What makes you think Islam is a false religion?

[gnostic]

False. That's your own fabrication. Do you have a proof for this? I'm sure you don't.

Here is my own proof from the Quran that they were REAL ants, and REAL birds.

[16] And Sulaiman was Dawud's heir. He said: "O ye people! we have been taught the speech of birds, and on us has been bestowed (a little) of all things: this is indeed Grace manifest (from Allah.)"

[17] And before Sulaiman were marshalled his hosts, of Jinns and men and birds, and they were all kept in order and ranks.


[18] At length, when they came to a (lowly) valley of ants, one of the ants said: "O ye ants, get into your habitations, lest Sulaiman and his hosts crush you (under foot) without knowing it."

[19] So he smiled, amused at its speech; and he said: "O my Lord! so order me that I may be grateful for Thy favours, which Thou hast bestowed on me and on my parents, and that I may work the righteousness that will please Thee: and admit me, by Thy Grace, to the ranks of Thy righteous Servants." (Quran 27:16-19)

This is why I don't believe in the Qur'an.

It sounds nothing more than folklore or fairytale.

It is the same reason why I can't accept the bible too. The Creation, Adam and the Fruit, the Flood, Moses parting the Red Sea or Jesus' resurrection.

But the expansion of the biblical story according to Qur'an like the stories of the fall of Satan or that of Solomon make even more unrealistic.

If you believe in the such stories as given in the scriptures with all the supernaturals, then what make Islam better or believable than the pagan polytheistic religions of Egypt, Mesopotamia or Greece?

 

[TashaN]

This is why I don't believe in the Qur'an.

It sounds nothing more than folklore or fairytale.

It is the same reason why I can't accept the bible too. The Creation, Adam and the Fruit, the Flood, Moses parting the Red Sea or Jesus' resurrection.

But the expansion of the biblical story according to Qur'an like the stories of the fall of Satan or that of Solomon make even more unrealistic.

If you believe in the such stories as given in the scriptures with all the supernaturals, then what make Islam better or believable than the pagan polytheistic religions of Egypt, Mesopotamia or Greece?

If you don't understand the meaning of God in the first place, then i don't blame you if you didn't believe. You still fail to understand that God, the Creator, is not like human beings.

 

[UnityNow101]

If you don't understand the meaning of God in the first place, then i don't blame you if you didn't believe. You still fail to understand that God, the Creator, is not like human beings.

Without the book, you would know nothing of "god" either. How do we know that "god" is not like human beings? The book says so. How can we know and understand how "god" works? The book tells us the intricate details about him and his works within the world. How would you imagine "god" to be without the books and ideas regarding his nature? You wouldn't share the same ideas which are confined to the pages of the book, would you? The book tells you what "god" is. Without the book, you will see that he is nowhere to be found...

 

[gnostic]

If you don't understand the meaning of God in the first place, then i don't blame you if you didn't believe. You still fail to understand that God, the Creator, is not like human beings.

TashaN. It is not God or Creator that I don't understand. It is "human beings" that I don't understand.

If you look at the world as it is, you can nature at work. You can also see human ingenuity in designing and constructing things that work for them, like cars, ships and planes, as examples.

But in the case of book that speak of supernatural things, humans will believe anything and everything that don't happen that way in nature or of human-made constructs (eg. mechanical, electrical).

You have a king, who is only wise in the bible, but in the Qur'an can speaks in and under the languages of ants and birds, and commanding ants to walk in file or rank, seemed implausible as a children story book.

You believe in jinns to be real, don't you? Beings made out of fire or smoke, but can take human form (I mean in the shapes of human)? Have you seen a jinn? Have anyone you know ever seen a real jinn? I certainly have seen no such beings. And the only one I know of, comes from your Qur'an and some Arab/Persian folklore.

Some Jews wrote of creature, like golems and dybbuks, in their folklore, but no Jews today in their right minds would take such things seriously.

I know that you don't everything that you read seriously, so how do you expect me to believe everything that are found in the Qur'an. If you think I should believe in god, angels, demons and jinns, then I might as well as believe in fairies, vampires, ghouls and goblins.

 

[TashaN]

Without the book, you would know nothing of "god" either. How do we know that "god" is not like human beings? The book says so. How can we know and understand how "god" works? The book tells us the intricate details about him and his works within the world. How would you imagine "god" to be without the books and ideas regarding his nature? You wouldn't share the same ideas which are confined to the pages of the book, would you? The book tells you what "god" is. Without the book, you will see that he is nowhere to be found...

Without the book, i know that at least i'll be able to feel he is somewhere, that he exists, and i'll just have to find out more about him. With the book, i'll know excatly who is he because he is giving me all these information about him, and keep talking to me through it, like when someone sends a letter to you.

 

[Mulugbaadh]

This is my first contribution, I am Muslim and I believe Mohamed PBUH was a true prophet, but I feel that others have the right to know more about my religion. Since it has been mispresented by many, thus misunderstood.

Without being biased to Islam, I tried to perceive it from a non-Muslim viewpoint: 'Why would one reject Islam?'...To test the validity of the message, it is easier to look behind the source: The Prophet and the Holy Book.

1-Mohamed: It is fair to say that a poor man would never throw himself into the endless trouble of inviting his people to a new religion, in a very tough community, unless he is really God-sent.
There is no point whatsoever to falsely claim prophecy for nothing.

2-The Quran: In addition to the countless miracles in the Quran (which I am ready to explain God-willing)... most of the Quran includes verses where God tells about himself.
People who question the integrity of the holy Quran must ask this: Why hasn't God answered back Mohamed. (If you assume that the Quran is nothing but Mohamed's words).

I used the term 'false', in reference to those who do not believe that Mohamed was a messenger from God or that the Quran is the word of God. In other words, reject Islam and claim it is untrue.

Why would you reject Islam?

1: What does being poor has to do with God since no one would give more consideration than if he would have been wealthy? O are you hoping me to be more sympethic and say 'Oh! Poor man, he wouldn't have lied', then bingo! Come to believe all those things? Neither being sincere nor being poor does verify whether there is true to something.


2: What miracles?

 

[Mulugbaadh]

Without the book, i know that at least i'll be able to feel he is somewhere, that he exists, and i'll just have to find out more about him. With the book, i'll know excatly who is he because he is giving me all these information about him, and keep talking to me through it, like when someone sends a letter to you.

Then may you tell me his address, please?

 

[TashaN]

Then may you tell me his address, please?

Yes sure. You can find his address in the Quran. Go to Surah (chapter) 57, verse 4.

 

[Right_Path]

Without the book, you would know nothing of "god" either. How do we know that "god" is not like human beings?

Without the book, Abraham found his way to God, why? because he was eager to find the creator.

[6:74] Recall that Abraham said to his father Azar, "How could you worship statues as gods? I see that you and your people have gone far astray."

[6:75] We showed Abraham the marvels of the heavens and the earth, and blessed him with certainty:

[6:76] When the night fell, he saw a shining planet. "Maybe this is my Lord," he said. When it disappeared, he said, "I do not like (gods) that disappear."

[6:77] When he saw the moon rising, he said, "Maybe this is my Lord!" When it disappeared, he said, "Unless my Lord guides me, I will be with the strayers."

[6:78] When he saw the sun rising, he said, "This must be my Lord. This is the biggest." But when it set, he said, "O my people, I denounce your idolatry.

[6:79] "I have devoted myself absolutely to the One who initiated the heavens and the earth; I will never be an idol worshiper."

 

[Right_Path]

1: What does being poor has to do with God since no one would give more consideration than if he would have been wealthy? O are you hoping me to be more sympethic and say 'Oh! Poor man, he wouldn't have lied', then bingo! Come to believe all those things? Neither being sincere nor being poor does verify whether there is true to something.

Sympathetic! are you trying to be funny or something:areyoucra

I'll make a little simpler for you...my point was: The man could have lived like a king if he desired so, but he was never looking for personal glory...it was all about his message.

Go to this thread

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/religious-debates/70558-mohameds-will-power.html

and by the way,it is sympathetic, not sympethic

2: What miracles?

Well you can type 'miracles of the Quran' in Google.

I can open a thread for that if you are willing to listen... not just to argue

and simply, the Quran speaks for itself, an unlettered man could not have come up with such an exemplary book unless he is .

 

[Right_Path]

So maybe we should start stating/replying to allegations on seperate threads and post links here.

Thats a good idea

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/religious-debates/70558-mohameds-will-power.html

this is for you Kai and gnostic

 

[Don Penguinoini]

Nothing really. Islam seems as authentic as my religion.

 

[tariqkhwaja]

nothing really. Islam seems as authentic as my religion.

if i get the all religions are correct argument again i might hit my head on the wall.

 

[kai]

if i get the all religions are correct argument again i might hit my head on the wall.

i would advise the use of a crash helmet, you will need it!

 

[darkendless]

if i get the all religions are correct argument again i might hit my head on the wall.

How about the "all religions are false arguement?" should we start using that one again to break the cycle

 

[tariqkhwaja]

How about the "all religions are false arguement?" should we start using that one again to break the cycle

Nothing wrong with that. It is a possibility. Unlike them all being true.

 

[LuisDantas]

Greetings, Right Path. I admire those like you who have the courage to ask possibly unconfortable questions.

1-Mohamed: It is fair to say that a poor man would never throw himself into the endless trouble of inviting his people to a new religion, in a very tough community, unless he is really God-sent.
There is no point whatsoever to falsely claim prophecy for nothing.

Maybe so. But there are other possibilities. One can go through extraordinary troubles without necessarily being right. I don't think Mohammed (peace be upon him, why not?) was making false claims, in fact I doubt it. I don't think he was right either.

2-The Quran: In addition to the countless miracles in the Quran (which I am ready to explain God-willing)... most of the Quran includes verses where God tells about himself.
People who question the integrity of the holy Quran must ask this: Why hasn't God answered back Mohamed. (If you assume that the Quran is nothing but Mohamed's words).

I guess I would have to believe in the God of Abraham to expect it to happen.

I used the term 'false', in reference to those who do not believe that Mohamed was a messenger from God or that the Quran is the word of God. In other words, reject Islam and claim it is untrue.

Honest question: why should I choose between becoming a Muslim or declaring Islam "false"? I can in good faith choose not to adopt a faith and yet see worth and dignity in it. At least I hope so.

Why would you reject Islam?

In all honesty, it is more like Islam rejected me. It has no provision for atheists like me. But hey, I don't think there is anything wrong in believing in God, really. And Islam has a lot to be proud of, even if I really question some of its beliefs and choices.

 

[stacey bo bacey]

It has been repeatedly stated that religion is a choice and NOT an inheritance. As an example the many people on these forums who changed their religion over time.

That is entirely incorrect, sir. And I wish you'd quit insisting it to be true.

I was perfectly happy loving God and Jesus. Then certain things in life got me to thinking and I, reluctantly, began to ask myself questions. I had to. I couldn't deny that there were questions that needed to be asked. I didn't even want to know the answers to these questions, I just wanted to keep believing in God and Jesus. Unfortunately, I couldn't just choose to keep on doing that. My faith was cracked by rational thinking and thus, I became a nonbeliever.

Certainly not my choice. I wanted to believe but couldn't anymore.

Maybe you don't understand how to listen to your heart? When that is telling you something completely different from what your head might be telling you, you have no say in the matter.

 

[tariqkhwaja]

That is entirely incorrect, sir. And I wish you'd quit insisting it to be true.

I was perfectly happy loving God and Jesus. Then certain things in life got me to thinking and I, reluctantly, began to ask myself questions. I had to. I couldn't deny that there were questions that needed to be asked. I didn't even want to know the answers to these questions, I just wanted to keep believing in God and Jesus. Unfortunately, I couldn't just choose to keep on doing that. My faith was cracked by rational thinking and thus, I became a nonbeliever.

Certainly not my choice. I wanted to believe but couldn't anymore.

Maybe you don't understand how to listen to your heart? When that is telling you something completely different from what your head might be telling you, you have no say in the matter.

You made the choice to be honest and be rational and decided to let go of the irrationality of Christianity and decided to stop following blindly. That was without a doubt a choice and so many Christians (and so many Muslims, Jews, Hindus, etc.) fail to make that honest choice and choose the path of blind belief for "strength", "social-ties", "money", etc.

That is another thing I have stated repeatedly, by the way. The one reason I like Atheists is that considering the current state of world religions they were honest enough to throw them away. I'd like to think it was an honest mistake.

You proved my point. Religion is not an inheritance it is a choice. Unlike race or gender.

 

[stacey bo bacey]

You made the choice to be honest and be rational and decided to let go of the irrationality of Christianity and decided to stop following blindly. That was without a doubt a choice and so many Christians (and so many Muslims, Jews, Hindus, etc.) fail to make that honest choice and choose the path of blind belief for "strength", "social-ties", "money", etc.

That is another thing I have stated repeatedly, by the way. The one reason I like Atheists is that considering the current state of world religions they were honest enough to throw them away. I'd like to think it was an honest mistake.

You proved my point. Religion is not an inheritance it is a choice. Unlike race or gender.

Uh, dude. You have got it ALL wrong. There was no CHOICE to start thinking rationally and stop believing. You talk as if I actively sought this change out and welcomed it. If anything, I fought it. I was scared to death to believe there was no God. I felt like I was sinning for even thinking it.

Helllllllllo. Hi? Over here? Hi! Ok did you not read my post? I said I didn't want to stop believing. I wanted to keep believing and loving God and Jesus. But I couldn't. My ideas and my heart started to change and I had no control over that. I would have been perfectly happy loving God and Jesus the rest of my life, but the ideas presented to me with regards to atheism changed something inside me. You have no idea how much I tried to fight that and to keep believing.

If I had just kept on believing even though my heart was telling me something completely different, I would be lying to myself. My worship would have been false, a lie.

Comparison:
I don't know if you've ever been in love. Hell, I only have once. But you know that physically sickening feeling you get when you come to realize, over time, it's just not meant to be? You try to fight that because it goes against everything you want at the time. But try as you might, you can't deny what your heart is telling you: that it's over, it's not meant to be. To continue in a relationship like that would be a lie.