mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
What ever.
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What really happens to you after you die...
- Thread starter dfnj
- Start date
What ever.
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
What ever.
Yes, it's good, but wouldn't fit into ______ ;-) unless written really small
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Some people already do that, but it doesn't get them very far.
It might give them a sense of satisfaction to think that they could judge God, but It can only lead to frustration since nobody can affect God in any way.
Aside from that, it is completely illogical to judge God by the same standards as God judges us, since God is nothing like a human.
McBell
Unbound
Agreed.
It is exactly as if God does not exist at all...
See above.
To bold empty claims.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
So, if God did exist what good would it do for us to judge God?
How would our judging God affect God? Why should it?
Do you think God is like a human? God doesn't exist makes more sense than that.
McBell
Unbound
So what, we are just to roll over and take it?
One entity didn't and now is the ruler of all of Gods favorites...
I think god is whatever the believer makes god into.
Which tends to make god much more like a human than say, a cat.
But perhaps that is just me...?
To me Jesus was honest and Jesus taught 'sleep' in death -John 11:11-14
So, the dead are in a deep unconscious sleep until the coming Resurrection Day (Acts 24:15)
Resurrection Day meaning Jesus' coming Millennium-Long Day governing over Earth for a thousand years
Both Jesus and the OT both teach 'sleep' (R.I.P.) in death - Psalms 6:5; 13:3; 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5
Bonus is: Resurrection Day (Acts 24:15 ) because 'there is going to be' a resurrection
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
What choice do we have? I tried judging God but it only made my life worse.
Who is that entity?
That is true in a sense since people can interpret their scriptures and use their imagination to make God into anything they want God to be....
and nobody can prove otherwise.
That is true. Many believers make God into a human by slapping human attributes onto God.
No, it's not just you.
anotherneil
Well-Known Member
I know this isn't about math, but I'm a bit of a geek for things like this: specific irrational numbers, such as pi (as in circumference divided by diameter - 3.14159...) are constants and are always exactly "the same" (mathematically speaking). I think I get what you mean; you're saying that a repeating decimal pattern for rational numbers, such as "142857" for 1/7, doesn't exist with irrational numbers.
Anyhow, I myself am not religious, so I don't subscribe to religious ideas or beliefs pertaining to an afterlife. I do consider the idea that after we die, we're "game over", "stick a fork in it" gone for eternity as a possibility, but not the only one. There seems to be other possibilities to consider.
Possibility 1: something similar or analogous to the Matrix
One is that we're in something analogous to the Matrix (as in the movies with Keanu Reeves), except that it's not necessarily a mortal human to mortal human association; what I mean by this is that in the movie, they're humans both in the matrix and outside the matrix, and they can die in the matrix or outside the matrix.
This, in a way, is distinct from playing a video game and your video game character dies, but you yourself are not mortally affected in any way as a result of your video game character dying. Imagine that instead of dying if you die in the matrix, what happens is analogous to your video game character dying but you yourself do not die.
Let's also say that in lieu of this mortal death of yourself outside the matrix as a result of your death in the matrix, you instead simply "wake up" and are now consciously aware of yourself outside the matrix; in this case imagine that you're an immortal being who was simply in a video game like system in something analogous to being asleep. In this case, the idea is that we're in a computer simulation.
Possibility 2: something similar or analogous to reincarnation
Another is sort of loosely associated or perhaps roughly analogous to the first law of thermodynamics (that's the one that says energy cannot be created or destroyed) and similar to the notion of reincarnation.
Part of what's involved in this version is the idea that time is not something that exists in the way we perceive and understand it, and that we exist in a universe where the most fundamental particles (photons, etc.) aren't traveling through spacetime, but something more like space-delta_time (by "delta_time", I mean an instantaneous change).
Think of the universe and these particles as billiards balls on a table, except there are no pockets and no friction at this level in the way there is between the balls and the table, and each other; there's also one other difference that requires a little bit of elaboration to explain - imagine that instead of the table having a perimeter wall for the balls to bounce off of, it's like a non-scrolling wrap-around 2D video game (that's where a character can leave one side of the screen and reappear on the other side, such as in Pac Man or Mario Bros).
BTW, that's not meant to imply that the donut model of the universe is what it actually is; this is merely and only for thought experiment purposes for the sake of illustrating this version.
These billiard balls are always moving around, bouncing off of each other, and present in exactly one and only one spot at any instant; there's never an instant when they disappear, and there's never an instant when they're in 2 or more different spots simultaneously.
It's difficult to describe this without getting into the weeds, but this thought experiment also ignores space-time curvature, general relativity, things orbiting each other and capturing things in orbit or releasing things from orbit, etc.
Think of us as organisms as a cluster of these billiard balls interacting in such a way that results in our manifestation, including our matter, our energy, and whatever produces the process of life & whatever forms that sentient, self-aware, 1st person POV quality that we possess (which BTW might be something connected to the process of memory, which causes us to perceive time as some sort of ongoing "road").
Since this cluster of billiards balls are not all arranged in a fixed, static, pattern such that all of the billiard balls are each in their own same "spot" (it's not like a still photo), but do have some relative movement between sub-clusters of these billiards balls, let's refer to the relationship between all these billiards balls in this overall cluster as the manifestation of a functionally cohesive pattern.
Death would be analogous to that cluster of billiard balls dispersing in such a way that results in the ending of the cohesiveness of this functionally cohesive pattern, which means the termination of our life & whatever it is that forms that sentient, self-aware, 1st person POV quality that we possess.
Suppose that a manifestation of a cluster of billiard balls forms to re-manifests that same functionally cohesive pattern to bring us back to life? One problem I don't know how to resolve about this is whether it would be the same sentient, self-aware, 1st person POV quality that we possess (in other words, would it still actually be "me"), or would it just be a separate, independent clone of me? Would it have to be the same billiard balls in the same "spots" in order for it to actually be "me" as opposed to a clone? Would it or could it somehow be a clone of me even if the same billiard balls in the same "spots" are what re-manifests?
Let's suppose it would be "me" - there are 2 ways this seems possible. One is that somehow we develop crazy advanced technology that can re-manifest us by gathering those billiard balls and clustering them to form our functionally cohesive pattern, and the other is that it re-manifests naturally.
Part of this, from a different perspective, is that if we exist now, then what's to prevent of from re-existing after we have ceased to exist? In the natural version scenario, I'm referring to something that might require trillions upon trillions upon trillions of years before we re-manifest, but guess what, we're probably not going to notice that a single second has passed, and we're not going to remember our past existence at all, in this situation.
(This concludes my description of "possibility #2")
It's possible that these sorts of thought experiments have been discussed & covered before (maybe in a published book, etc.), and if anyone happens to know of such cases or sources, I'd be interested in learning about them.
Anyhow, I myself am not religious, so I don't subscribe to religious ideas or beliefs pertaining to an afterlife. I do consider the idea that after we die, we're "game over", "stick a fork in it" gone for eternity as a possibility, but not the only one. There seems to be other possibilities to consider.
Possibility 1: something similar or analogous to the Matrix
One is that we're in something analogous to the Matrix (as in the movies with Keanu Reeves), except that it's not necessarily a mortal human to mortal human association; what I mean by this is that in the movie, they're humans both in the matrix and outside the matrix, and they can die in the matrix or outside the matrix.
This, in a way, is distinct from playing a video game and your video game character dies, but you yourself are not mortally affected in any way as a result of your video game character dying. Imagine that instead of dying if you die in the matrix, what happens is analogous to your video game character dying but you yourself do not die.
Let's also say that in lieu of this mortal death of yourself outside the matrix as a result of your death in the matrix, you instead simply "wake up" and are now consciously aware of yourself outside the matrix; in this case imagine that you're an immortal being who was simply in a video game like system in something analogous to being asleep. In this case, the idea is that we're in a computer simulation.
Possibility 2: something similar or analogous to reincarnation
Another is sort of loosely associated or perhaps roughly analogous to the first law of thermodynamics (that's the one that says energy cannot be created or destroyed) and similar to the notion of reincarnation.
Part of what's involved in this version is the idea that time is not something that exists in the way we perceive and understand it, and that we exist in a universe where the most fundamental particles (photons, etc.) aren't traveling through spacetime, but something more like space-delta_time (by "delta_time", I mean an instantaneous change).
Think of the universe and these particles as billiards balls on a table, except there are no pockets and no friction at this level in the way there is between the balls and the table, and each other; there's also one other difference that requires a little bit of elaboration to explain - imagine that instead of the table having a perimeter wall for the balls to bounce off of, it's like a non-scrolling wrap-around 2D video game (that's where a character can leave one side of the screen and reappear on the other side, such as in Pac Man or Mario Bros).
BTW, that's not meant to imply that the donut model of the universe is what it actually is; this is merely and only for thought experiment purposes for the sake of illustrating this version.
These billiard balls are always moving around, bouncing off of each other, and present in exactly one and only one spot at any instant; there's never an instant when they disappear, and there's never an instant when they're in 2 or more different spots simultaneously.
It's difficult to describe this without getting into the weeds, but this thought experiment also ignores space-time curvature, general relativity, things orbiting each other and capturing things in orbit or releasing things from orbit, etc.
Think of us as organisms as a cluster of these billiard balls interacting in such a way that results in our manifestation, including our matter, our energy, and whatever produces the process of life & whatever forms that sentient, self-aware, 1st person POV quality that we possess (which BTW might be something connected to the process of memory, which causes us to perceive time as some sort of ongoing "road").
Since this cluster of billiards balls are not all arranged in a fixed, static, pattern such that all of the billiard balls are each in their own same "spot" (it's not like a still photo), but do have some relative movement between sub-clusters of these billiards balls, let's refer to the relationship between all these billiards balls in this overall cluster as the manifestation of a functionally cohesive pattern.
Death would be analogous to that cluster of billiard balls dispersing in such a way that results in the ending of the cohesiveness of this functionally cohesive pattern, which means the termination of our life & whatever it is that forms that sentient, self-aware, 1st person POV quality that we possess.
Suppose that a manifestation of a cluster of billiard balls forms to re-manifests that same functionally cohesive pattern to bring us back to life? One problem I don't know how to resolve about this is whether it would be the same sentient, self-aware, 1st person POV quality that we possess (in other words, would it still actually be "me"), or would it just be a separate, independent clone of me? Would it have to be the same billiard balls in the same "spots" in order for it to actually be "me" as opposed to a clone? Would it or could it somehow be a clone of me even if the same billiard balls in the same "spots" are what re-manifests?
Let's suppose it would be "me" - there are 2 ways this seems possible. One is that somehow we develop crazy advanced technology that can re-manifest us by gathering those billiard balls and clustering them to form our functionally cohesive pattern, and the other is that it re-manifests naturally.
Part of this, from a different perspective, is that if we exist now, then what's to prevent of from re-existing after we have ceased to exist? In the natural version scenario, I'm referring to something that might require trillions upon trillions upon trillions of years before we re-manifest, but guess what, we're probably not going to notice that a single second has passed, and we're not going to remember our past existence at all, in this situation.
(This concludes my description of "possibility #2")
It's possible that these sorts of thought experiments have been discussed & covered before (maybe in a published book, etc.), and if anyone happens to know of such cases or sources, I'd be interested in learning about them.
Or, that God causes to become whatever is needed to fulfill His purpose
So, God can choose to become what He chooses to become: example Creator and Savior
God has wisdom, God has justice, God has mercy, and God "IS" love
Since we are created in His image or likeness then we can display such godly qualities or attributes to varying degrees
Are you saying you get omnipotent powers when you turn away from the light? So when you turn towards the light, you get nothing? Very strange!
Madsaac
Active Member
I think the closest thing to knowing what it's like to be dead is being under a general anaesthetic.
And, you experience and feel nothing and time stops, so death will probably be like that for eternity.
You won't even know your dead, no brain activity, nothing.
And, you experience and feel nothing and time stops, so death will probably be like that for eternity.
You won't even know your dead, no brain activity, nothing.
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Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
If it is for eternity , then you wouldn't even be alive here right now.
QuestioningMind
Well-Known Member
I agree that all of the evidence suggests that our state of existence after death will be the same as it was before birth, but to say that I know for certain that this will be the case would be dishonest of me.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I believe there is a life after death but to say that I know for certain that this will be the case would be dishonest of me.
Nobody can know for certain what happens after the physical body dies, except those who have died.
QuestioningMind
Well-Known Member
You simply hope that the book you've chosen to put your faith in is true... that's not knowledge.
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.... and the more 'know knowledge' we learn all adds up to the faith Jesus had that Scripture is: religious truth - John 17:17
Jesus forewarned us that MANY would come in his name but prove false - Matthew 7:21-23
The Bible is unique with its many corresponding or parallel cross-reference verses and passages among the many Bible writers
Bible light (education) grows brighter and brighter over the passing of time - Proverbs 4:18; Daniel 12:9,12
Bible faith is Not credulity (blind faith) but like Jesus who used logical reasoning on the Scriptures as the basis for his teachings
Jesus who knew more knowledge about his faith, his beliefs, than anyone else
Thus, Jesus did more than hope the book (aka Holy scriptures) is religious truth
QuestioningMind
Well-Known Member
Your faith that Jesus did more than just hope is not knowledge.