jasonwill2
Well-Known Member
No, I disagreed on the Big Crunch being a likely end of the Universe.
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What proof do you have of God?
- Thread starter Ashir
- Start date
No, I disagreed on the Big Crunch being a likely end of the Universe.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
You left out the word 'intent'...and used the word 'given' instead.
Either way....a Cognitive is at hand.
So which came first Spirit of substance?
No Creator?
No afterlife?
This life generates unique spirit. All for nothing as the chemistry fails?
Dust we are and dust we will be?
cbachinger
Peace in wisdom
being a spiritual athiest, my freedom is defined by my understanding that nothing is limited by Earth human's beliefs and no religious body can tell me what to do or otherwise be damned when i die. infact the day i learnt about this fact, i felt incredible enthusiasm towards the unlimited abilities in life which so many people so quickly say is 'impossible'.
god is a title of not even spiritual wisdom but Creation wisdom - the wisdom of that which created life from nothing...an ancient enigmatic pure form of spiritual energy which evolved and created on its own.
u may question "from nothing? Yes! the bible says the same thing" but in the bible i got taught that god was suddenly there...how? and when i questioned it, i got a deep stare from the catholic brother.
god is a term misused over the centuries by many power hungry people to take advantage of the masses of people unknown to the truth.
god is a title of not even spiritual wisdom but Creation wisdom - the wisdom of that which created life from nothing...an ancient enigmatic pure form of spiritual energy which evolved and created on its own.
u may question "from nothing? Yes! the bible says the same thing" but in the bible i got taught that god was suddenly there...how? and when i questioned it, i got a deep stare from the catholic brother.
god is a term misused over the centuries by many power hungry people to take advantage of the masses of people unknown to the truth.
1robin
Christian/Baptist
The absence of God is a net loss of possabilities not a gain. If you think that someone telling you that if you don't do x then y will result is invalid then all of law and society breaks down. I have found that non believers have a set of rules and axioms for religion and a completely different set for everything else. A double standard is a bad foundation to wager your soul on.
Whatever you think God is he is either personal or impersonal. If impersonal he is irrelevant if personal (all evidence suggests this) he has requirements and absolute soverignty.
The bible does not say that God came from nothing. It says God always existed. God or not it appears everything else did come from nothing including time and space. Nothing produces nothing and so God is the first uncaused cause.
True, but that exception is no reason to dismiss the great thinkers that have properly used the term and expounded on the idea.
jasonwill2
Well-Known Member
STOP! I was talking about the stastical inevitablilty of something possible happening eventually doing so, I don't know if life was intentional on God's part or an accident.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
I believe life is dealt...on purpose.
The scheme of things is obvious enough.
The human form produces unique perspective, by linear existence.
We then die.
The soul dies as well?...I think not.
God then has someone to talk to.
confused453
Active Member
If somebody names his/her kid God, then nobody would be able to debate of God's existence. 
When that kid grows up, he could name his child Jesus, and so on...
When that kid grows up, he could name his child Jesus, and so on...
jasonwill2
Well-Known Member
By that logic, that it exists so it must of been planed by god, means that everything was planned by god, making him all-knowing in a literal sense. But I don't believe that, it makes no sense to me. It makes sense to me that would know exactly what made the whole Universe tick, but maybe not that he would see every single outcome of how this played into the Cosmos such as statistically extremely unlikely scenarios of insanely complex organisms.
Hence a star and all astronomical phenomena is much more simpler than even a squirrel, even if we might describe stars in fancier mathematics, the structures of organisms are more complex with more unique chemical parts than any galaxy, which is made up of mostly a small number of ingredients.
1robin
Christian/Baptist
Actually haveing anything at all is a statistical fluke. Christian and secular scientists agree that the universe and everything in it does not go back in time infinately. It is immposible to cross an infinate set of events. That is unless you dream up a crackpot idea because you don't like the implications of reality (as in the multiverse). So at one time nothing existed. No time, no space, no matter. What are the odds that nothing produces everything. Do not appeal to quantum physics because scientists do not understand it and I doubt you do either. So to have anything is an anomaly without scientific explenation. Once we get something what are the odds that it is balanced on the necessary knife edge that is required to allow any possible life at all or even a recognizable universe. Even given our knife edge the estimated chances that life would arrise from random chance anywhere is about 1 x 10^80. 10^50 is just said to be zero and scientist don't go any further. That is the same amount of atoms in the universe. However lets say these three impossible things happen what is the chance that that very rare first life form pops on the scene with a complete system that enables reproduction. Zero. It just gets worse but this is enough. That alone makes God the best explenation. Genesis says exactly what I just did. In the beginning (time), God created the heavens (space), and Earth (matter). How did bronze age sheep herders know what modern science has only recently concluded? The implications of that conclusion are so objectionable to secular scientists that many will believe any other theory that requires far more faith than the bible does to avoid them.
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Thief
Rogue Theologian
Ahhhh....no.
The big bang could well have been spontaneous.
Induced by the Spirit...but not planned.
Once in motion the universe would be there at His touch....
But with only His own Voice in echo.
To have someone to talk to....a blend of spirit and substance.
A linear and limited perspective.
Man.
1robin
Christian/Baptist
What a meaningless waste of time. I didn't think the critics position could be drug any lower. What do you know a swan dive.
waitasec
Veteran Member
Thief
Rogue Theologian
And you wonder why God picks and chooses his prophets.
Not everyone has the proper attitude.
otokage007
Well-Known Member
The same I have bout mermaids, sauron, power rangers and Jaime Lannister.
...
Exactly, none.
1robin
Christian/Baptist
Since Christ and/or God have over 700 thousand words attesting of them in the bible plus Christ at least is mentioned in several non biblical texts and the biblical testimony meets every requirment or modern jurice prudence this inaccurate appeal to the absurd is meaningless.
waitasec
Veteran Member
apparently the "holier than thous" have the proper attitude
waitasec
Veteran Member
so what...
it can have a billion words attesting to any of it's claims.
as long as it's not verifiable, considering the level of it's outrageousness, it don't mean a thing
oh and can you clarify what several is...
1,000
or even
500 times??
or was it under 10?
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otokage007
Well-Known Member
When u type Jesus Christ on google, u can see only 191 million webpages are mentioning him.
When u type Harry Potter, u can see 439 million mention him.
So I think I won anyway.
1robin
Christian/Baptist
No you didn't there is a very big difference between a fictional claim and a non fictional claim. Trying to compare the two is an obsurd and an intellectually dishonest tactic. A fictional claim does not require, does not provide, nor has any need of justification. A lie requires no evidence. A non-fictional claim must have evidence. Faith must be founded on evidence. I will help you out a little. There is more evidence for the person of Christ than there is for any non-fictional character in ancient history. There is more textual evidence for the bible by far than for any other work of ancient history. It is a little more meaningfull to compare equal things.
As far as 191 million (anything but small numbers for one man who worked for three years, who has the highest burden of proof in history, and was killed by a small middle eastern mostly illiterate tribe 2000 years ago and when information spread very slowly and even books were rare.) verses 500 million for a pop culture character that hundreds of millions was spent on to inform the masses about, in the information age, and was displayed over the whole civilised world and had no burden of proof. Even your rediculous comparison backfires on you. Mark Twain, A lie can get half way around the world before the truth can get it's pants on. Is there anything so rediculous that it will not be appealed to in order to maintain your comfort zone?