one can get close to God? The only way to know God is through their messengers? What about Hell? What about being flawed from birth? Do they tell people they aren't quite good for God or something of that nature? What about We against They? Is this why you deem this world a mess??

Does religion really just wait for people to Discover them? Isn't it part of the duty of followers to go out and acquire more followers?? Why are all these people from different religions knocking on my door trying to convert me to their religion?? You are going to have to clear that one up for me because I do not see it.

Intelligence by definition is the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills. When you make a bad choice, have you never said: I'll never do that again!! That is your intelligence telling you that a specific choice will not bring the best results. Each will decide for themselves what the best choices are. Having understood all sides, the knowledge acquired will point to the choice that will deliver the best results.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Yes, Baha'is are told to go "teach" the Faith.

"In the Aqdas Bahá’u’lláh considers teaching as a spiritual obligation imposed upon every devoted believer and servant of His Faith. Should the friends become fully conscious of this duty and arise to do their share, this Cause will soon permeate every home throughout the world and the Kingdom of God will be established."​

​

(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to an individual believer: Bahá’í News, No. 85, p. 8, July 1934)​

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

God is a Spiritual Being just like you are in your true nature. God is High Intelligence.

Have you really not heard me say these things?

Worry not, when you bump into God, there is one thing you will realize. You will realize that you already know God.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Why do you persist in preaching when it's clear that those you're targeting aren't interested in your spiritual beliefs? Furthermore, why is it important to you what these other members believe or don't believe? Do you believe that repeating the same verbiage will persuade them to change their minds?

 

[blü 2]

God is a Spiritual Being just like you are in your true nature. God is High Intelligence.

Have you really not heard me say these things?

Spiritual beings exist only as ideas, concepts, things imagined. They don't exist as entities with objective existence.

That's why they're as many and as various as characters in fiction ─ that's essentially what they are.

Worry not, when you bump into God, there is one thing you will realize. You will realize that you already know God.

I take your failure to provide a satisfactory description of a real god to be an acknowledgement that you have none.

 

[Trailblazer]

Are you telling me that your religion does not tell people to follow them?? Do they not tell people following them is the only way one can get close to God?

I am telling you that. Baha'is tell people that whether or not they follow the religion or not has to be their own choice.
Baha'is do not tell people following us is the only way one can get close to God. We tell them there are many approaches to God.

The only way to know God is through their messengers?

No, God can also be known through His creation. Everything in creation reveals the attributes of God.

“Whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth is a direct evidence of the revelation within it of the attributes and names of God, inasmuch as within every atom are enshrined the signs that bear eloquent testimony to the revelation of that Most Great Light.....​

​

…From that which hath been said it becometh evident that all things, in their inmost reality, testify to the revelation of the names and attributes of God within them. Each according to its capacity, indicateth, and is expressive of, the knowledge of God. So potent and universal is this revelation, that it hath encompassed all things visible and invisible....” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 178-179​

What about Hell? What about being flawed from birth? Do they tell people they aren't quite good for God or something of that nature? What about We against They? Is this why you deem this world a mess??

There is no such place as hell. According to Baha'i beliefs, hell is only a state of the soul who is distant from God.
The Baha'i Faith does not teach that humans are flawed from birth. It teaches that we were born good.
Quite the contrary, the Baha'i Faith teaches that humans are the noblest and most perfect of all created things.
Quite the contrary, the Baha'i Faith teaches that there is no We against They, as we are all One People.

Does religion really just wait for people to Discover them? Isn't it part of the duty of followers to go out and acquire more followers?? Why are all these people from different religions knocking on my door trying to convert me to their religion?? You are going to have to clear that one up for me because I do not see it.

I cannot speak for other religions, only my own. No, we are not supposed to wait for people to Discover the Baha'i Faith, we are supposed to tell people about it, but we are not supposed to try to convert anyone. Again, belief has to be a choice. If we did not tell people about the religion very few people would know about it. There are relatively few Baha'is compared to the other major religions so not that many people know about it or what it teaches.

Intelligence by definition is the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills. When you make a bad choice, have you never said: I'll never do that again!! That is your intelligence telling you that a specific choice will not bring the best results. Each will decide for themselves what the best choices are. Having understood all sides, the knowledge acquired will point to the choice that will deliver the best results.

In other words, live and learn through trial and error and thereby make a better choice next time. Learning through experience.

 

[Trailblazer]

Spiritual beings exist only as ideas, concepts, things imagined. They don't exist as entities with objective existence.

I believe we are all spiritual beings, so yes, spiritual beings exist as entities with objective existence.

I take your failure to provide a satisfactory description of a real god to be an acknowledgement that you have none.

I take it the same way. At least Baha'is have a description of God, so we have 'some idea' what God is, and isn't.

God in the Baháʼí Faith

 

[InChrist]

Some of us here have experienced being "born-again" but had our reasons to stop believing. So, I don't doubt that everything you say, and experience is real... to you. But, as you know, people, even people with different religious beliefs, will tell you how wrong you are.

It's the inconsistency of religious beliefs, even within a religion, that doesn't help give people confidence that what anybody is saying is true.

Yes, inconsistency can be an obstacle. Nevertheless, I find the unchangable faithfulness, truthfulness, and love of Jesus Christ to be steadfast and consistent. So I keep my focus on Him, not unreliable people and/or religious practices.

 

[ppp]

Look deeper. The math does add up!!

Present the math. No English. Just math. Go