What evidence is there that the Koran is the word of God?

[F0uad]

So you believe the Bible is half the word of your god? No problem... The Quran is 100% not from my God. Again, we are in agreement.

you make me smile

 

[beerisit]

Welcome to the world of circular reasoning and good luck.

Thank you for clearing that up Lionheart, but I'm afraid they still won't get it.

 

[Satyamavejayanti]

F0uad;2905405]
Yes the Quran does say ''Bring forth a chapter like it'' so its not a challenge from us but who ever ''revealed'' the quran or ''fabricated'' it, now we as muslims belief this ''challenge'' has to be seen in the light of When the Quran was revealed it was at the time when Arabic people were excellent at Arabic therefore could have made something similar to it yet all failed and even now FAIL.

What a challenge!

Literary excellence is no guarantee of divinity of a text. So It’s futile to throw or accept this challenge, as it would not prove or disprove the divinity of the book even when the challenge is met!

The challenge builds on a flawed assumption that if no comparable work exists for a given work, then it must be Divine. By that logic, even Mona Lisa is from God and Meghadootam of Kalidas is the word of God because these masterpieces have no parallels. Right?

Another flaw in this challenge is that it sets the challenger as the arbitrator/judge. So any Tom, Dick and Harry with a bunch of his friends can defeat the author of the Quran. All they have to do, is to attest that their friend has written a surah better than the author of the Quran and we’re done!

Finally, it’s utterly dumb of a Creator to challenge his Creation to outdo Him. Why would a sensible creator do that?

Imagine a car manufacturer throwing challenge at the car to run above its maximum design speed! Such a manufacturer would need a brain check up as he seems to forget that it is HE ALONE who has put the limits to the speed of his car. If he is not sure about the speed limits of his car, it implies that he lacks complete knowledge of his own product! On the other hand, if he does know the speed limits of the car and still challenges it, he needs mental treatment. Thus either Allah is not omniscient or He needs medical attention.

literary excellence cannot by itself be the proof of divinity. So No rational person would ever accept Quran as divine because of that alone.

 

[LaaIlahaIllAllah]

Welcome to the world of circular reasoning and good luck.

Thank you for clearing that up Lionheart, but I'm afraid they still won't get it.

I'm afraid, you are the ones "who don't get it". Did anyone even use this argument??

The argument used was the articles posted by me at the beginning of this thread, the English guy possibly has an excuse that he missed it cause he came late or something, beerisit.. Beerisit, beerisit, beery... I am starting tothink that you are visually handicapped. I have been telling you about the miracle of the Quran and it being inimitable - the prose/poetry thing - but you are STILL clueless! Amazing!
SubhanAllah , even if you read the articles now, and see the challenge and proof, you probably STILL will deny it and claim we "don't have a rock", when it's you who doesn't have a rock, hahaha.

{Indeed, those who disbelieve - it is all the same for them whether you warn them or do not warn them - they will not believe.

Allah has set a seal upon their hearts and upon their hearing, and over their vision is a veil. And for them is a great punishment.}
[ 2:6-7 ]

That type of cycle applies for your arguments - "is the Quran Word of God? No. Why? Cuz I said so and I am logical!!"

Muslim's response: " whata fool.."

 

[LaaIlahaIllAllah]

What a challenge!

Literary excellence is no guarantee of divinity of a text. So It’s futile to throw or accept this challenge, as it would not prove or disprove the divinity of the book even when the challenge is met!

The challenge builds on a flawed assumption that if no comparable work exists for a given work, then it must be Divine. By that logic, even Mona Lisa is from God and Meghadootam of Kalidas is the word of God because these masterpieces have no parallels. Right?

Another flaw in this challenge is that it sets the challenger as the arbitrator/judge. So any Tom, Dick and Harry with a bunch of his friends can defeat the author of the Quran. All they have to do, is to attest that their friend has written a surah better than the author of the Quran and we’re done!

Finally, it’s utterly dumb of a Creator to challenge his Creation to outdo Him. Why would a sensible creator do that?

Imagine a car manufacturer throwing challenge at the car to run above its maximum design speed! Such a manufacturer would need a brain check up as he seems to forget that it is HE ALONE who has put the limits to the speed of his car. If he is not sure about the speed limits of his car, it implies that he lacks complete knowledge of his own product! On the other hand, if he does know the speed limits of the car and still challenges it, he needs mental treatment. Thus either Allah is not omniscient or He needs medical attention.

literary excellence cannot by itself be the proof of divinity. So No rational person would ever accept Quran as divine because of that alone.

Yet another intelligent person who did not read the articles

It's not only about it's literary excellence, it's about another thing which is impossible to reproduce. In Arabic everything either falls in poetry or prose and there are some subcategories to those, by it's all ways poetry or prose. The Quran is not like this and does not fall in neither alone but is something like a mixture of both - as a non-Muslim translator of the Quran noticed.

So leaving aside the other things that people can make excuses for, there are no excuses for this other than " I dunno Arabic so i cant try it out", well that's not really a valid excuse or proof that the Quran can be imitated on this trait just cause one of you can't try out the challenge.

Anyways I am hoping you read the articles near the beginning of this thread and are enlightened about one reason the Quran is inimitable, whether you believe it is Word of God then is up to you but you cannot deny this characteristic and miracle.

 

[gnostic]

I said this only because to show you something, that if god ever sent a miracle, you would take it to the experts in this thing to know if it is truly possible. And that what happened to the greatest Arabic language experts in all history. But I don’t expect you to believe that Qur’an is god’s word just because Arabs in the 7th century saw it was miraculous. no one would have believed if this was the case.

But the solution to this problem is in the Qur’an itself, the best way is to examine the Qur’an itself, you know the Qur’an tells us : “We will show them Our signs in the horizons and within themselves until it becomes clear to them that it is the truth” [41:53]. So the Qur’an says that it will show us signs in the world, well let’s see.

Quran says “From both of them emerge pearl and coral” [55:22] i.e. both oceans and rivers. And this is something Arabs didn’t know (even non-Arabs) that you can get pearl and coral from rivers as well as seas but this is still not sufficient evidence, Muhammad may have said both because he has no reason to think rivers doesn’t contain pearl. But Qur’an says “And it is He who has released [simultaneously] the two seas, one fresh and sweet and one salty and bitter, and He placed between them a barrier and prohibiting partition” [25:53] also “He released the two seas, meeting [side by side]; Between them is a barrier [so] neither of them transgresses” [55:19-20] and modern science proved that wherever there is two seas meet they don’t mix, each will have different densities and different salinity levels but again Muhammad might have met someone that have tasted both seas and recorded this observation or it might be a piece of information that was known at the time but the Qur’an took credit of it being the most famous.

Qur’an also says “And the sun runs on its fixed course for a term ( appointed ) . That is the Decree of the All- Mighty, the All- Knowing” [36:38] how can an illiterate in the 7th century in the desert knows that the sun rotates in a fixed orbit? Perhaps this piece of information was known in one of the former great empires the roman or the Persians?

In Qur’an you find “Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and the earth were a joined entity, and We separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe” [21:30] does this remind you of something? Oh yes! Big bang. But how does anybody could have known about big bang before the last 60 years?

You find also “Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke” [41:11] you know science has proved that the space is full of some kind of dust called cosmic dust they say it fills all in between stars and planets they say it consists of dust particles like you find it in homes but when they tried to take samples of this dust particles they said that it doesn’t look like dust at all, in fact, it looks more like SMOKE and more researches proved that the dust that spread around a supernova (a blowing up star) is actually smoke and that the universe was smoke in its initial stages.

All of this might be an evidence and it might be not. But if you chose this to be not sufficient evidence then you have to say why. Because this may be true and maybe not, maybe this isn’t in Qur’an and maybe this isn’t real scientific discoveries and maybe there is a third explanation which people couldn’t find it yet. So please if you could find it please tell me. No one wants to be on the wrong ideology and someone has to be right (which doesn’t have to be Muslims).

Muslims always claims to have strong logic and they are proud of it, so prove it wrong.

I have created a new thread, to refute YOUR INTERPRETATIONS, keroghee, instead of replying here.

Go to this link When HEAVEN doesn't mean "space" or "universe"

 

[Satyamavejayanti]

Yet another intelligent person who did not read the articles

It's not only about it's literary excellence, it's about another thing which is impossible to reproduce. In Arabic everything either falls in poetry or prose and there are some subcategories to those, by it's all ways poetry or prose. The Quran is not like this and does not fall in neither alone but is something like a mixture of both - as a non-Muslim translator of the Quran noticed.

So leaving aside the other things that people can make excuses for, there are no excuses for this other than " I dunno Arabic so i cant try it out", well that's not really a valid excuse or proof that the Quran can be imitated on this trait just cause one of you can't try out the challenge.

Anyways I am hoping you read the articles near the beginning of this thread and are enlightened about one reason the Quran is inimitable, whether you believe it is Word of God then is up to you but you cannot deny this characteristic and miracle.

This is what i was answering to.

إِنَّا أَعْطَيْنَاكَ الْكَوْثَرَ
فَصَلِّ لِرَبِّكَ وَانْحَرْ
إِنَّ شَانِئَكَ هُوَ الْأَبْتَرُ

Inna aAtayna kal kawthar
Fasalli li rabbika wanhar
Inna shani-aka huwal abtar

Verily We have given to you the abundance
So pray to your Lord and sacrifice
Indeed your enemy is the one who is cut off

Chapter al-Kawthar (The Abundance) is the smallest chapter in the Qur’an consisting of only three lines. From a linguistic, literary, theological, rational and ideological point of view this chapter has the utmost significance. Being the smallest chapter in the Qur’an it is often cited by those who are involved in some form of polemic. This is due to the famous challenge of the Qur’an. The Qur’an states:

“If you (mankind) are in doubt concerning what We revealed to Our servant, than bring a chapter like it….” Qur’an 2:23

I am talking of the so called challenge, if you read my post you may understand.

 

[LaaIlahaIllAllah]

This is what i was answering to.



I am talking of the so called challenge, if you read my post you may understand.

The part you pasted doesn't really have anything to with what I was talking about specifically. Read the stuff I mentioned in my post from the articles.

 

[beerisit]

The part you pasted doesn't really have anything to with what I was talking about specifically. Read the stuff I mentioned in my post from the articles.

Of course it does. Allah challenges his creations to produce something better than he can. According to the Qu'ran. Why would an all powerful god make such a challenge?
Why would an all powerful god do that?

 

[FearGod]

Of course it does. Allah challenges his creations to produce something better than he can. According to the Qu'ran. Why would an all powerful god make such a challenge?
Why would an all powerful god do that?

He did so to answer your questions,arent you the one who is asking for an evidence and arent you the one asking for the challenge to show you an evidence,then if god show you
the evidence and he made it as a challenge,then you said,why he is challenging us.

 

[beerisit]

The shortest chapter in the Qu'ran can be replicated quite easily as I have shown. Why do you still maintain that the Qu'ran couldn't be written by man?

No sorry it's Allah who thinks that!

 

[FearGod]

The shortest chapter in the Qu'ran can be replicated quite easily as I have shown. Why do you still maintain that the Qu'ran couldn't be written by man?

No sorry it's Allah who thinks that!

Verily We have given to you the abundance
So pray to your Lord and sacrifice
Indeed your enemy is the one who is cut off

if you are serious to understand what is the mystery behind this short surah,
did you even tried to google for it and to find what the story behind it.

 

[beerisit]

Verily We have given to you the abundance
So pray to your Lord and sacrifice
Indeed your enemy is the one who is cut off

if you are serious to understand what is the mystery behind this short surah,
did you even tried to google for it and to find what the story behind it.

Why would I?
It is a nonsensical group of words, just as mine were.
What makes you think that this particular group of words is so spectacular?
There is no mystery, unless you believe the Qu'ran.
In other words unless you are a Muslim!
You can't use the Qu'ran to prove the Qu'ran any more than the Bible can be used to prove the Bible.
And just while I'm here, what the F*** is "the abundance"?

 

[FearGod]

Why would I?
It is a nonsensical group of words, just as mine were.
What makes you think that this particular group of words is so spectacular?
There is no mystery, unless you believe the Qu'ran.
In other words unless you are a Muslim!
You can't use the Qu'ran to prove the Qu'ran any more than the Bible can be used to prove the Bible.
And just while I'm here, what the F*** is "the abundance"?

One of the abundance is over 1.6 billions of lovers to prophet mohamed pbuh,
How many person in this world loves you aside from your father and mother,
and how many will be loving you after 1400 years of your death,
will your lovers be abundance ???? i hope so

What is your next question ?

 

[beerisit]

What was it he gave? Or did he give himself believers as you say? What is the "abundance" again?
Sorry, I didn't realize that Allah had dided 1400yrs ago. My condolences.

 

[FearGod]

What was it he gave? Or did he give himself believers as you say? What is the "abundance" again?
Sorry, I didn't realize that Allah had dided 1400yrs ago. My condolences.

What is your next question ?

 

[beerisit]

What is your next question ?

I gave you three. I also gave you condolences for the death of Allah you announced to us.

 

[FearGod]

I gave you three. I also gave you condolences for the death of Allah you announced to us.

it seems that you have nill knowledge about that surah which is talking about the
prophet Mohammed pbuh and not about god.

So you have nothing to do but just kidding,condolences cant be said for god,because
god never die,but condolences will be for people like me and you when we will die.

 

[beerisit]

The OP asks What Evidence? You and other Muslims have provided not one scrap of evidence, but you continue to present your unfounded beliefs as evidence. The "Great Smallest Chapter", when presented to the world is just meaningless drivel. If that is proof that the book is from Allah then he fails miserably. I'm sorry if you can't see that, but it's true.

 

[Gharib]

The OP asks What Evidence? You and other Muslims have provided not one scrap of evidence, but you continue to present your unfounded beliefs as evidence. The "Great Smallest Chapter", when presented to the world is just meaningless drivel. If that is proof that the book is from Allah then he fails miserably. I'm sorry if you can't see that, but it's true.

So why do you persist with your replies which have basically the same meaning as above?

No proof? OK, move on.