• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

What is the evidence for and against the validity of astrology

ppp

ppp

Well-Known Member
soulsurvivor said:
There is really no way to tell who is right. You just have to trust your own personal experience and also try to judge someone else's statements/experience by their logic and plausibility..
Click to expand...
You are not trusting to you experiences. You are trusting your interpretation of you experiences. Most likely an in interpretation molded by the baseless interpretation of others.
soulsurvivor said:
If someone gives you an exact date then it is very likely wrong,
Click to expand...
If I meant only exact dates, I would have said only exact dates. Your hedging on most likelies is no different than the millions of other most likelies that have proceeded you.
 
joelr

joelr

Well-Known Member
soulsurvivor said:
I did not realize you are an atheist! I thought you believed in at least one God. So this has been a waste of time. There is no point in talking about supernatural stuff with an atheist. They are pretty fanatical in their disbelief and no argument can change that.
Click to expand...
Of course an argument can change that. I don't believe things on emotions or because it's fun or I want it to be true. In fact when I began to understand critical thinking and skepticism I had to let go of several beliefs that was difficult.
All I need is reasonable evidence for something supernatural. I always ask but never get it., Just fallacies, conformation bias and so on.
It can be hard to talk about supernatural stuff with a believer because they sometimes won't allow for reasonable discussion.

soulsurvivor said:
It is impossible to 'prove' the existence of any God. They designed the world that way. The only way to know, is through personal experience, so you will just have to wait till the appearance of the Christ. Even then you will probably say he is a charlatan or a magician (if he performs some miracle).
Actually I expect it to be sooner than 2 years. The 2000+ years are up, the division of humanity into goats and sheep according to the criteria specified in Matthew 25:31-46 is obvious to see. All the signs are there.
Click to expand...
Right but my girlfriend is Islam claimed she had personal experience with Allah. He told her she was in the correct religion, the only true religion. She felt his communication emotionally and had no doubt it was true.
My gf in Hinduism had personal experiences with Lord Krishna. He communicated with emotion and she knew her religion was the correct religion. She felt his love and guidance.
Same with some Christian friends. Obviously they cannot all be correct. In fact they can all be wrong. It can be a psychological phenomenon. I also had it when I was a Christian.
I do not find evidence that this is anything except brain states.


soulsurvivor said:
But you are right, it could be much more then 2 years. The 2160 years between Avatars is pretty approximate. But I don't need an excuse if it does not happen that soon, I just need patience. I don't need to convince anybody or give them excuses.
Click to expand...

The apoclypse folks have been saying this for 2 thousand years. If you can ignore those facts or believe you are special and have knowledge none of the others did then that is your right. I would ask for evidence.


soulsurvivor said:
I am afraid there is no point in discussing God or astrology any further with an atheist. But if you have any questions (other than asking for evidence), I don't mind answering them. But I do want to leave you with one thought - I expect many atheists (as well as fundamentalist believers) to commit suicide when the Christ returns - being so wrong, for so long will be just too much to bear for them. They are totally invested in their belief or disbelief. But it is OK to be wrong, the Gods do not care whether you believe or not. So you have not lost anything. Meanwhile just keep an open mind, so you are not too shocked or devastated.
Click to expand...
Personally I would be happy to see evidence of an afterlife. Because heavens and souls are a total myth without a shred of evidence. Why would I care if a mythical person showed up enough to commit suicide? If Zeus showed up would you commit suicide? If Krishna showed up would you commit suicide? If Gandolf showed up? No? You don't think about those things because they are myths.
I am not "totally invested" in my disbelief? Are you "totally invested" in not believing in Innana or Ashera? No, you know they are just stories. Jesus is also from a story.
Are you keeping an open mind about every other God? Thor? Probably not because it's fiction and you know it. I also know Jesus is fiction.

No Jesus will be showing up but if one did I would probably consider that it might be aliens with far superior science and could appear as anything or do what to us looks like magic.
If real Jesus showed up I would have no interest in associating with a God that sends people to hell, destroys cities, allows slaves, wants blood sacrifice or Jesus who expects non-believers to go to hell but then appears during a time dying/rising savior demigods are already really popular in religions, leaving behind stories that look like myths, use older mythology, have no actual evidence and expects people to believe that?
It would be like if Thor showed up and was pissed we were not worshipping him? It's like hey Thor, your religion looks like an old myth.
Islam started, was killing Christians all over, enticed billions of people and this God can't show up and set things straight? But he's still coming eventually (right). An actual God who wanted interaction would appear to every human (god of the Israelites? a small tribe?), could speak to all humans in their minds, make a world culture, appear to everyone, give some technology. So all cultures record this at the same time. All cultures record the sun going out on a certain day. All cultures write down actual God messages (not graven images rules). If a God was real. But there is no evidence for that either.

Interesting that the one question you cannot answer is about evidence.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
soulsurvivor said:
Good for you, always nice to have your prayers answered. But perhaps we should question a 'God' who kills 70000 people because someone conducted a census?
Click to expand...

I believe decisions have consequences. Putin decided to invade Ukraine and the result is that thousands will die.
 
ppp

ppp

Well-Known Member
Muffled said:
I believe decisions have consequences. Putin decided to invade Ukraine and the result is that thousands will die.
Click to expand...
Only the decisions that favor your beliefs. When said consequences are the direct product of your alleged god's decisions, you go to a great contortions to blame anyone else. Everyone else.
 
Sheldon

Sheldon

Veteran Member
Policy said:
Only the decisions that favor your beliefs. When said consequences are the direct product of your alleged god's decisions, you go to a great contortions to blame anyone else. Everyone else.
Click to expand...
Yes indeed, the selection bias leaped out at me as well. I'm waiting patiently for a post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy, as these are bread and butter for those claiming they have had a prayer answered.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ppp
Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Sheldon said:
Yes indeed, the selection bias leaped out at me as well. I'm waiting patiently for a post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy, as these are bread and butter for those claiming they have had a prayer answered.
Click to expand...
What!? You deny astrology now. That sounds so much like a Libra:rolleyes:
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
Policy said:
Only the decisions that favor your beliefs. When said consequences are the direct product of your alleged god's decisions, you go to a great contortions to blame anyone else. Everyone else.
Click to expand...

I believe that makes sense. God is good so all that He does is good. As Jesus said you can't get fruit from a thorn tree but a good tree will produce good fruit.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
Subduction Zone said:
What!? You deny astrology now. That sounds so much like a Libra:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

I believe a Libra weighs all the evidence but I find an unbalanced outlook that I would not expect from a Libra, Maybe his Mercury is in a border sign like Virgo which is more simplistic and sees things in black and white.
 
Subduction Zone

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Muffled said:
I believe a Libra weighs all the evidence but I find an unbalanced outlook that I would not expect from a Libra, Maybe his Mercury is in a border sign like Virgo which is more simplistic and sees things in black and white.
Click to expand...
It was a joke. The ascribed tendencies of having various signs are just nonsense that are not supported by reality.
 
Sheldon

Sheldon

Veteran Member
Muffled said:
As Jesus said you can't get fruit from a thorn tree but a good tree will produce good fruit.
Click to expand...

Many bushes and trees that have thorns produce good fruit? Also we can't know if anything assigned to Jesus was actually said by him, since not one word was written about him until decades after the alleged events. There are no contemporary accounts, so I'd be inclined to take such biblical claims with a pinch of salt.
 
joelr

joelr

Well-Known Member
Muffled said:
I believe so in general. For instance it was easy to see the Capricorn in Jesus because He was despised and rejected, a man of sorrows and grief Isa. 53:3.
Click to expand...

You don't think that people born in any month can be despised and rejected and have sorrow and grief? Kind of a universal thing during everyones life at some point?
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
Policy said:
Your belief that God is good is completely arbitrary and self-serving.
Click to expand...

I believe i did not invent the idea. It comes from the Bible. Of course it is self serving. Why would anyone want a bad god. Would you choose the devil? Do you think tormenting people is great?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top